[InsaneLoony]

Look at the heels they have and how they book them. Now I'm not a fan of how HHH had runs through 2003/2004 where he dominated guys and virtually put no-one over through his own political advantages, but look at how he was as a heel and how he was a legit bad ass. On his own, he could get the job done even if he was with a stable or spent most of his time with stables. When it came to those matches where he was 1 on 1, he would still win them without having to get disqualified or counted out. Such as his matches with HBK, Kevin Nash etc (Have to admit tho, Raw was pretty damn boring for those years but only because the only talent he had to go against was the likes of Steiner/Nash when really he should have put guys like Kane and RVD over instead.

Then look at how they buid heels nowadays, MIZ didn't win any of his matches clean in his reign, Daniel Bryan won most his matches during his reign in the same way. Its been a long time, since WWE have had a legit badass that gets the job done. The way mark henry was booked last year in his title reign, is how you should correctly book certain heels (monsters) They need more heels like that, not cowardly ones like Bryan, Miz, Del Rio etc.
WWE needs to realise that not every heel at a main event level has to be a coward.
I want guys like ziggler to be pushed but guys like him and rhodes (alot down to their build as smaller guys) would just simply become coward main eventers which makes me think whats the point.

[rickjames]

(Original post by Kenan and Kel)
Possibly the best part of Mania

(Original post by TheMagicRat)
He was also brilliant at selling moves at Elimination Chamber when he was getting thrown all over the place. As much as I love what he does I do fear that he will get seriously hurt one of these days.

His latest sell on Raw, that headbut from Brodus Clay.

I love Dolph, he'l be a big star very soon. Punk Dolph Bryan Jericho would be a great survivor series fatal fourway, perhaps with Dolph turning face.

[Kenan and Kel]

(Original post by rickjames)
His latest sell on Raw, that headbut from Brodus Clay.

I love Dolph, he'l be a big star very soon. Punk Dolph Bryan Jericho would be a great survivor series fatal fourway, perhaps with Dolph turning face.

[Gridiron-Gangster]

All this Wrestlemania hype et al has got me thinking. Who would you rank as the top 20 wrestlers of all time? I was procrastinating again so I thought I'd draw my own plist of my personal top 20. See if you agree with my picks and tell me if you do or if you don't (and why) and perhaps offer your own rankings.

Here it goes.

The top 20 pro wrestlers of all time according to Gridiron-Gangster:

1) Joint between Hulk Hogan/The Rock
2) The Undertaker
3) Bret 'The Hitman' Hart
4) Shawn Michaels
5)Stone Cold Steve Austin
6) Ric Flair/Sting joint
7) Triple H
8) Macho Man Randy Savage
9)Mick Foley
10) Bill Goldberg
11) Adam Copeland aka Edge
12) Eddie Guererro
13) John Cena
14) Chris Jericho
15) Andre the Giant
16) Brun Samartino (google him)
17) Rey Mysterio Jr
18) Kevin Nash
19) Iron Sheik
20) Ultimate Warrior

Those who just missed out: British Bulldog, Ricky the Dragon Steamboat, Jimmy Superfly Snuka, Curt Henning, Million Dollar Man Ted Dibiase, Gorgeous George, Classy Freddie Blassie, Rowdy Roddy Piper, Psycho Sid/Sid Justice/Sid Viscious, Ron Simmons, Chris Benoit (yeah I would rank him).

[IanDangerously]

(Original post by Gridiron-Gangster)
All this Wrestlemania hype et al has got me thinking. Who would you rank as the top 20 wrestlers of all time? I was procrastinating again so I thought I'd draw my own plist of my personal top 20. See if you agree with my picks and tell me if you do or if you don't (and why) and perhaps offer your own rankings.

Here it goes.

The top 20 pro wrestlers of all time according to Gridiron-Gangster:

1) Joint between Hulk Hogan/The Rock
2) The Undertaker
3) Bret 'The Hitman' Hart
4) Shawn Michaels
5)Stone Cold Steve Austin
6) Ric Flair/Sting joint
7) Triple H
8) Macho Man Randy Savage
9)Mick Foley
10) Bill Goldberg
11) Adam Copeland aka Edge
12) Eddie Guererro
13) John Cena
14) Chris Jericho
15) Andre the Giant
16) Brun Samartino (google him)
17) Rey Mysterio Jr
18) Kevin Nash
19) Iron Sheik
20) Ultimate Warrior

Those who just missed out: British Bulldog, Ricky the Dragon Steamboat, Jimmy Superfly Snuka, Curt Henning, Million Dollar Man Ted Dibiase, Gorgeous George, Classy Freddie Blassie, Rowdy Roddy Piper, Psycho Sid/Sid Justice/Sid Viscious, Ron Simmons, Chris Benoit (yeah I would rank him).

It's really hard to make just one list I think, I could kinda break my favourites down into those that are just great wrestlers and those that are the most entertaining. I'll try and combine them though! This will take some thinking about.

Here's the 20 best that I've seen. Not necessarily the biggest draws with the mainstream audience (eg Hogan isn't on the list because I find him very dull):

1) Stone Cold Steve Austin
2) The Rock
3) The 4 Horsemen
4) Shawn Michaels
5) The Undertaker
6) Mankind
7) Terry Funk
8) Chris Jericho
9) Sabu
10) The Road Warriors
11) Dusty Rhodes
12) Edge
13) Triple H
14) Ricky Steamboat
15) The Great Muta
16) Brian Pillman
17) Vader
18) Eddie Guerrero Jr.
19) Roddy Piper
20) Mr Perfect

[IanDangerously]

The big news today: Impact Wrestling has been renewed until October 2014 by MTV Networks.

[Cheese_Monster]

Anyone else think that in recent years Raw seems have to have a disproportionate amount of more talented superstars and storylines and their show seems to always be the headline at Wrestlemania?

[IanDangerously]

(Original post by Cheese_Monster)
Anyone else think that in recent years Raw seems have to have a disproportionate amount of more talented superstars and storylines and their show seems to always be the headline at Wrestlemania?

Absolutely, and it should. Raw is the flagship of World Wrestling Entertainment, it draws 5 million viewers on average every week and it's live. Smackdown is a secondary show with about half the audience.

A lot of the times SmackDown is actually the better wrestling show though because Vince doesn't interfere with it the way he does with Raw. The top level of WWE management don't give two ****s about Smackdown as long as it maintains its audience and because of that at times we've seen a great product over there.

[PJ07]

I really want to see Brock Lesnar v Dolph Ziggler

Dam imagine how Ziggler would sell the belly to belly and the F5!

[nonotrly]

I want to see Brock Lesnar vs Little Bastard.

Not Hornswoggle. Little Bastard.

I would pay. With money.

[VQG]

(Original post by IanDangerously)
Absolutely, and it should. Raw is the flagship of World Wrestling Entertainment, it draws 5 million viewers on average every week and it's live. Smackdown is a secondary show with about half the audience.

A lot of the times SmackDown is actually the better wrestling show though because Vince doesn't interfere with it the way he does with Raw. The top level of WWE management don't give two ****s about Smackdown as long as it maintains its audience and because of that at times we've seen a great product over there.

It was probably around 2002-2003 when Smackdown actually became the better show - Lesnar and Angle even main-evented Wrestlemania. Raw at that time was quite boring and repetitive with the same people at the top, just Triple H.

While Smackdown had Lesnar, Angle, Taker, Big Show, Eddie Guerrero and Benoit for consistent good matches.

[nonotrly]

(Original post by VQG)
While Smackdown had Lesnar, Angle, Taker, Big Show, Eddie Guerrero and Benoit for consistent good matches.

Can't believe I just read 'Big Show' in the same sentence as 'Angle' and 'Benoit'.

[PJ07]

Fave Five Currently

1) Jericho! Y2GOAT
2) D-Bryan! YES!!!! YES!!!! YESSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!
3) Sheamus
4) CM PUNK
5) Christian

honourable mention to Johnny Ace! MR. EXCITEMENT!

[PJ07]

[TheMagicRat]

(Original post by Gridiron-Gangster)
1) Joint between Hulk Hogan/The Rock
2) The Undertaker
3) Bret 'The Hitman' Hart
4) Shawn Michaels
5)Stone Cold Steve Austin
6) Ric Flair/Sting joint
7) Triple H
8) Macho Man Randy Savage
9)Mick Foley
10) Bill Goldberg
11) Adam Copeland aka Edge
12) Eddie Guererro
13) John Cena
14) Chris Jericho
15) Andre the Giant
16) Brun Samartino (google him)
17) Rey Mysterio Jr
18) Kevin Nash
19) Iron Sheik
20) Ultimate Warrior

Those who just missed out: British Bulldog, Ricky the Dragon Steamboat, Jimmy Superfly Snuka, Curt Henning, Million Dollar Man Ted Dibiase, Gorgeous George, Classy Freddie Blassie, Rowdy Roddy Piper, Psycho Sid/Sid Justice/Sid Viscious, Ron Simmons, Chris Benoit (yeah I would rank him).

(Original post by IanDangerously)
1) Stone Cold Steve Austin
2) The Rock
3) The 4 Horsemen
4) Shawn Michaels
5) The Undertaker
6) Mankind
7) Terry Funk
8) Chris Jericho
9) Sabu
10) The Road Warriors
11) Dusty Rhodes
12) Edge
13) Triple H
14) Ricky Steamboat
15) The Great Muta
16) Brian Pillman
17) Vader
18) Eddie Guerrero Jr.
19) Roddy Piper
20) Mr Perfect

Can't believe Angle or Benoit aren't included in either of your lists. Both of them would probably be in my top 5.

If I have the time later, and if I remember, I may come up with a list of my own.

[VQG]

(Original post by nonotrly)
Can't believe I just read 'Big Show' in the same sentence as 'Angle' and 'Benoit'.

Well he did put up some pretty impressive shows against Lesnar and Angle - I thought his matches with them was one of the bigger draws in the WWE then.

[Cheese_Monster]

(Original post by IanDangerously)
Absolutely, and it should. Raw is the flagship of World Wrestling Entertainment, it draws 5 million viewers on average every week and it's live. Smackdown is a secondary show with about half the audience.

A lot of the times SmackDown is actually the better wrestling show though because Vince doesn't interfere with it the way he does with Raw. The top level of WWE management don't give two ****s about Smackdown as long as it maintains its audience and because of that at times we've seen a great product over there.

Good point, but I think they could develop Smackdown or give it a bit more hype and publicity. I find the storylines to very mundane and at the past Wrestlemania, no one cared about any of their headline wrestlers. I like Sheamus, but his match with Daniel Bryan was over as soon as it began. A good spin but it epitomised the lack of attentiveness for Smackdown. (I'm hoping here that Sheamus and Daniel Bryan are on Smackdown haha).

Then again, I think the whole 'brand' issue is being phased out, there's no longer as much rigidity over superstars being on a certain brand which is a good move.

About Vince McMahon, is he still actively involved or has he taken a back seat?

[PJ07]

(Original post by VQG)
Well he did put up some pretty impressive shows against Lesnar and Angle - I thought his matches with them was one of the bigger draws in the WWE then.

Big Show was alright in his earlier years. Last 5-6 though he's been pretty awful in my opinion, a few food moments for sure but overall I've not been that impressed.

I'm loving Mark Henry though, pure hilarious and an absolute beast.

Hope he gets another dominant run.

MARK HENRY = RATINGS!! WWWYKI

[IanDangerously]

(Original post by VQG)
It was probably around 2002-2003 when Smackdown actually became the better show - Lesnar and Angle even main-evented Wrestlemania. Raw at that time was quite boring and repetitive with the same people at the top, just Triple H.

While Smackdown had Lesnar, Angle, Taker, Big Show, Eddie Guerrero and Benoit for consistent good matches.

Yeah Smackdown was great then, it's had other periods where its been really good as well though. A lot of the time its been like WCW where the stuff on top sucked but the midcard had some excellent matches. Guys like Booker, Finlay, Regal, Matt Hardy, MVP, London and Kendrick and Shelton Benjamin propped the brand up with excellent matches.

(Original post by TheMagicRat)
Can't believe Angle or Benoit aren't included in either of your lists. Both of them would probably be in my top 5.

If I have the time later, and if I remember, I may come up with a list of my own.

I would include them, I just forgot about them! This is why I hate making these kind of lists, I always overlook people.

[IanDangerously]

(Original post by Cheese_Monster)
Good point, but I think they could develop Smackdown or give it a bit more hype and publicity. I find the storylines to very mundane and at the past Wrestlemania, no one cared about any of their headline wrestlers. I like Sheamus, but his match with Daniel Bryan was over as soon as it began. A good spin but it epitomised the lack of attentiveness for Smackdown. (I'm hoping here that Sheamus and Daniel Bryan are on Smackdown haha).

Then again, I think the whole 'brand' issue is being phased out, there's no longer as much rigidity over superstars being on a certain brand which is a good move.

About Vince McMahon, is he still actively involved or has he taken a back seat?

Their idea of giving Smackdown more hype is putting their wrestlers on the RAW Supershow on Mondays, but it really isnt translating into viewers for Smackdown. They do a few live specials and the ratings go up but its still nothing like Raw. I think after years of telling people Smackdown is an inferior show (without directly saying it) they've just made us all think that way.

I'm actually glad the brand split is being more officially phased out because it's been like that for years anyway. Even back as far as 2006 you had Raw's John Cena headlining Smackdown pay-per-views and guys would just randomly show up on the other show for no reason.

Vince is still very much involved in the creative process and that's part of the problem. I think the writers there are writing stuff they know will please him, not the audience.