Should the Armed Forces be glorified? Are they really heroes?

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If there's anything obvious about the public reaction the Woolwich attack, it's how loved and admired the Armed Forces are. People in their droves posting "I can't believe they did that to our soldier!!" etc.

I've seen the issue debated quite a little, and I find it pretty interesting, especially in regards to the legality of the soldiers fighting in the Iraq War.

And I saved this post from TSR, I'm not sure how credible it is but it's quite an insight:

If you want further insight on the topic:
http://harrypaterson.co.uk/politics-current-affairs/soldiers-are-not-heroes

What do you think?

Please note: This thread is exclusive to the current Armed Forces and their current use.

To answer your questions:

No they should not be glorified, and not everyone is a hero.

They should be respected in the same way you would respect a firefighter or a paramedic based on your level of approval for the job. But that is it, it is just a job that they do. It's a career, not a shot for glory or high praise from the general public. If they wanted that they'd go on Britain's Got Talent or something!

Agencies like the Sun with ridiculous concepts like the 'Millies' and using the words 'hero' and 'our boys' all the time cheapens these terms to the point where these sort of threads appear and people's opinions change.

Just let them get on with their lives and maybe spare a thought when someone is killed.

A policeman who single handedly stops a gang of armed robbers, or a fireman who runs back into a burning building to save a family: those people are heroes because they risked everything to save or help others with no regard for their own wellbeing. It just so happens that soldiers are given plenty of opportunities to demonstrate these qualities in the current climate.

(edited 10 years ago)

Reply 41

R3cognize

No I don't think they're heroes. I believe the Armed Forces have become such a commercialised entity that they're almost immuned from criticism. Patriotism is a primary reason for this; give anyone a flag and they'll be happy to wave it.

Reply 42

cl_steele

I have the uptmost respect for soldiers and what they do, you cant blaim them for what theyre ordered to do... you can blaim whitehall for that they do a job few others would dare to do they put their lives on the line for their country [of course not all of them do some just want to shoot people or get relatively easy money] but regardless of motives for joining they should be respected none the less.

Reply 43

the mezzil

Original post by Chlorophile

I absolutely agree with you. There is nothing 'honourable' about being trained to murder. People in the army aren't 'protecting' us, they're protecting Britain's (or rather, America's) foreign interests. I have very little respect for anybody who goes into the Army - just because a job is dangerous doesn't mean it's respectable. Above all, the military teaches people complete obedience and discipline; they're taught to follow the orders of the authority without question. I cannot understand how teaching someone to throw away their free will and will to think for themselves is impressive or commendable.

It's okay, people have very little respect for people like you too. I mean as you say, who would have respect for people who have been brainwashed into having complete obedience and discipline, such as yourself, who push hateful "Liberal" agenda. (I put "liberal" because in reality you're dirty fascist.)

You evidently have no experience of the military, or life in general, and have no understanding of international politics.

Posted from TSR Mobile

(edited 10 years ago)

Reply 44

anonstudent1

Original post by the mezzil

What on earth? What a load of nonsense this post is.
How is anything he said hateful, or promoting a fascist ideology. Whether you agree or disagree with it, this is just a pointless personal attack with no substance or addressing the points made which was that
1. he doesn't believe the army are currently protecting us, that they are simply protecting our or U.S foreign interests
2. Submitting yourself to be completely obedient is not in itself worthy of respect, nor is having a dangerous job

Original post by the mezzil

You evidently have no experience of the military, or life in general, and have no understanding of international politics.

Posted from TSR Mobile

And yes heres the typical cop out. If we don't agree with something, we just don't understand it like you do, even though you've gone no way into explaining your point of view at all.

Reply 45

CelticSymphony67

There are some people in the world who see the British Army as invading terrorists, and/or American puppets. Ask people in Iraq, Afghanistan, Zimbabwe, India, Pakistan, Ireland, what they think about the British Army. I'm in no way saying that their views are correct, but the British Army does have a very bad, bloody past (Black and Tans, The abuse of The Boers), murdering it's way around the world. Anyone who says otherwise, needs to take some history lessons.

Reply 46

cosimakarateman

they shouldn't be glorified, or vilified. I think people in general are just a bit thick and fall for newspaper headlines and campagins, armed forces are just doing a job they get paid to do just like any other nurse, binman, school teacher etc.

Reply 47

Chlorophile

Original post by the mezzil

Wow... seriously? A "dirty fascist"? I've been insulted a lot before, but never has somebody called me that.

(edited 10 years ago)

Reply 48

Drewski

Original post by CelticSymphony67

But, that is just one side of the coin.
You could find people in each of those countries who would be thankful for the presence of international troops.

Presenting the "oh we're evil" as the only side of the argument is just as naive as saying "we do nothing but good".

Reply 49

badatgow

Original post by Drewski

You could find people in each of those countries who would be thankful for the presence of international troops.

And then their families get killed by a drone strike and they're off to join the taliban.

EDIT: Be mad white people. You're frankly deluded by the media and led to believe the western presence in the middle east is "liberating" and for "freedom". The undisputable truth of the matter is you're there to achieve nothing, secure oil in the case of Iraq (an illegal war) and generally **** up the landscape more than it already was. Most of the locals don't even know what 9/11 was and they just want the foreigners to **** off. A high percentage of Afghans think they're still fighting the russians FFS. And as always, a few hundred civilians will die with no mention on the western media but when one soldier dies then it's all boohoo, what a hero, what a top spiffing chap. Truthfully he was probably looking for some cash after leaving school and decided the army was a good shout.

You always tell us pakis to "go home", why don't you do the same?

(edited 10 years ago)

Reply 50

CelticSymphony67

Original post by Drewski

I respect the boys who thought Nazism in WWII. However, I'm from a place where the British Army are not exactly popular, due to there Bullyboy tactics, and killings they were involved in.

Reply 51

Olenna Tyrell

Original post by de_monies

Well, not all of course, but I do remember reporting one soldier who'd happily "go kill Pakis" I mean I'm meant to have a corporal over to my house to make an official statement

That very statement is rather frightening in itself.

One soldier does not represent all soldiers, just like an Islamic extremist does not represent all Muslims.

Reply 52

The_Internet

Original post by Olenna Tyrell

One soldier does not represent all soldiers, just like an Islamic extremist does not represent all Muslims.

Of course not. Im sorry if I came across like that.

Reply 53

AvocatDuDiable

The word 'hero' is thrown about far too carelessly these days. You don't become a hero by joining the army (or any other branch of the armed forces). You become a hero if you actually do something heroic.

Reply 54

aari

Original post by Jacob :)

The armed forces are an extension of our country so the real question is is it right to glorify Britain.

This!
Though according to me, no country should ever be glorified.

Reply 55

MostUncivilised

Original post by Miracle Day

Interesting post. I'm a former soldier, I was in the Australian Army Reserve (though we were sometimes derided as "chocolate soldiers", melting away when it gets hot, or "weekend warriors").

I partially agree. I hate the deification of soldiers, though that is far worse in the US than it is here. What I do respect is that, particularly for soldiers who deploy to a combat zone, it is a really hard job. And it can be extremely dangerous.

It's massively to the credit of soldiers that they obey the orders of the democratically-elected government without question, in many societies throughout history soldiers simply imposed themselves on the population.

Reply 56

the mezzil

Original post by Chlorophile

Wow... seriously? A "dirty fascist"? I've been insulted a lot before, but never has somebody called me that.

Yes seriously, for that is what you are.

Posted from TSR Mobile

Reply 57

Drewski

Original post by AvocatDuDiable

The word 'hero' is thrown about far too carelessly these days. You don't become a hero by joining the army (or any other branch of the armed forces).

Or, indeed, by being an olympian or a professional footballer, rugby player or cricketer.

Reply 58

the mezzil

Original post by anonstudent1

You're equally as bad for defending a fascist. It was pure spiteful and sick hate messages against men and women who have done him/ her no wrong and you know it. Moreover, that person is grossly misinformed and quite frankly does not realise the extent to which how dangerous the world really is. Perhaps that person was not around during 9/12 or 7/7 or maybe even has so short of a memory that they cant even remember what happened at woolwich a few months ago. We need an armed forces to protect us from these terrorits, and we need the brave men and women who serve their country. They deserve respect. They do not need some sick troll whos probably on 16 years old spewing out their vile hate messages and how they dont deserve respect since they are brainwashed idiots, and just stopping short of calling them baby killers and murders.

Posted from TSR Mobile

(edited 10 years ago)

Reply 59

Drewski