Bradley Manning is a woman

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I'd have thought that she was hoping to be allowed to have whatever reassignment things she needs, and then be allowed to serve her sentence in a women's prison. There's probably an element of her having nothing to lose, so she may as well be honest with others and the world

I would have thought he/she would be very popular in a mens prison :dontknow:

Reply 61

tazarooni89

Original post by anarchism101

The law of the UK and several US states disagree with you.

The definition of a word is not a legal issue. It's just a matter of language. The meaning of a word is decided by mutual agreement amongst the users of that language.

It happens to be that, in most cases, "he" and "she" are used to refer to someone's biological sex. When deciding whether to call a newborn baby "he" or "she", usually we just look at what body parts it has, rather than conducting some sort of psychological assessment. If you just see a random person walking down the street, usually you decide whether they are a "he" or a "she" just by looking at them, without having to go and actually ask them.

Reply 62

Octohedral

Original post by Treeroy

1) I've now read that she won't actually be requesting to go to a female prison.

I can't see her lasting five minutes in a men's prison. :s-smilie:

Reply 63

anarchism101

Original post by tazarooni89

i) Not true. I'm pretty sure the vast majority of the people you refer to as 'he' or 'she' are people whose sexual organs you haven't seen to know for sure whether they're male or female. You just assume based on your perceptions. Newborn babies are the exception, not the rule.

ii) There isn't a mutual agreement on the meanings of 'he' and 'she'. If there was, we wouldn't be having this discussion.

iii) There are plenty of cases where words have 'official' meanings that differ from the commonly used meaning, and in which the commonly used meaning is considered to be wrong. For example, most people think the word 'theory' when used in a scientific context means something along the lines of 'suggestion' or 'proposed answer'. It doesn't.

Reply 64

cl_steele

either way he's going to get shived... its ironic despite the heinous crimes people have done to land themselves in jail the one thing they never take kindly to are people who're nonces or traitors to their country...

Reply 65

tazarooni89

Original post by anarchism101

Yes, I assume based on my perceptions - but my assumption is regarding their biological sex rather than their psychological state. If I say "that is a man", I'm telling you that I think they are physically male, not that I think they prefer the colour blue to the colour pink.

In most situations, checking someone's sexual organs to ascertain their sex isn't really socially acceptable. But even then, the manner in which you first decide whether someone is a "he" or a "she" is usually going to be based on their physical rather than psychological characteristics (facial features, body size and shape etc.) You always refer to people as "he" or "she" without really knowing what they're like on the inside - perhaps without even having spoken to them.

It is in fact the case of transsexual/transgender people, where people assign the labels "he" and "she" based on an inner psychological state rather than a physical state, which is the exception rather than the rule.

ii) There isn't a mutual agreement on the meanings of 'he' and 'she'. If there was, we wouldn't be having this discussion.

As I mentioned above, there is mutual agreement in pretty much all instances other than the exceptional case of transsexual/transgender people. But even in this case - while there may not be a mutual agreement amongst the English speaking population as a whole, if two people are talking to each other, if one person says "he" and it is clear what they mean by it, and the other person understand what they mean by it, then that is the meaning. The meaning of a word is whatever the speaker intends it to be (assuming that the listener and speaker are both on the same page in that particular instance).

iii) There are plenty of cases where words have 'official' meanings that differ from the commonly used meaning, and in which the commonly used meaning is considered to be wrong. For example, most people think the word 'theory' when used in a scientific context means something along the lines of 'suggestion' or 'proposed answer'. It doesn't.

The reason it doesn't is because, when a scientist says "theory" to another scientist, or publishes that word in a research paper, that's not what he means. As I said, the meaning of a word is what the speaker intends it to be. If I read such a research paper and understood the term to just mean "suggestion", then I would be wrong.

On the other hand, if a layperson is talking about science and uses the term "theory" to mean "suggestion" or "proposed answer", and his audience understands that that is the concept he is talking about, then that's what it means in that instance. If I heard this person say "theory" and I understood it as "suggestion", then I would not be wrong.

(edited 10 years ago)

Reply 66

Skip_Snip

I wonder if he'll change his name to Womanning.

Reply 67

Jacoti

Original post by anarchism101

I like this way of explaining it, nice and straightforward!

Reply 68

shadowdweller

Volunteer Section Leader

Original post by Skip_Snip

I wonder if he'll change his name to Womanning.

Punny

Posted from TSR Mobile

Reply 69

TritonSails

Original post by Treeroy

Cats are not social constructs. Genders are.

Someone gave me the same argument but with a unicorn earlier, which I found both amusing and baffling.

Except unicorns actually could actually be said to be 'social constructs' in some sense...

Reply 70

Lantanios

CIA Decided: He MUST NOT be hero !
here is the story of his life

Reply 71

Tpos4

I would guess he will get more sex in prison as a women than he did on the outside as a man

Reply 72

The Socktor

Original post by Treeroy

She/he was openly gay...

Then how did they get past don't ask, don't tell?

Reply 73

Treeroy

Original post by The Socktor

Then how did they get past don't ask, don't tell?

Because she hasn't been in the army for like 3 years... -_-
(Also, just FYI, DADT was repealed 2 years ago)

Reply 74

The Socktor

Original post by Treeroy

Because she hasn't been in the army for like 3 years... -_-
(Also, just FYI, DADT was repealed 2 years ago)

Oh... time flies then. :s-smilie:

Reply 75

WGR

Prison guard 1: "Who is this new arrival?"

Prison guard 2: "Prisoner number 5854602, Chelsea Manning sir."

Prison guard 1: "Alright, throw her in with Bubba. Next!"

Are they doing anything to prevent this from happening?