What to do about Iran and its ambitions to build an A-bomb?
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Original post by thenewone61
It's not a report. We must have read two completely different things. It's a coherent, well argued and well referenced book detailing the history of Western and Iranian negotiations regarding Iran's nuclear programme. Your silly little insults won't pervade the facts you have just read. Living in a country does not render you an expert in its relations other countries. But hey, seeing as you lived there for (TWO WHOLE YEARS!) there's a chance you may have been present in these meetings? I mean, your view and account is much more reliable when compared to those of diplomats actually involved in the process? Who's the real fool here?
What book did you get this BS from? Did Dickens write it by any chance? Sounds like fiction to me? Source?
Original post by MRNO
I read the Express [for medical science] and the Guardian.
Yet you insult me for reading a well referenced and well regarded book on nuclear programme negotiations between the 'West' and Iran? When your main sources of information are the Guardian and the Express? The same newspaper (the express) which has an article right now on its front page informing readers 'How to eat Victoria Beckham's favourite superfood?' Give me a break.
Original post by arminb
I cant believe you are going on with that .
Go and play with your toys now, this thread is for adults. People with a bit higher IQ than a 4 year old.
Go on, go play. I bet you got a sand box.
Original post by MRNO
What book did you get this BS from? Did Dickens write it by any chance? Sounds like fiction to me? Source?
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Dangerous-Delusion-Wrong-About-Nuclear/dp/1908739894/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1387462499&sr=8-1&keywords=why+the+west+is+wrong
Not fiction. A well referenced book.
Original post by thenewone61
Yet you insult me for reading a well referenced and well regarded book on nuclear programme negotiations between the 'West' and Iran? When your main sources of information are the Guardian and the Express? The same newspaper (the express) which has an article right now on its front page informing readers 'How to eat Victoria Beckham's favourite superfood?' Give me a break.
I read it, because it happens to have some good medical articles in it. Although I accept that it has gone down hill in recent years.
Iran needs to be able to defend itself.
Nuclear weapons are a long term investment not just for the here and now.
Yes the peace loving hippies will say disarm but how do you know what's going to happen in the future with China, North Korea, can we trust Russia not to point its gaze towards Iran and its oil?
Nuclear weapons are a long term investment not just for the here and now.
Yes the peace loving hippies will say disarm but how do you know what's going to happen in the future with China, North Korea, can we trust Russia not to point its gaze towards Iran and its oil?
Original post by thenewone61
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Dangerous-Delusion-Wrong-About-Nuclear/dp/1908739894/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1387462499&sr=8-1&keywords=why+the+west+is+wrong
Not fiction. A well referenced book.
Not fiction. A well referenced book.
An opinion poll In Iraq suggests that people are happier than they were before the invasion, optimistic about the future and opposed to violence.
77% of Iraqis think their lives have improved since the former president, Saddam Hussein, was deposed.
Israel in it's history has only been aggressive, committed terrible war crimes and atrocities, even assassinating people around the world. Our politicians are all very pro-Israel, and Zionists as if being a Zionist like it's a normal thing when Zionists are the biggest fascist, racist supremacists in the world. Most of our political elite are part Jewish ancestry including David Cameron (look it up) and George Osborne, Phillip Hammond as if you couldn't tell by looking at him. Zionofascists rule Britain and western countries they run the government, the banks, the media pretty much everything.
Original post by Voiceofvoiceless
Israel in it's history has only been aggressive, committed terrible war crimes and atrocities, even assassinating people around the world. Our politicians are all very pro-Israel, and Zionists as if being a Zionist like it's a normal thing when Zionists are the biggest fascist, racist supremacists in the world. Most of our political elite are part Jewish ancestry including David Cameron (look it up) and George Osborne, Phillip Hammond as if you couldn't tell by looking at him. Zionofascists rule Britain and western countries they run the government, the banks, the media pretty much everything.
This is anti semitic propaganda. I don't know what difference the ancestry of people have in them makes. I know it makes you a complete racist bigot. Many Americans have German blood, but it didn't stop them sending the UK equipment during WW2.
During the period between 29 September 2000 (the beginning of the Second Intifada) and 31 December 2009, 1,178 persons were killed and 8022 more were injured as a result of Palestinian terror attacks. Out of the 1178, 790 were Israeli civilians (67%), 328 were members of Israel's security forces (29%) and 60 were foreigners (5%)
I Suppose Saddam was a saint was he?
Saddam was a good, kind, benevolent, altruistic Saint, huh? Gassing Kurds, mass graves, disappearing people. Yup, a shining example for the Libs to follow
(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by MRNO
An opinion poll In Iraq suggests that people are happier than they were before the invasion, optimistic about the future and opposed to violence.
77% of Iraqis think their lives have improved since the former president, Saddam Hussein, was deposed.
77% of Iraqis think their lives have improved since the former president, Saddam Hussein, was deposed.
That has absolutely NO relation to your posted question. I don't CARE about Saddam Hussein at this present time. Iraq is not Iran, so I don't see why you're attempting to shy away from the debate you just lost. Admit you were ignorant prior to my informing you of the facts. You even stooped to the point of telling me that you lived in Iran for 2 years. Well done for that by the way, what a representation of your expertise on Iranian nuclear programme negotiations, you must be oh so well informed. You insulted me for trying to eradicate your ignorant ideas? And now you want to talk about Iraq? I'm here to discuss Iran and your allegation of "its ambitions to build an A-bomb?" Even typing a part of that stupid question angers me. You're so uninformed and yet so confident in your own ignorance it's almost painful.
Original post by thenewone61
That has absolutely NO relation to your posted question. I don't CARE about Saddam Hussein at this present time. Iraq is not Iran, so I don't see why you're attempting to shy away from the debate you just lost. Admit you were ignorant prior to my informing you of the facts. You even stooped to the point of telling me that you lived in Iran for 2 years. Well done for that by the way, what a representation of your expertise on Iranian nuclear programme negotiations, you must be oh so well informed. You insulted me for trying to eradicate your ignorant ideas? And now you want to talk about Iraq? I'm here to discuss Iran and your allegation of "its ambitions to build an A-bomb?" Even typing a part of that stupid question angers me. You're so uninformed and yet so confident in your own ignorance it's almost painful.
Why build missiles then?
Also I did live in Iraq for 2 years.
Read Christopher Hitchens.
UN officials want Iran to scrap its prized Arak heavy-water reactor, which is still under construction, and abandon a fortified underground uranium-enrichment facility at Fordow. They also want Iran to fully disclose long-hidden, long range missile programme and there nuclear research and activities at the Parchin military site and open itself to intensive monitoring by United Nations inspectors.
The UN have disclosed details of activity at a heavily-guarded Iranian facility from which international inspectors have been barred for 18 months.
Iran has activated the Arak heavy-water production plant. Heavy water is needed to operate a nuclear reactor that can produce plutonium, which could then be used to make a bomb.
Inspectors from the International Atomic Energy Agency have been unable to visit the facility since August 2011 and Iran has refused repeated requests for information about the site, which is 150 miles south-west of the capital, Tehran.
Western governments and the IAEA have held information about activity at Arak for some time.
Trucks were photographed by French satellite carrying Russian made S-300 Missile to the site.
Iran launch site 'likely for testing ballistic missiles', UN analysts say
Iran has built a new rocket launch site which is likely to be used for testing ballistic missiles, according to UN military analysts publishing satellite images of the structure.
(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by MRNO
Why build missiles then?
Also I did live in Iraq for 2 years.
Read Christopher Hitchens.
Also I did live in Iraq for 2 years.
Read Christopher Hitchens.
I have answered your question in the above post. I don't care where you lived, that has no bearing on your knowledge of nuclear programme negotiations between Iran and the West.
Christopher Hitchens? Read Noam Chomsky, Robert Fisk, Gideon Levy, Michael Axworthy, Norman Finkelstein, John Pilger and Mark Curtis to name a few. Don't try to school me.
Original post by MRNO
Why build missiles then?
Also I did live in Iraq for 2 years.
Read Christopher Hitchens.
UN officials want Iran to scrap its prized Arak heavy-water reactor, which is still under construction, and abandon a fortified underground uranium-enrichment facility at Fordow. They also want Iran to fully disclose long-hidden, long range missile programme and there nuclear research and activities at the Parchin military site and open itself to intensive monitoring by United Nations inspectors.
Also I did live in Iraq for 2 years.
Read Christopher Hitchens.
UN officials want Iran to scrap its prized Arak heavy-water reactor, which is still under construction, and abandon a fortified underground uranium-enrichment facility at Fordow. They also want Iran to fully disclose long-hidden, long range missile programme and there nuclear research and activities at the Parchin military site and open itself to intensive monitoring by United Nations inspectors.
Again, I have already dealt with that issue in the long post above. I'm not going to repeat myself. Read it again.
Original post by thenewone61
Don't try to school me.
I think you are beyond that. You wouldn't have the time to learn what I know. I think you're a bit far gone and brainwashed to ever have an open mind. By the looks of the rubbish propaganda you read.
Original post by thenewone61
Again, I have already dealt with that issue in the long post above. I'm not going to repeat myself. Read it again.
Iran and the five permanent members of the U.N. Security Council plus Germany, the so-called P5-plus-1, have been working on an agreement to end Iran's suspected nuclear weapons program in exchange for a lifting of economic sanctions.
French minister warns he was given details of key components for making a-bomb by UN inspectors and the materials found at the site were not needed to produce a nuclear power plant.
(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by sugar-n-spice
If they have genuine intentions to create bombs and are putting them into practice, the sites manufacturing them should be bombed-nuclear energy is fine though.
Er why?
Israel has nuclear weapons, we don't see calls to destroy the dimona nuclear weapons sites do we?
The fact is nuclear weapons are no more than paperweights, they simply can NEVER be used, because the retaliation would mean both sides would essentially lose.
Oh sure China could fire its nuclear missiles at the USA, but they would receive about 2500 back.
North Korea might fire it's A-bombs at the USA but it would get 2500 back.
The missiles argument is silly as well, oh sure they could stick it on a missile, it would probably go about 5 miles before it ran out of fuel.
Consider the Ariane 5 rocket this thing is HUGE. it is 57 metres tall and 5.4 metres wide weighing 777,000 kilograms.
Guess what the payload is? 6500kilos into low earth orbit at the equator Fat man which the North Korean A-bomb is a copy of weighed 4900kilos, it also costs 100million Euros per launch.
Iran is not on the equator, and nor do they have rockets the size of ariane 5. Our own sub launched missiles are small because of miniaturised warheads and the fact that a missile sub can move closer to the target and can move to the equator.
Original post by MRNO
I think you are beyond that. You wouldn't have the time to learn what I know. I think you're a bit far gone and brainwashed to ever have an open mind. By the looks of the rubbish propaganda you read.
Rubbish propaganda?! You read the EXPRESS! My GOD.
I see you failed to provide a DoI reference.
Thus we can happily assume you're lying. Which is what I assumed before.
If you want to disarm Iran, then go and do it, otherwise you're just a chicken hawk willing to send other people to die for your own goals.
Go buy a rifle and march on Iran yourself go on. Or hire a mercenary army for you to do it yourself
Its funny how you keep avoiding the points where your lies are found out isn;t it? You keep avoiding the technical issues in regards to nuclear weapons and you keep pulling claims out of the air without providing DoI to where you are citing things from.
Remember not citing source gets you failed at university assignments and clearly you have failed to cite your sources other than your own rear end.
Mathmatical calculations can sometimes substitute for citations, but you provide neither.
Thus we can happily assume you're lying. Which is what I assumed before.
If you want to disarm Iran, then go and do it, otherwise you're just a chicken hawk willing to send other people to die for your own goals.
Go buy a rifle and march on Iran yourself go on. Or hire a mercenary army for you to do it yourself
Its funny how you keep avoiding the points where your lies are found out isn;t it? You keep avoiding the technical issues in regards to nuclear weapons and you keep pulling claims out of the air without providing DoI to where you are citing things from.
Remember not citing source gets you failed at university assignments and clearly you have failed to cite your sources other than your own rear end.
Mathmatical calculations can sometimes substitute for citations, but you provide neither.
Original post by MRNO
Why build missiles then?
Iran launch site 'likely for testing ballistic missiles', UN analysts say
Iran has built a new rocket launch site which is likely to be used for testing ballistic missiles, according to UN military analysts publishing satellite images of the structure.
Iran launch site 'likely for testing ballistic missiles', UN analysts say
Iran has built a new rocket launch site which is likely to be used for testing ballistic missiles, according to UN military analysts publishing satellite images of the structure.
Which are weasel words, the word ballistic is added, when it forgets the fact that most things which move are ballistic.
I have some fireworks left over, they too are ballistic, I have a car outside it too obeys the laws of ballistics.
Original post by Justpin
Er why?
Israel has nuclear weapons, we don't see calls to destroy the dimona nuclear weapons sites do we?
The fact is nuclear weapons are no more than paperweights, they simply can NEVER be used, because the retaliation would mean both sides would essentially lose.
Oh sure China could fire its nuclear missiles at the USA, but they would receive about 2500 back.
North Korea might fire it's A-bombs at the USA but it would get 2500 back.
The missiles argument is silly as well, oh sure they could stick it on a missile, it would probably go about 5 miles before it ran out of fuel.
Consider the Ariane 5 rocket this thing is HUGE. it is 57 metres tall and 5.4 metres wide weighing 777,000 kilograms.
Guess what the payload is? 6500kilos into low earth orbit at the equator Fat man which the North Korean A-bomb is a copy of weighed 4900kilos, it also costs 100million Euros per launch.
Iran is not on the equator, and nor do they have rockets the size of ariane 5. Our own sub launched missiles are small because of miniaturised warheads and the fact that a missile sub can move closer to the target and can move to the equator.
Israel has nuclear weapons, we don't see calls to destroy the dimona nuclear weapons sites do we?
The fact is nuclear weapons are no more than paperweights, they simply can NEVER be used, because the retaliation would mean both sides would essentially lose.
Oh sure China could fire its nuclear missiles at the USA, but they would receive about 2500 back.
North Korea might fire it's A-bombs at the USA but it would get 2500 back.
The missiles argument is silly as well, oh sure they could stick it on a missile, it would probably go about 5 miles before it ran out of fuel.
Consider the Ariane 5 rocket this thing is HUGE. it is 57 metres tall and 5.4 metres wide weighing 777,000 kilograms.
Guess what the payload is? 6500kilos into low earth orbit at the equator Fat man which the North Korean A-bomb is a copy of weighed 4900kilos, it also costs 100million Euros per launch.
Iran is not on the equator, and nor do they have rockets the size of ariane 5. Our own sub launched missiles are small because of miniaturised warheads and the fact that a missile sub can move closer to the target and can move to the equator.
It's more about the threat they represent than anything else. It would make Iran a regional power. Turkey and Saudi Arabia [both Muslim countries] do not wish for them to get nuclear weapons. Israel will stop at nothing to prevent this, even maybe striking out at them with nuclear weapons first.
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