Why is Student Finance based on our parents income?

My maintenance loan will be around 3,800. My accommodation will cost 4,800; if you budget wisely you can live off about 3,500. My parents said they'd try and help out. It's a trap for the middle working class. I'm trying to get a job in my gap year currently, I'm going to have to get one at uni aswell. Staying a live is going to be tough.

Then something else that annoys me; I want to be able to join clubs at uni, but those are going to cost money. And then on top of that buying healthy food and eating well is actually quite expensive.

Nothing's in my favour. I really don't think it's fair that we are judged on our parents income. I'm 18, I'm an adult.

Reply 43

day_dreamer

Original post by b0x3s

What does our household income have to do with anything? My parents can't help me out, I'm the one going to Uni and has to have the debt, how is that fair to assess on something out of our control? We should all be equal.

What's the reason for it?

I realised I never actually answered your question.

The reason why SF asks about household is to decrease the amount of money given out. The government will say its to help those with a low income to go to uni. But I don't think the government really cares about those on low incomes going to uni.

No if your parents are 'average' or 'around average' earners then no it isn't 'fair'. The system that we have now means that the rich can afford university, the very poor get their university fees paid for and the people in the middle (the vast majority) are the ones that suffer.

Something I have always wondered is that if your parents are on a low income and you get a high amount of SF, don't you have to pay the loan portion of that back, ultimately meaning that someone who comes from a low financial background ends up with more SF debt by the end of the course compared to someone who comes from a higher financial background who wasn't eligible for so much money from SF. So even though the government is 'helping' those on low incomes to go to uni don't they end up with more debt?

I personal believe that your parents income should be taken into account. As they will USUALLY help their children out financially. But a portion of your SF should also look at other aspects of the course for example the amount of attendance hours required.

Reply 44

Because you live with your parents?
Sadly by the time I go to uni I will have been living by myself for 3+ years but SFE say they STILL have to take my mothers income into account because I stupidly threw my tenancy letters etc away (Like most 17/18 year olds would)

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Reply 45

Folion

15

As an 18 year old adult you have the choice what to do with your life, YOUR choice your parents don't legally have a say in it. From a parental point of view your 18 year old might become for example

A millionaire footballer
A burger flipper
A major recording artist
A married full time parent
An apprentice
A student

Should YOUR choice as an 18 year old forcibly impact on your parents? Is it fair that YOUR choice as a legal ADULT impacts on the rest of your family including any siblings you have? From the above list (which is by no means exhaustive of course) which would the Govt. expect your parents to stick their hands in their pockets to cover your expenses?

Repayable loans should (morally) be available universally to cover course fees and rent (to a uni/govt. approved landlord) plus maybe another £2.5k

Reply 46

_Ddraig_

19

Original post by Folion

As an 18 year old adult you have the choice what to do with your life, YOUR choice your parents don't legally have a say in it. From a parental point of view your 18 year old might become for example

A millionaire footballer
A burger flipper
A major recording artist
A married full time parent
An apprentice
A student

Should YOUR choice as an 18 year old forcibly impact on your parents? Is it fair that YOUR choice as a legal ADULT impacts on the rest of your family including any siblings you have? From the above list (which is by no means exhaustive of course) which would the Govt. expect your parents to stick their hands in their pockets to cover your expenses?

Repayable loans should (morally) be available universally to cover course fees and rent (to a uni/govt. approved landlord) plus maybe another £2.5k

Just because somebody is legally an adult because of their age, doesn't mean that their parents are now out of the equation.

How many 18 year olds currently applying to university courses currently live with their parents? Depends on their parents for food? Depends on their parents for clothes? Depend on their parents? The majority i would think. How many people do you know at university that live with their parents during the holidays, or how many stories have you heard of graduates having to live with their parents?

Your attitude towards an 18 year old now being a legal adult is quite ridiculous.

Reply 47

Original post by _Morsey_

Just because somebody is legally an adult because of their age, doesn't mean that their parents are now out of the equation.

How many 18 year olds currently applying to university courses currently live with their parents? Depends on their parents for food? Depends on their parents for clothes? Depend on their parents? The majority i would think. How many people do you know at university that live with their parents during the holidays, or how many stories have you heard of graduates having to live with their parents?

Your attitude towards an 18 year old now being a legal adult is quite ridiculous.

What about the 18 year olds who pay their parents rent?

Reply 48

_Ddraig_

19

Original post by ~Cat

What about the 18 year olds who pay their parents rent?

I was merely pointing out that the majority of 18 year olds still depend on their parents in one way or another. 18 year olds that pay rent is not uncommon, however in my eyes it is a stepping stone by parents teaching them what the real world is going to be like, whereas from the stance of legality it is being made out that at 18 when you are now legally an adult, you are now entirely independent. When in most cases, in whatever form, that is simply not the case.

Reply 49

Original post by ~Cat

What about the 18 year olds who pay their parents rent?

It's not the same.. Live on your own for a few years and you'll soon realise.

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Reply 50

Folion

15

Original post by _Morsey_

Just because somebody is legally an adult because of their age, doesn't mean that their parents are now out of the equation.

How many 18 year olds currently applying to university courses currently live with their parents? Depends on their parents for food? Depends on their parents for clothes? Depend on their parents? The majority i would think. How many people do you know at university that live with their parents during the holidays, or how many stories have you heard of graduates having to live with their parents?

Your attitude towards an 18 year old now being a legal adult is quite ridiculous.

My post is to a degree (excuse the pun) somewhat devil's advocate BUT as people have said further back in the thread the Govt. have a very selective attitude as to when it suits them to treat you as an independent adult and when not. Doing a degree is a choice that has consequences further reaching than just the student. Is it fair that choosing to do a degree can have an impact on, say, your siblings?

Reply 51

Yeah, I agree it's not the same.

I'm just trying to emphasise the fact that some parents really cant afford to contribute to university and in some cases, absolutely refuse to.

In cases like these, having the maintenance loan means tested makes it near impossible for the individual to afford uni. Forcing them into a gap year, like myself.

I agree with the OP; a lot of the middle working class are stuck in the middle. In saying this I don't know what the right solution would be, because I also agree that the poorer people do need more support.

Reply 52

Original post by ~Cat

Yeah, I agree it's not the same.

I'm just trying to emphasise the fact that some parents really cant afford to contribute to university and in some cases, absolutely refuse to.

In cases like these, having the maintenance loan means tested makes it near impossible for the individual to afford uni. Forcing them into a gap year, like myself.

I agree with the OP; a lot of the middle working class are stuck in the middle. In saying this I don't know what the right solution would be, because I also agree that the poorer people do need more support.

If they can't afford to then SFE will recognise that.. If they refuse then it really is time to get a job
Quite frankly I'm looking forward to uni because I'll be more financially stable due to the amount of bills that will either be lessened or removed entirely!

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Reply 53

Original post by Portia1993

If they can't afford to then SFE will recognise that.. If they refuse then it really is time to get a job
Quite frankly I'm looking forward to uni because I'll be more financially stable due to the amount of bills that will either be lessened or removed entirely!

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Yeah, I can see how it would benefit someone in your situation.
But for most accumulating an extra £5000 a year is going to be difficult. Particularly for students in their 3rd year, when having a part time job is tough

Reply 54

Original post by ~Cat

Yeah, I can see how it would benefit someone in your situation.
But for most accumulating an extra £5000 a year is going to be difficult. Particularly for students in their 3rd year, when having a part time job is tough

Most unis offer bursaries through their own financial departments & if people get part time jobs in their 1st and 2nd years and don't go out drinking etc then it shouldn't be overly difficult
I've worked out finances for a few different unis just to see how it'd work out and they're all doable :smile:

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Reply 55

Original post by Portia1993

Most unis offer bursaries through their own financial departments & if people get part time jobs in their 1st and 2nd years and don't go out drinking etc then it shouldn't be overly difficult
I've worked out finances for a few different unis just to see how it'd work out and they're all doable :smile:

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Aren't a lot of the bursaries and grants only available to those who achieved certain grades, come from a less fortunate background, have a low income family etc though? The ones I've looked at seemed to fit this specification.

And I agree it's doable. Just.
But, compared to someone from an upper class or lower working class background, someone like me has been forced into taking a gap year, and will have to sacrifice far more at uni just to stay a float. I want to join clubs, and I would like to go out drinking. But will my lack of funds stop me from getting the most out of uni? I suppose I'll find out :P

Reply 56

mariocasas

9

The government are idiots, the UK gives loans to EU citizens to study in the UK but the same isn't given to those wanting to study in European countries. In the end, a large chunk of EU students go back to their countries and fail to repay their loans, but as usual British students are the ones who are expected to comply.

Reply 57

mariocasas

9

Original post by Portia1993

Most unis offer bursaries through their own financial departments & if people get part time jobs in their 1st and 2nd years and don't go out drinking etc then it shouldn't be overly difficult
I've worked out finances for a few different unis just to see how it'd work out and they're all doable :smile:

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So to survive Uni, you have to give up your social life and not drink?

Reply 58

Klix88

17

Original post by Olympiad

Maybe it's due to the fact that I'm in a private school - some of my friends have had their grandparents/parents pay their entire student fees within their first year, which I find annoying.

Actually, university tuition fees are probably the most level part of the playing field. If you're eligible for Student Finance, then you get your fees paid in full via the Tuition Fee Loan. You will never have to contribute to tuition fees unless you in some way fail to meet the SF criteria. Given that the loan repayment terms are pretty favourable, they're not really the issue.

The big problem comes with Maintenance Loans/Grants, where some people are left with insufficient money for basics such as food and rent. That's where the lack of a parental contribution can sometimes make the difference between continuing and having to give up.

Reply 59