The Student Room Group

This discussion is now closed.

Check out other Related discussions

Should You Receive Benefits If Your "Laziness" Is Caused By A Mental Health Condition

Scroll to see replies

Original post by Tyrion_Lannister
Right, sorry, I thought you were advocating social darwinism...

Tbh if someone's properly diagnosed, it can't really be abused.

It's currently impossible to diagnose mental illnesses (especially things like depression) with 100% certainty; how are we to be sure that those we deem 'fit' and 'unfit' are correctly placed/haven't suffered a terrible injustice?
Original post by 2ndClass




Like I mentioned to small town girl, there are plethora of medications available for bi polar and other psychological disorders. The fact you live in this country and they're heavily subsidized on the NHS completely refutes your point that "we aren't doing enough"

Second you are a drama queen and you are lazy. You said that you don't want to work and at the most it has to be part time, You want to be taken care off by your future husband. You're also a drama queen because you're hyper inflating your condition to make it appear as if it's some chronically debilitating syndrome that inhibits you from doing something. In reality, it's just you being over emotional lazy.


1) They don't work for everyone. Considering 1/7 people die, we are not doing enough. We are doing SOMETHIG, but it's not enough. Have you ever used the mental health services? They're ridiculously underfunded.

2) How does me wanting to work part time, one of the reasons for which is my condition, make me lazy? If I have the means to do so, what the **** is your problem?

3) No, I'm not hyper inflating it. This is how it is for someone with depression. This is reality.
Reply 62
Original post by Le Nombre
Your issue is that people with mental illness are a threat to the public and this need locking up for our safety, I'm showing that young males who drink are statistically a greater risk. And if you believee drunk young men don't suddenly turn violent for no obvious reason then you have lived a sheltered life.


Never said that. :facepalm:
Reply 63
Of course not, what is this nonsense? Things like this remind me how liberal values are eroding society.
(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by genuinelydense
It's currently impossible to diagnose mental illnesses (especially things like depression) with 100% certainty though; how are we to be sure that those we deem 'fit' and 'unfit' are correctly placed/haven't suffered a terrible injustice?


Have you been diagnosed with anything? I ask because the assessments are incredibly thorough and getting a diagnosis takes years. Also, I'd rather someone milk the system and it helps the genuine, than take it away from everyone so the genuine suffer
Original post by SoftPunch
Never said that. :facepalm:


No, you didn't, but given that the tendency to suddenly snap and present a risk to the public is why you wish to lock up anyone with a mental illness it seemed a pretty logical conclusion to draw.
Original post by SoftPunch
If they can look after themselves with help of medication they should be able to perform simple tasks as well; I am not talking about jobs like working in an oil business, being a scientist or lawyer; just even simply working in Tesco or whatever - not much effort required.


Right. I get extremely tired. Even though I'm medicated for it I can easily sleep for 12+ hours non-stop and it takes me maybe three hours to wake up in the mornings. Not because I'm lazy but because I have no energy. Just thinking about doing something can make me tired. I can find time to shower and dress myself (although not til long after lunch most days) and 'prepare' myself a meal. Sometimes I even eat it. I can manage to go to the supermarket once a week to buy food. I wash my clothes sometimes. I do my washing up every fortnight. And sometimes I go and spend a few hours with my friends. The rest of my time is spend in bed with no energy. This is what we mean by coping and functioning. We can do BASIC daily tasks. Not doing a proper job.
Original post by Oschene23
Natural selection would suggest 'survival of the fittest'. Thus every human being would try to the upmost of their ability to better their health so if they didn't take those medicines, they would deserve to die out. Why would not taking them show natural selection at play?

Also on a separate point, the main issue with the 'soft' mental illnesses such as depression, anxiety and even stress is that they are regardless of what anyone would like to tell you impossible to diagnose. In reality, people can lie about these to get certain benefits, and it almost certainly is prevalent among our society. These people who whine about not being taken seriously need to start offering some solutions so that we can weed out those who are claiming undeservedly, rather than just expecting society to foot the bill for these frauds.


Survival of the fittest as she was saying iplied no one should be helped.

Soft? Oh please. Until you've experiences it, don't call it soft. Also it takes years to diagnose. I laugh at people who think you walk into a doctors office, say you're sad and get a diagnosis of depression. Go through the mentaal health services and come back to me with how easy it is then
Reply 68
Original post by Le Nombre
No, you didn't, but given that the tendency to suddenly snap and present a risk to the public is why you wish to lock up anyone with a mental illness it seemed a pretty logical conclusion to draw.

Not absolutely everyone? Those who have a history of having easy tendency to snap etc. Those with factors that may spiral off into danger, i.e. hallucinations to the point where they may snap at someone for no reason, etc. Other than that, those with mild mental issues should be able to work.
Original post by SmallTownGirl
Right. I get extremely tired. Even though I'm medicated for it I can easily sleep for 12+ hours non-stop and it takes me maybe three hours to wake up in the mornings. Not because I'm lazy but because I have no energy. Just thinking about doing something can make me tired. I can find time to shower and dress myself (although not til long after lunch most days) and 'prepare' myself a meal. Sometimes I even eat it. I can manage to go to the supermarket once a week to buy food. I wash my clothes sometimes. I do my washing up every fortnight. And sometimes I go and spend a few hours with my friends. The rest of my time is spend in bed with no energy. This is what we mean by coping and functioning. We can do BASIC daily tasks. Not doing a proper job.


I love how people think we're having a jolly at home with tax payers money, and when we point out otherwise, we're being melodramatic and exaggerating. This is reality for people with mental illnesses.

You're welcome to my benefits if you take the depression and anxiety too
Reply 70
Original post by Tyrion_Lannister
1) They don't work for everyone. Considering 1/7 people die, we are not doing enough. We are doing SOMETHIG, but it's not enough. Have you ever used the mental health services? They're ridiculously underfunded


You're just parroting the same thing over and over again. Do you see why I call your posts emotionally charged? The pharmaceutical sector is a multi billion pound industry that is constantly innovating medicine to treat your condition. Once again, it's worked for 6/7 people, if we aren't doing enough the ratio would've been much greater. I suspect most of those who commit suicide were undiagnosed and untreated. And even if that wasn't the case, the fact still remains. Modern medication functions perfectly well for the majority of those people

2) How does me wanting to work part time, one of the reasons for which is my condition, make me lazy? If I have the means to do so, what the **** is your problem?


Are you seriously that dim? this is exactly why I can't take people like you seriously.

3) No, I'm not hyper inflating it. This is how it is for someone with depression. This is reality.


Of course you are, and you're perpetuating this stigma that people with psychological issues are lazy and inept.
Original post by Tyrion_Lannister
1) They don't work for everyone. Considering 1/7 people die, we are not doing enough. We are doing SOMETHIG, but it's not enough. Have you ever used the mental health services? They're ridiculously underfunded.

2) How does me wanting to work part time, one of the reasons for which is my condition, make me lazy? If I have the means to do so, what the **** is your problem?

3) No, I'm not hyper inflating it. This is how it is for someone with depression. This is reality.


Playing devil's advocate, but you could argue the issue is we essentially don't have a ****ing clue about how the brain works at the moment compared to pretty much every other major organ, and thus the money needs to go into research and coming up with treatments that work much more effectively in the long term.

For the moment on a cost:benefit approach, whcih the NHS has to take, we know we can save lives by giving X heart patients Y procedure or drug, but the lack of understanding about mental health means we can make no such promises with treatment of mental illness, and thus take a risk we piss money up the wall which could be spent more effectively elsewhere.
Reply 72
Original post by SmallTownGirl
Right. I get extremely tired. Even though I'm medicated for it I can easily sleep for 12+ hours non-stop and it takes me maybe three hours to wake up in the mornings. Not because I'm lazy but because I have no energy. Just thinking about doing something can make me tired. I can find time to shower and dress myself (although not til long after lunch most days) and 'prepare' myself a meal. Sometimes I even eat it. I can manage to go to the supermarket once a week to buy food. I wash my clothes sometimes. I do my washing up every fortnight. And sometimes I go and spend a few hours with my friends. The rest of my time is spend in bed with no energy. This is what we mean by coping and functioning. We can do BASIC daily tasks. Not doing a proper job.


Yeah, and I am saying I have no idea whether you're one of those people who delude themselves with their 'depressions' ... Hey, I have no energy to wake up at 6 o'clock in the morning every day, but I have to and somehow I manage. Or should I shout for benefits to be thrown at me. In fact I am quite eligible to go and see a doctor and get a depression tag, because how you described the way you feel is what I feel like most of the time.
Original post by 2ndClass
It works for the vast majority for people. The logic of that argument essentially suggests that because a certain type of medication doesn't work for a single person, it should be withdrawn because it wouldn't have any efficacy on others. For the most part they work pretty well for the majority of people and thus doesn't necessitate allowing those who have bi polar time off work. If one medication doesn't work, there are others.



Not feeling or relating in an emotional sense does not inhibit someone from doing their work. Would you honestly forsake your revision for an important exam just because you felt depressed? would turn down a dream job that was offered to you just because you have bi polar? of course you wouldn't. This is why I object to these ludicrous emotionally charged posts. And they're pretty disingenuous and do more to solidify this stigma.



Like I mentioned to small town girl, there are plethora of medications available for bi polar and other psychological disorders. The fact you live in this country and they're heavily subsidized on the NHS completely refutes your point that "we aren't doing enough"

Second you are a drama queen and you are lazy. You said that you don't want to work and at the most it has to be part time, You want to be taken care off by your future husband. You're also a drama queen because you're hyper inflating your condition to make it appear as if it's some chronically debilitating syndrome that inhibits you from doing something. In reality, it's just you being over emotional lazy.


Right, so because something works for some people it must work for everyone or we leave those that it doesn't work to deal with it on their own...


And actually, I have just failed two important uni exams because I had no energy to revise. I've wanted to be a physicist for years. That's not an option any more. I've got to leave my degree because of the stress and my lack of motivation. I've got to change my dreams and now all I can hope for is being well enough for a minimum wage job with no commitment. THAT is the reality of being ill.
Original post by Oschene23
Natural selection would suggest 'survival of the fittest'. Thus every human being would try to the upmost of their ability to better their health so if they didn't take those medicines, they would deserve to die out. Why would not taking them show natural selection at play?

Also on a separate point, the main issue with the 'soft' mental illnesses such as depression, anxiety and even stress is that they are regardless of what anyone would like to tell you impossible to diagnose. In reality, people can lie about these to get certain benefits, and it almost certainly is prevalent among our society. These people who whine about not being taken seriously need to start offering some solutions so that we can weed out those who are claiming undeservedly, rather than just expecting society to foot the bill for these frauds.


There is no such thing as a soft mental illness in my opinion.....mental illness can be very debilitating to anyone......depression is a very serious disorder that can result in suicide....anxiety can push anyone over the edge and can make living a normal life very hard to achieve. Instead of stigmatizing mental illness why don't we all focus on those that do lie to con the system into paying them more money? Those are the ones making it hard for people with mental illness to be recognised and treated with compassion!
Original post by SoftPunch
Not absolutely everyone? Those who have a history of having easy tendency to snap etc. Those with factors that may spiral off into danger, i.e. hallucinations to the point where they may snap at someone for no reason, etc. Other than that, those with mild mental issues should be able to work.


But any young bloke whoever binge drinks is presenting a factor that may spiral off into danger, but banging them all up would be incredibly economically unproductive. I when I'm smashed I'm sure present similarly to those who do go and glass someone, should that factor mean that I get banged up even though I've never actually done something?
Reply 76
Original post by SoftPunch
Yeah, and I am saying I have no idea whether you're one of those people who delude themselves with their 'depressions' ... Hey, I have no energy to wake up at 6 o'clock in the morning every day, but I have to and somehow I manage. Or should I shout for benefits to be thrown at me. In fact I am quite eligible to go and see a doctor and get a depression tag, because how you described the way you feel is what I feel like most of the time.


:congrats:

perfectly said
Original post by 2ndClass
You're just parroting the same thing over and over again. Do you see why I call your posts emotionally charged? The pharmaceutical sector is a multi billion pound industry that is constantly innovating medicine to treat your condition. Once again, it's worked for 6/7 people, if we aren't doing enough the ratio would've been much greater. I suspect most of those who commit suicide were undiagnosed and untreated. And even if that wasn't the case, the fact still remains. Modern medication functions perfectly well for the majority of those people



Are you seriously that dim? this is exactly why I can't take people like you seriously.



Of course you are, and you're perpetuating this stigma that people with psychological issues are lazy and inept.


1) Medication doesn't work for 6/7 :rofl: Just because they don't kill themselves doesn't mean it works. Look it up.

No, we do not do enough. Most mental health teams admit themseleves they're underfunded

2) Explain? Let me guess, "I have to work 9-5 so you do too", the typical bitter jealous response? Let me tell you something. I'll work full time, and you can work part time, o the conditio you take my depression and anxiety. Yeah?

3) The only one perpetuating stigma is you, "of course you are" isn't an argument
Original post by SoftPunch
Yeah, and I am saying I have no idea whether you're one of those people who delude themselves with their 'depressions' ... Hey, I have no energy to wake up at 6 o'clock in the morning every day, but I have to and somehow I manage. Or should I shout for benefits to be thrown at me. In fact I am quite eligible to go and see a doctor and get a depression tag, because how you described the way you feel is what I feel like most of the time.


The different is that when you have to you can. I can't.
Original post by Tyrion_Lannister
Survival of the fittest as she was saying iplied no one should be helped.

Soft? Oh please. Until you've experiences it, don't call it soft. Also it takes years to diagnose. I laugh at people who think you walk into a doctors office, say you're sad and get a diagnosis of depression. Go through the mentaal health services and come back to me with how easy it is then


Well actually I have a parent who works in Mental Health so I have heard quite a lot about it thank you. And again you offer no solutions, you even admit tax payers have to fund years of diagnosis which is never 100% certain anyway, how do you justify that? Why should we pay for people to fraud the system? And before you get all aggressive, I actually support people receiving what they need if it is justified, but some people take the absolute piss and they are allowed to get away with it, especially in the public sector in this country. You have people on around 70k a year, going on 2 years stress leave on full pay (heard this on several occasions) , this kind of rubbish just didn't happen back in the day (say pre 1950's - 80's) , its not people are more likely to get mentally ill now than back then.


People just need to get some perspective, after WW1 soldiers with legs blown off were stuck in workhouses with no job prospects and no benefits and nowadays people can take 2 years off a taxpayer funded well-payed job because of stress? How is that right?