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Communicating information a2 application topic

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Hello, can someone please explain to me about the bandwidth , the one highlighter in pink?
I am quite confused about it.
Thanks a lot.


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Reply 1
Original post by Sweet Rose
ImageUploadedByStudent Room1391696542.237267.jpg

Hello, can someone please explain to me about the bandwidth , the one highlighter in pink?
I am quite confused about it.
Thanks a lot.


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*the one highlighted in pink.


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Reply 2
Original post by Sweet Rose
*the one highlighted in pink.


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I'm not sure the info on that sheet is all correct tbh - usually the term 'sidebands' is used for the power at frequencies surrounding the carrier, not 'side frequencies'

The points I think it's trying to make is that

* the bandwidth depends on the highest audio frequency you want to transmit (also FM transmits stereo channels - more bandwidth is required for stereo too)
* the number of broadcast stations possible in a frequency range depends on the number of bandwidths you can fit in that range.

e.g.AM/ LW broadcast frequencies run from 153kHz to 279kHz - the range is 126kHz which allows you to have 14 channels each 9khz 'wide'
FM/VHF frequencies run from 88000kHz to 108000kHz - the range is 20000kHz which allows you 100 channels each 200kHz wide.

obviously LW and VHF have different propagation characteristics - LW stations are likely to interfere with each other over greater distances.
Reply 3
Original post by Joinedup
I'm not sure the info on that sheet is all correct tbh - usually the term 'sidebands' is used for the power at frequencies surrounding the carrier, not 'side frequencies'

The points I think it's trying to make is that

* the bandwidth depends on the highest audio frequency you want to transmit (also FM transmits stereo channels - more bandwidth is required for stereo too)
* the number of broadcast stations possible in a frequency range depends on the number of bandwidths you can fit in that range.

e.g.AM/ LW broadcast frequencies run from 153kHz to 279kHz - the range is 126kHz which allows you to have 14 channels each 9khz 'wide'
FM/VHF frequencies run from 88000kHz to 108000kHz - the range is 20000kHz which allows you 100 channels each 200kHz wide.

obviously LW and VHF have different propagation characteristics - LW stations are likely to interfere with each other over greater distances.


Hey, thanks a lot but I don't really get that part on the LW stations are likely to interfere with each other over greater distances. If each have a bandwidth of 9kHz wide which are different, how is this possible?


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Original post by Sweet Rose
Hey, thanks a lot but I don't really get that part on the LW stations are likely to interfere with each other over greater distances. If each have a bandwidth of 9kHz wide which are different, how is this possible?


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I don't like the article at all. Not very explanatory and quite confusing.

The longer the wavelength, then the less susceptible the signal is to atmospheric attenuation, obstruction by large obstacles (buildings, trees etc.) causing shadows behind them, signal reflection causing multiple signal paths and hence signal cancellation at the receiver etc.

Because of the longer range of LW transmission, signals intended for a limited local regional area can therefore unintentionally interfere with signals from another transmitter in a different region if both transmitters operate on the same frequency.

For instance (illustration only not real): 200KHz LW transmissions in Berkshire (music), interfering with signals from 200KHz LW transmissions in Hertfordshire (local news), interfering with signals from 200KHz transmissions in London (documentary). They all transmit at the same carrier frequency with reception intended only for their immediate local regions only, but because of the longer range of the LW signals, they can be picked up by receivers at the other locations also and hence the wanted signal is overlaid with the unwanted signal.

The problem gets worse for SW and LW at night because these frequencies can bounce off the ionosphere and be tranmsmitted many hundreds or even thousands of miles over-the-horizon to interfere with local signals.

Ionospheric bounce is exploited in over-the-horizon radar, which can detect objects/vessels over large parts of the earths surface.
(edited 10 years ago)
Reply 5
Original post by uberteknik
I don't like the article at all. Not very explanatory and quite confusing.

The longer the wavelength, then the less susceptible the signal is to atmospheric attenuation, obstruction by large obstacles (buildings, trees etc.) causing shadows behind them, signal reflection causing multiple signal paths and hence signal cancellation at the receiver etc.

Because of the longer range of LW transmission, signals intended for a limited local regional area can therefore unintentionally interfere with signals from another transmitter in a different region because both transmitters operate on the same frequency.

For instance (illustration only not real): 200KHz LW transmissions in Berkshire (music), interfering with signals from 200KHz LW transmissions in Hertfordshire (local news), interfering with signals from 200KHz transmissions in London (documentary). They all transmit at the same carrier frequency with reception intended only for their immediate local regions only, but because of the longer range of the LW signals, they can be picked up by receivers at the other locations also and hence the wanted signal is overlaid with the unwanted signal.

The problem gets worse for SW and LW at night because these frequencies can bounce of the ionosphere and be tranmsmitted many hundreds or even thousands of miles over-the-horizon to interfere with local signals.

Ionospheric bounce is exploited in over-the-horizon radar, which can detect objects/vessels over large parts of the earths surface.


Thank you very much in your help. I was just wondering about the example that you have stated. From what I know, each station has their own specific bandwidth of frequency . Although they are all LW , they are transmitted at different frequency. Thus they will not interfere with the others, no?



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Original post by Sweet Rose
Thank you very much in your help. I was just wondering about the example that you have stated. From what I know, each station has their own specific bandwidth of frequency . Although they are all LW , they are transmitted at different frequency. Thus they will not interfere with the others, no?



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Yes of course. I used the fictitious example to illustrate the effects only. The government organisations responsible for allocating bandwidth within a country, will issue transmission licences to ensure there is minimal overlap. However, the rules for bandwidth allocation will generally specifiy an average range-radius from each transmitter with fewer cross-border international agreements in place.

When Amplitude Modulated LW and MW was prevalent as the transmission wavelength in the 20th century in Europe, there were so many stations closely packed in the radio spectrum, that it was very common for UK receivers to pick up unwanted transmissions from France, Belgium, Holland, Germany, Luxembourg, Denmark and even further afield on the same or similar frequencies.

These transmissions would interfere with lower power transmissions from local stations on the UK mainland and particulary at night and especially when atmospheric conditions were favourable.

In the 21st century, the UK no longer uses LW, MW. Even the BBC is closing down FM transmissions to free up bandwidth.
Reply 7
Original post by uberteknik

In the 21st century, the UK no longer uses LW, MW. Even the BBC is closing down FM transmissions to free up bandwidth.


on the contrary - my car radio receives nothing else . :smile:

probably I shouldn't have said obviously before, being rather old I played around with radios quite a lot when I was growing up before the web was invented. iirc everyone did and they'd have a feel for what stations you could get.

analogue radios are going to go the way of bicycle dynamos and all the other stuff that's useful for physics teacher explanations.

I always quite liked getting foreign stations tbh - felt a bit subversive. with DAB you only get to choose between the stations that the man has decided are appropriate for you.
Original post by Joinedup
on the contrary - my car radio receives nothing else . :smile:

probably I shouldn't have said obviously before, being rather old I played around with radios quite a lot when I was growing up before the web was invented. iirc everyone did and they'd have a feel for what stations you could get.

analogue radios are going to go the way of bicycle dynamos and all the other stuff that's useful for physics teacher explanations.

I always quite liked getting foreign stations tbh - felt a bit subversive. with DAB you only get to choose between the stations that the man has decided are appropriate for you.

lol. of course you are right, I should really have said 'started' the long road to analogues demise! boo hoo. :frown:

I hate DAB, iPods and most digital audio with a vengeance. I started out my love of electronics as a teenager through messing around with valve equipment and would avidly buy wireless world and practical electronics from Menzies every month. I am not old enough for Radio Caroline or the birth of Radio 1 even. But the BBC FM live concert broadcasts will be sorely and sadly missed when the switch over finally happens. My Quad ESL's will lose a part of themselves on that day. Thank goodness for vinyl.
Reply 9
Original post by uberteknik
lol. of course you are right, I should really have said 'started' the long road to analogues demise! boo hoo. :frown:

I hate DAB, iPods and most digital audio with a vengeance. I started out my love of electronics as a teenager through messing around with valve equipment and would avidly buy wireless world and practical electronics from Menzies every month. I am not old enough for Radio Caroline or the birth of Radio 1 even. But the BBC FM live concert broadcasts will be sorely and sadly missed when the switch over finally happens. My Quad ESL's will lose a part of themselves on that day. Thank goodness for vinyl.


Can't remember it either tbh though I do remember when medium wave stations were all known by wavelength rather than frequency.

which of course gives you a way of working out c if you can remember the before and after jingles
Original post by Joinedup
Can't remember it either tbh though I do remember when medium wave stations were all known by wavelength rather than frequency.

which of course gives you a way of working out c if you can remember the before and after jingles


The first receiver I ever made comprised an OA81 germanium diode detector, mica tuning cap' and crystal earpiece. The thrill of stumbling across the discovery of Capital Radio 539m was almost an epiphany!

That was as a 12 year old and I had many late nights (when the house was quiet enough) learning about things I probably shouldn't from Claire Rayner and Anna Raeburn!
Reply 11
Thanks a lot. I think I got more than I bargained for!😄


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