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A picture that will shock you to your core

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Could you all stop arguing over nonsensical things? It detracts from the main issue at hand - Syria is in a crisis and needs aid from foreign countries.
Reply 21
Prefer helping those closer to home....... as they say charity begins at home :smile:
Reply 22
Original post by TheStudent.
I'm not sure why people are complaining that the OP is resorting to guilt-tripping people into donating money - even if it wasn't intentional. I'm sure we've all seen advertisements on TV where charities do exactly that all the time.


I think the people are surprised at a more blatant form of guilt-tripping. It was intentional. Debate over charity tactics is fine by me, if it keeps this thread at the top of the 'recent discussions' page.
Reply 23
Original post by Alfissti
Prefer helping those closer to home....... as they say charity begins at home :smile:


That is reasonable and completely understandable. Though if you could spare even a little cash for this cause, that would be greatly appreciated.
Original post by Straight up G
I think the people are surprised at a more blatant form of guilt-tripping. It was intentional. Debate over charity tactics is fine by me, if it keeps this thread at the top of the 'recent discussions' page.


Hadn't thought of that :biggrin: anyway, thanks for bringing attention to the cause.
Reply 25
Original post by TimmonaPortella

I find it bizarre and perverse that most people seem to be okay with people being forced into foreign aid by way of taxation, but not with people being persuaded by guilt to give by choice.

And yes, the implication of the title is 'you shouldn't moan about any of your problems because these kids have worse problems'. Someone always has a worse problem. That doesn't mean no-one is ever entitled to a moan.


You're an educated man, and many aren't as logical as you.

That's an implication you make of your own accord tbf.
Original post by cid


EDIT TO ADD: I feel no guilt, I have not played a part in this suffering and have no reason to feel guilty, If you care so much why not sign up to an NGO or aid organization and go over and physically help ... oh wait you usually have to pay to do that right?


I don't feel guilty about what I have. I do feel guilty if I say no when I'm asked to make a barely noticeable sacrifice in favour of a good cause, such as a £2 donation. I think that's the guilt most charity plays on.

Original post by Straight up G
You're an educated man, and many aren't as logical as you.


That's an implication you make of your own accord tbf.


Ah, you flatter me, sir.

Others received the same implication as I did. But I don't think there's any need for us to argue about it. I think we can just say that suggesting to people that they have no right to moan about their own problems will not generally be well received, whether you did that or not.
(edited 10 years ago)
Reply 27
Original post by Straight up G
I've explained some of the aggressive tactics above. I do not and would not show this kind of behaviour in public.


I could beat the crap out of someone in on private property, then explain it and say I would never do it in public. I'd probably still be held culpable for my actions.


You say you have played no part in this suffering - and yet you're implicit in it by your bystanding. If I wanted to, I could concoct an analogy just as compelling as yours, concerning someone who viewed a murder, but I'll spare your time
.

I am implicit in nothing and your accusation highlights the despicable and immoral depths of those willing to play on human emotion to achieve their ends, it is manipulative and borderline psychopathic.

I'm definitely not a chugger in public, for one I've never been paid, and also it's against my own values to disrupt someone's day by aggressively hounding them.


Never said you was, but you seem adept in the application of such methods online.


Well, if you don't feel the guilt, that's fine. I always feel guilty when I think about situations like this and how lucky I am in life. I don't spend my life feeling guilty, but when I think about things like this, I do. I don't want to sound like some kind of holier-than-thou dick, that's just the way I feel.


Have no problems with you feeling guilt or appreciate your fortune in life, It is good to appreciate how good one has it. I do however have a problem with you actively using guilt as a tool, it is manipulation, using an emotion to effect a response, just as some use fear, you use guilt, the end goal DOES NOT justify the means.

Why have I personally not signed up to an NGO? Because I'm in the middle of my studies, with a responsibility owed to too many people in this country. I could not just drop everything and jump on a plane to Damascus. Have I considered it? Many times. I have, just so you know, flown to Pakistan with the intention of helping in flood relief efforts. I do what I can to help and when I saw this image, I had a TSR tab open and decided to share it on here.


Why don't you help with the flood relief here in the UK too? Just so you know i have built Mosques and community centres in Afghanistan, also right now sat on notice to help with the flood relief efforts here in the UK. Why don't you go and help these people too?

If I upset you with this post, then I regret that, but questioning my credentials and comparing me to a chugger isn't helpful to anyone.


I highly doubt you regret it, I never questioned your credentials I condemned your tactics, I'm sure you genuinely feel for these peoples plight and that is respectable, but as I said, you are harming your own cause by risking public apathy, not one likes to feel manipulated.
Reply 28
Original post by cid
I could beat the crap out of someone in on private property, then explain it and say I would never do it in public. I'd probably still be held culpable for my actions.


.

I am implicit in nothing and your accusation highlights the despicable and immoral depths of those willing to play on human emotion to achieve their ends, it is manipulative and borderline psychopathic.



Never said you was, but you seem adept in the application of such methods online.



Have no problems with you feeling guilt or appreciate your fortune in life, It is good to appreciate how good one has it. I do however have a problem with you actively using guilt as a tool, it is manipulation, using an emotion to effect a response, just as some use fear, you use guilt, the end goal DOES NOT justify the means.



Why don't you help with the flood relief here in the UK too? Just so you know i have built Mosques and community centres in Afghanistan, also right now sat on notice to help with the flood relief efforts here in the UK. Why don't you go and help these people too?



I highly doubt you regret it, I never questioned your credentials I condemned your tactics, I'm sure you genuinely feel for these peoples plight and that is respectable, but as I said, you are harming your own cause by risking public apathy, not one likes to feel manipulated.


Your consistently hostility surprises me, and I am going to guess that you have some previous in this area. It's nearly 4am and I am tired, so for now I'm going to repeat that if I caused you to be upset, then I regret that, for that was definitely not my intention at all. My aim was to raise awareness about an ongoing disaster, and for better or for worse, I used a different selection of methods to those which I have used in the past. Thank you for your feedback, I've genuinely learnt something today. I hope everything goes well if you are called upon for the flood relief effort, and I'll get round to answering your points tomorrow.
Original post by cid

Have no problems with you feeling guilt or appreciate your fortune in life, It is good to appreciate how good one has it. I do however have a problem with you actively using guilt as a tool, it is manipulation, using an emotion to effect a response, just as some use fear, you use guilt, the end goal DOES NOT justify the means.


Do you have a problem with government spending tax money on foreign aid?

Original post by cid

I am implicit in nothing and your accusation highlights the despicable and immoral depths of those willing to play on human emotion to achieve their ends, it is manipulative and borderline psychopathic.


Please, you're embarrassing yourself.

Saving a child's life does not justify persuading someone to save a child's life by making them consider how guilty they'd feel if they didn't, and if you try to persuade someone in that way you're a 'borderline psychopath'?

Don't be absurd.
(edited 10 years ago)
Reply 30
Original post by TheStudent.
Hadn't thought of that :biggrin: anyway, thanks for bringing attention to the cause.


lol somehow I don't think the new title does justice to the cause.
Reply 31
Original post by TimmonaPortella
Do you have a problem with government spending tax money on foreign aid?


No not at all, I do have a problem with charity organizations using said tax money to pay more than generous salaries to their managerial positions and cover for administrative costs that from what I have seen could be made a lot lower, except then people might be uncomfortable.

Not as uncomfortable as the people they are supposedly trying to help mind you, but then if they allowed that then no one would want to help these poor people.

Then after getting financial aid from the government, already paid out from my pocket, people attempt to guilt me into giving more?

My 'aggression' (which i believe is an intentional misreading of assertiveness) Is a natural reaction to having deflected blame placed on my shoulders for something I have taken no part in and something I am already indirectly helping by being a tax paying citizen. It is also a touch of annoyance at this guerrilla style of fund raising which as I have stated more than once harms the image of charity more more than helps in the long run.

We should think about the bigger picture instead of the singular issue of the present, we are already seeing a back lash from the public, a resentment towards putting money in the pockets of large charities, that posses a monopoly on aid giving. They do some good, but they make sure their nests are well lined before they do so

...and then they try to make us feel bad for owning a Mac (I mean you should feel bad for owning a Mac because apple are just terrible ...but that's beside the point)


edit to add:

Original post by TimmonaPortella




Please, you're embarrassing yourself.

Saving a child's life does not justify persuading someone to save a child's life by making them consider how guilty they'd feel if they didn't, and if you try to persuade someone in that way you're a 'borderline psychopath'?

Don't be absurd.


Actually emotional manipulation to achieve a goal is a common indication of psychopathy.
(edited 10 years ago)
Original post by Straight up G
lol somehow I don't think the new title does justice to the cause.


LOL who changed it?
Original post by Straight up G
I'm not going to deny guilt-tripping - it's a tactic which I never have and probably never will use in public, but it's the internet and I've got practically free reign. I don't see how it was patronising and quite disappointed (in myself) that you found that to be the case tbh


You wouldn't use this tactic in public but will when you are anonymous? Says something about you doesn't it?

It is patronizing when you criticize someone for buying something in their personal life. They could be doing good stuff as well you know? You also assume that we don't care about this kind of thing and it is up to you to make us see the way.

Also, no I don't feel guilty. I feel incredibly sorry for them, and am furious that they have to been in the situation they are in but I don't feel GUILTY necessarily. I'm not even from the countries involved in this war nor did I have ANY part in creating/maintaining it. Why feel GUILTY?

Lastly, I strongly suggest you stop with your guilt-tripping tactics and patronizing people if you really want them to help this situation somewhat. No one likes being talked down to and your tone only distracts people from your message. It makes one wonder whether you are truly doing this to help those people or just to make yourself feel better by putting others down.
Reply 34
Original post by TheStudent.
LOL who changed it?


Me, after taking on board the criticism lol. Thinking of a better one. Any ideas?
Original post by Straight up G
Me, after taking on board the criticism lol. Thinking of a better one. Any ideas?


I rather liked the old title :biggrin: I thought it was perfect :biggrin:
Original post by IndianDancer
You wouldn't use this tactic in public but will when you are anonymous? Says something about you doesn't it?

It is patronizing when you criticize someone for buying something in their personal life. They could be doing good stuff as well you know? You also assume that we don't care about this kind of thing and it is up to you to make us see the way.

Also, no I don't feel guilty. I feel incredibly sorry for them, and am furious that they have to been in the situation they are in but I don't feel GUILTY necessarily. I'm not even from the countries involved in this war nor did I have ANY part in creating/maintaining it. Why feel GUILTY?

Lastly, I strongly suggest you stop with your guilt-tripping tactics and patronizing people if you really want them to help this situation somewhat. No one likes being talked down to and your tone only distracts people from your message. It makes one wonder whether you are truly doing this to help those people or just to make yourself feel better by putting others down.


I don't think it says anything about him, his tone doesn't distract from his message and I highly doubt he wants to make himself feel better by putting others down. You're reading into it too much. If you feel so strongly about guilt-tripping tactics, then go petition against charities who shamelessly do it all the time.
Original post by cid

Actually emotional manipulation to achieve a goal is a common indication of psychopathy.


Surely it depends on your motive and how frequently you do it :confused:
Reply 38
Original post by IndianDancer
You wouldn't use this tactic in public but will when you are anonymous? Says something about you doesn't it?

It is patronizing when you criticize someone for buying something in their personal life. They could be doing good stuff as well you know? You also assume that we don't care about this kind of thing and it is up to you to make us see the way.

Also, no I don't feel guilty. I feel incredibly sorry for them, and am furious that they have to been in the situation they are in but I don't feel GUILTY necessarily. I'm not even from the countries involved in this war nor did I have ANY part in creating/maintaining it. Why feel GUILTY?

Lastly, I strongly suggest you stop with your guilt-tripping tactics and patronizing people if you really want them to help this situation somewhat. No one likes being talked down to and your tone only distracts people from your message. It makes one wonder whether you are truly doing this to help those people or just to make yourself feel better by putting others down.


If I could do this in public with everybody knowing my name but not holding it as a slight against the other street collectors, then I would have done so - to see the reaction. Anonymity is not really my issue.

I never assumed that every person reading this thread was uneducated about the topic. I have no idea why you thought that. I'm trying to bring the topic back into public awareness after little media attention recently. Do you level it against Oxfam when they show you pictures of naked, starving children in Africa? Clearly you already know that there's significant poverty over there.

Do you not feel guilty that by not contributing, you could be preventing someone from having the last morsel of food that could keep them alive, or similar? Without getting angry at me, why don't you think about the purpose of the guilt-tripping.

If you felt patronised, then I apologise for it and that was not the purpose. Likewise if you got upset. I've explained throughout this thread why I decided to use slightly more aggressive and alternative tactics. I hope you can put aside any dislike of my tactics and you decide to donate.
(edited 10 years ago)
Reply 39
Original post by TheStudent.
I rather liked the old title :biggrin: I thought it was perfect :biggrin:


Haha, well, you're the only poster so far that seemed fine with it so I guess the public is against it.

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