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Tips on adding more weight to my squats, stuck in 60-75kg region

First couple weeks of my 5x5 strong lift (3 days a week) were great, saw strength gains, but after a month or two, I noticed I was plateauing quite a lot, this isn't helpful when the aim of my routine is to add weight every session.

Is it possible that I am doing something that is hindering me from adding an extra 30kg or so to my squats or are my legs really that weak?
(edited 3 years ago)

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Reply 1
Well I think your plan of getting ass to grass squats is a good idea, so I'll focus on that. What you need to be doing is improving your hip mobility. When you go down, the point you get stuck it is the point where your hips need to go below your knees. What you'll find is that this is impossible unless you open your hips up (that is, your legs make a larger angle with the hips). This should feel pretty difficult to do. So you need to stretch the hip flexors. Here is a good video on how to do it:

[video="youtube;JBHzXF-mVjY"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBHzXF-mVjY[/video]

This guy is really good, I'd recommend him for any aspect of training.

You should do that dynamic stretching routine before your squat sessions.

Another thing to note is, when you see people doing an Ass to Grass squat on youtube, they might be using olympic weightlifting shoes. These have a stiff raised heel (about an inch) which allows greater stability and allows you to go deeper. So don't be upset if you can't get full depth, it is very difficult without these shoes.

I'd recommend those shoes to a lifter that is looking to get to an advanced level, it certainly improved my squat, but you are looking at around £90+.


OK now as for your stalling. Another important thing is that there are two different bar positions for the squat. If you have it resting around your shoulders and on the upper traps muscle, this is called high bar. High bar allows better depth, and incorporates the glute muscles much more, and is generally used in olympic weightlifting. Low bar is when you have the bar a bit lower, on the shelf above your shoulder blades. Low bar allows you to squat MORE weight, but it involves the hamstrings more. Low bar is actually more similar to the deadlift, than the High bar, and perhaps the reason you are stalling on the squat is that you are exhausted from doing two movements that are very similar and training them both heavy several times a week.

If you switched to high bar, you might find it less fatiguing. I'd recommend high bar. My advice to you for your training is to start doing all of these stretches, make sure you do high bar squats and have a look at this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zoZWgTrZLd8

Note: the guy who wrote stronglifts doesn't actually have a great record of weightlifting, and while he wrote a good program (under the supervision of someone who's actually decent), I wouldn't necessarily recommend him for training advice.


EDIT: You know with Strong Lifts you are meant to do all 5 working sets at the same weight? Stick with the program!
EDIT2: If you are cutting you should expect to add 2.5kg every OTHER session at the very best! As someone who has cut 15kg basically on Strong Lifts, and also gained around 8kg on Strong Lifts, I can tell you how incredibly faster it is when you are bulking. My advice to you as someone who's been on a similar path to you is to cut very slowly. I'd say TDEE - 500 calories at the very least. Make sure you get a good 1g protein/kg bodyweight. The slower you cut, the less muscle you will lose. When the time comes to bulk you will be really happy you did that.
EDIT3: You know that 80kg Squat to a 110kg Deadlift is actually a pretty normal ratio. That would suggest you are just as good at both. You can use this website to compare yourself against usual standards of strength. http://www.strstd.com/
(edited 10 years ago)
Where to start. This is going to be a long post, I apologise.

45kg shoulder press and 60kg squat would be a ridiculous strength imbalance. It suggests that your technique is poor, to be honest.

One thing I immediately see is that you are not warming up nearly enough. This is almost certainly the reason your squat weight is so erratic. By the time you get to your work sets you should be warm, loose and ready to go. A couple of half-arsed sets with the bar or 40kg is not going to do this. Warm up sets are just as important as work sets, and are an opportunity for you to focus on your technique, so that you are ready to apply it to your work sets. Do lots of warm ups. Do not increase the weight until you are happy your technique with that weight is rock solid. That means you are getting low enough, you are tight enough, you're following the right cues, et cetera. If that means you do five sets with the bar, so be it. Warm up sets should not be easy. You should be squeezing every muscle, from your upper back to your hips and especially your core, as much as possible, just as you would on a max squat. They should be quick, they should be powerful. Even I, as someone who can squat about 2.5xbw, end up puffing after a set of 8 with the bar, because squeezing every muscle you use in the squat is difficult, even with a light weight.

Hell, even with no weight. Try it now. If your breathing isn't affected by a few deep, bw squats, you are being lazy.

The reason you're not getting low enough is because you're doing a sumo stance. There is no reason for you to do this. Feet should be a comfortable shoulder width, it'll make getting down a lot easier. Sumo can sometimes be useful for powerlifters who want to lift the maximum weight once, in a competition, to just parallel, but it is a crap way for a beginner to train for strength. There is a huge difference between moving as much weight as possible in the short term, and increasing strength in the long term. Stop it.

It is also one of the reasons you are bending over at the bottom. This isn't necessarily bad for your back, as long as you are bending at the hips rather than the spine, but as a beginner you probably want to bring your stance in and try to keep your chest up as much as possible. Everyone's going to bend slightly, but tbh 45 degrees is a lot, and if you're doing that at lighter weights it's not surprising you're being pushed down with heavier weights. I squat low-bar and yes, it means you're going to be further forward than with high bar, but you never want to focus on trying to bend down. That angle should be purely a by-product of pushing your hips back as you get into the hole.

The thing I would have you look at here is your upper back. It needs to be tight, and I mean uncomfortably tight. Bring your hands in until it is difficult to then get yourself under the bar, but not so much that it hurts your shoulders. Find that shelf in your rear delts, it may well not be as low as you think. Squeeze your upper back as much as possible and pull your elbows forwards and down. It will keep your chest up and back tight. Holding that position should be difficult. It should be something you have to focus on the whole lift. If you just grip onto the bar and forget about it, and you lose your upper back tightness, the weight will bend you over, both literally and metaphorically.

You also want to take a deep breath and really squeeze it inside you. This will keep your core tight and your back straight. You suggest that you are pulling your stomach in. You want to do exactly the opposite. Breath deeply into your belly as much as you possibly can, expanding your belly as much as possible, and then squeeze it hard. I hope this is what you meant by pulling your stomach in, because actually pulling your stomach in would be terrible.

Also stop doing leg presses. If you are squatting every workout you don't need them. They're crap anyway.

But yea, if you can't add 2.5kg to your squat every session at this stage you are doing something wrong, be it technique or just going to heavy too soon.
(edited 3 years ago)
Reply 3
Volume my friend, increase your volume.
Sorry, what I was saying in terms of warm-ups is that you want to work-up in terms of weight until you get to your work sets. But if you do the bar or any other weight and think 'that didn't feel quite right' then you should do another set with the same until it does. No one is going to walk in off the street and have all their muscles supple and firing and the technique ready in their head, no matter how practised they are. It always takes me a good number of warmup sets to get in the groove, before I'm ready for heavy sets. When I lift just the bar, I want it to feel strong and explosive. I want to get low enough, and I want to stay in the strongest positions. In the same way as a heavier set, the tighter you are, the more you squeeze your muscles, the more powerful the rep will be. This is how you want to practise every rep.

With a light weight, that is obviously a lot less taxing. It's worth saying though that you don't want to overdo volume in your work-sets either, and tire yourself for the bigger weights, so I always drop the number of reps the closer I get to my work sets.

And yea, I think you could be surprised by the difference having a really full belly of air to squeeze can make. Feels a lot stronger, especially at the bottom of the lift, and really helps you squeeze the weight up. Helps you keep your back tight and straight, which is what your core is for really.

Raising the heel can help with flexibility, but it's more of a short term fix. You should be able, long term, to increase hamstring flexibility till you can get in a good position unaided. That said, I think ATG is overrated. You should definitely be able to get below parallel, but other than that you should go as low as your flexibility allows, but no lower as it will likely make your lower back round. ATG is good for those who can manage it, but not for those who can't.

One more thing, don't forget, arch your back and push your hips back are excellent cues to follow, to keep yourself in a strong position.
(edited 3 years ago)
Get a video up so we can assess your form. No excuses, everyone has a smart phone nowadays.
Sensible spacing of weight, but sets of 5 with 5kg below your work weight will tire you out for your work sets.

Below 50% do however many sets and reps you like and it's not likely to tire you too much, but above that you should be decreasing reps as you go up in weight. I'd only do a single, or maybe a double, with 75 in that situation, to be honest.

I'd probably do:
20xwhatever
35x5
50x4
60x3
70x2
75x1
80x4x5

It doesn't matter that much, as long as you feel ready by the time you do your work sets, you'll work out what feels best for you. I don't want to be prescriptive, I play it by ear a fair amount and move up my warmup weights as and when I feel ready. As you get stronger and your work weight increases, you'll probably want to make bigger jumps, but you'll need a bigger warmup to prepare you for bigger weights, so bear that in mind.
(edited 3 years ago)
Reply 7
Pretty sure it's really bad for the tendons in your knees when you 'springs back up.


Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by Reps4Jesus
Pretty sure it's really bad for the tendons in your knees when you 'springs back up.


Posted from TSR Mobile


No.





Watch something like "so you think you can squat" or some of candito's stuff on youtube there's reems of info out there. Pretty sound advice for the most part

If you have the flexibility to go ATG it's more badass, it doesn't have any great effect on you progressing.

It is not a spring motion, when regular squatting, you hit the stretch reflex and then power upwards. Then you lock out and ready yourself for the next rep.

If your stuck squatting, you need to sort your technique out (post a vid if you need help on the technique thread) and sort your diet out.
(edited 3 years ago)
I know you're getting contradictory advice. Squatting can be a controversial topic, that is the nature of life. All I will say is that I'm better!

Yea, that's not a bad idea at all. Just always bear in mind that you want to be super ready, ut not tired, by the time you get to your work sets.
(edited 3 years ago)
Reply 10
On what is known as the "stretch reflex" at the bottom of the squat, you definitely want to do this. Essentially you recruit more muscle fibres when you use the stretch reflex, using a sort of fight or flight response from the brain. yYu can read about it here http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_does_a_stretch_reflex_occur?. This results in overall better development.

As for ATG, really it is about your goals. People do ATG in particular if they want to get good at olympic lifts, whereas Parallel Squats are practised in powerlifting because you want to make the squat as strong as possible. I think what everyone can agree on is that parallel squatting or below is a must, and that going any higher is ineffective training.

Keep at it mate, there are quite a lot of intricacies to this game and if you want the best feedback at this stage without wanting to gain your PhD in squatting, it would be better if you posted a form video. You can post it in places like bodybuilding.com, and Candito does form checks too.

edit: You know sometimes people switch it down to 3 sets of 5 on their main compound lifts in Stronglifts when they are cutting because the 5x5 makes it too hard to recover from. You could give that a go.
(edited 3 years ago)
Reply 11
I don't think the problem is your stretch reflex. I have terrible stretch reflex control at higher weights so I don't tend to properly explode out of the hole. As long as you're either consistently using the stretch reflex or consistently not, you'll progress.

How much do you weigh and how much has it changed over time, how much are you eating?
(edited 10 years ago)
Reply 12
Your weight seems fine, it's not like you're a skinny who can't stuff down enough. There are a few things it could be but none of them require a complete overhaul and you'd want to improve them anyway (e.g. like you said, mobility, warmup etc) so you might as well do them all. If it's working now, keep at it!
Reply 13
3x5 is too much volume. If your squats are getting tough then you should be pretty tired by the time you get to deadlifts, how can you still manage 3x5 then? To be honest if the subsequent reps after the first rep are easier, it gives me the impression that you are bouncing the bar off the floor. It is called a dead lift for a reason. After every rep you have to let the bar go dead. If you still find that it is easier on the later reps then it is possible that you are not properly warmed up for the first rep, but that seems unlikely.

As for the belt, It is always beneficial to keep doing beltless squats and deadlifts now and again.

EDIT: Oh and there is technically no stretch reflex in the deadlift because you don't start from the locked out position like in bench press and squat, you start from the opposite, so you don't have ANY potential energy from the bottom. This is actually the reason why there isn't deadlift 3x per week in Stronglifts, it is much harder to recover from heavy deadlifts than heavy squats.
(edited 3 years ago)
Reply 14
Sounds like decent deadlift form to me. Maybe you just really get into it mid set. Then the only possibilities really are better warmup or man up. What I like to do for my deadlift warm up is actually to do heavy ish singles before my working set. For example my working set is 150kg x5 at the moment, so I'd do 5x 60kg (I always do this no matter the weight, just to get my form right, and to tell my legs to get going after squats), then 5x 80kg, 5x 100kg, then something like 3x 120kg, 1x135kg. This could help you with that first rep.

As for the belt, well I started at around 90kg squats for my belt, and I do ATG squats. I might get some criticism for this because there are lots of opinions on the matter. I'd say it doesn't harm using it, but make sure you use it properly (breathe against it as hard as you can), and also do beltless for most of your warmup sets, except for the last 1, so you can be ready for the working sets. I don't actually use a belt for deadlifts, it never felt quite right for me. But regardless, always do some days with no belt now and again, it will improve your lifting with the belt. Also the belt will add a nice bit of weight to your squat, so be aware of that.
(edited 3 years ago)
Reply 15
You should take a giant breath, and keep breathing in until you reach the bottom of the squat, then as soon as you apply the force on the way back up, hold it tightly and flex your abs as hard as you can. This will help a lot with your core stability on the way up, probably help your lower back out a lot. This technique stays the same regardless of belt or not. Your form should not change at all with a belt.
(edited 3 years ago)
Reply 16
Haven't read everything in this thread but my advice is to mix up the weight rep ranges.

Also, don't do any low rep heavy stuff at the minute, unless you know your form is spot on.
I know exactly what you mean, used to happen to me when I used to max rep deadlifts. You're getting the benefit of some stretch reflex on subsequent reps, even if you let go, which is fine. But it's all technique, really. Stretch reflex be damned, if you can get a weight for 5 you can get it for one, not the other way round, just sounds like your set-up needs some work. Could be a lot of things, it's hard to say really, but there are a lot of good articles out there. When you fail, where do you fail?

Things that do help though are having as big a breath as possible when you start, having your feet in the right position, having your hips in the right position (not too high or low) and 'pulling the slack out of the bar' (look it up).

I wouldn't be surprised actually if your hips start much lower on your first rep than subsequent reps, actually. Seen it before. If you start in a really inefficient position, as you tire, your body will try to pull you into a more efficient one.

1 work set categorically does not mean no warm-ups. Do warm-ups in the same way you would for squats. You need to be really warm, ready and psyked up to hit a big deadlift.




Going down slowly is tiring, pointless and even dangerous. I always effectively drop it. My hands stay in contact all the way down, but I'm not resisting it. Yea it makes a bang, but it makes more sense in every other way.


You don't really need a belt yet, but if you have one might as well use it. I used to buy the whole beltless=abs thing, but I'm just not sure it's true any more.



This is because you're not warming up.
(edited 3 years ago)
Don't bother with a belt at all. When people can't differentiate core strength and abs then they're not worth listening to. Are you going on a powerlift meet and wanna try a new 1RM? No. Then ditch the belt. Get the whole kinetic chain I.e. your body, strong all over as one unit. The belt will become a crutch and tbh even 3 plates is mediocre squatting. There's absolutely no reason you can't do double bodyweight without a belt. No offence but you can barely squat and you're looking at a belt already? This is like the typical newb looking at shiny supplements and thinking he's gonna become crazy strong swallowing a few shakes. Seriously. Nail the basics. Stop worrying about the fluff

Sent from my HTC One
(edited 10 years ago)
Reply 19
It's not really necessary for training and bodybuilding.

[video="youtube;KfJnXV1604g"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KfJnXV1604g[/video]

When it comes to Squats/form candito is the guy to go to. I don't really follow Hulse, the only thing he's good for in my opinion is how to stretch.
(edited 3 years ago)

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