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Semi target uni Bristol, Durham, Nottingham, KCL to MM IB

How many semi-target uni (Bristol, Durham, Nottingham, KCL) students do you guys reckon get into Middle Market IB?

Obviously 90% of the BB/Elite Boutique FO roles are filled out by top 6 universities and a very few semi target school students who make it to BB seems to fill out sales roles rather than IBD roles (not saying it's impossible).

So, people in top schools who didn't make it to BB will go for MM or boutiques IB but do you guys think there will be a higher proportion/representation of semi target folks at MM IBD (e.g HSBC)?

If anyone knows, where do most semi target kids end up going if they're set for IB after graduation?

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Original post by spark27
How many semi-target uni (Bristol, Durham, Nottingham, KCL) students do you guys reckon get into Middle Market IB?

Obviously 90% of the BB/Elite Boutique FO roles are filled out by top 6 universities and a very few semi target school students who make it to BB seems to fill out sales roles rather than IBD roles (not saying it's impossible).

So, people in top schools who didn't make it to BB will go for MM or boutiques IB but do you guys think there will be a higher proportion/representation of semi target folks at MM IBD (e.g HSBC)?

If anyone knows, where do most semi target kids end up going if they're set for IB after graduation?


So many factors come into consideration and this is such a vague question.

In short, yes: But you need something more than just a 2:1 or 1st to bring to the table. Even once you have that, you need to leverage it, to be in the running. Once in the interviews/ACs, you're generally at an equal footing if you have the knowledge/competencies to match up.

That's just my experience from watching a team member go through the recruitment process.
Reply 2
Original post by spark27
How many semi-target uni (Bristol, Durham, Nottingham, KCL) students do you guys reckon get into Middle Market IB?


Exactly 17.
Reply 3
Semi-targets that dont get into banking end up working at the Big 4 and the likes, and cry themselves to sleep every night because they weren't good enough to get into a good university.
Reply 4
Would you not consider Manchester as a semi-target? Would I regret going for Manchester instead of Notts?
Original post by MAINE.
Semi-targets that dont get into banking end up working at the Big 4 and the likes, and cry themselves to sleep every night because they weren't good enough to get into a good university.


Cry haha... Wait, so if you end up at the Big 4 (accounting?), how much worse would your pay be lol? What kind of salaries could you still get?
Original post by Wisefire
Cry haha... Wait, so if you end up at the Big 4 (accounting?), how much worse would your pay be lol? What kind of salaries could you still get?


Audit has about a starting salary of ~27k pro rata. Although, progression is fairly decent once you pass your exams. In my opinion, it's mind numbingly boring to even bother with. Each to their own.
Original post by Abdul-Karim
Audit has about a starting salary of ~27k pro rata. Although, progression is fairly decent once you pass your exams.


Ah, auditing... No way. Checked how much auditing can get. No more than about £35k in some instances. So, wait, there are people who go to top unis like the semi-targets that are stuck with jobs at this sort of pay cos all the good ones have already been taken up, in this field? Wow. I'd be worried if 5 years down the line I'm no further than £35k. Yeah, if I was stuck with just auditing I would never take it; I'm aware how unsatisfying/boring it is. I mean, if I end up at KCL, I actually doubt I can still get a top job anywhere/in any field.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by Wisefire
Ah, auditing... No way. Checked how much auditing can get. No more than about £35k in some instances. So, wait, there are people who go to top unis like the semi-targets that are stuck with jobs at this sort of pay cos all the good ones have already been taken up, in this field? Wow. I'd be worried if 5 years down the line I'm no further than £35k.


It's situational. Some people at targets also work at Big4. Although university brand is taken into account... it doesn't override a decision to the extent where an obviously better candidate will be rejected in said persons favour.
Original post by makrxx
Would you not consider Manchester as a semi-target? Would I regret going for Manchester instead of Notts?



It's a semi-target. I would say it's a target for AM.
Reply 10
Original post by Wisefire
Ah, auditing... No way. Checked how much auditing can get. No more than about £35k in some instances. So, wait, there are people who go to top unis like the semi-targets that are stuck with jobs at this sort of pay cos all the good ones have already been taken up, in this field? Wow. I'd be worried if 5 years down the line I'm no further than £35k. Yeah, if I was stuck with just auditing I would never take it; I'm aware how unsatisfying/boring it is. I mean, if I end up at KCL, I actually doubt I can still get a top job anywhere/in any field.



Don't discount Audit so easily Big 4 audit is very well respected for good reason(i've met Big 4 Alum in plenty of MO positions) and also personally know a guy from Big 4 Audit in a target business school for his MBA. Audit itself is very boring but don't discount the doors it opens up you certainly won't be pigeonholed.
Original post by Wisefire
Ah, auditing... No way. Checked how much auditing can get. No more than about £35k in some instances. So, wait, there are people who go to top unis like the semi-targets that are stuck with jobs at this sort of pay cos all the good ones have already been taken up, in this field? Wow. I'd be worried if 5 years down the line I'm no further than £35k. Yeah, if I was stuck with just auditing I would never take it; I'm aware how unsatisfying/boring it is. I mean, if I end up at KCL, I actually doubt I can still get a top job anywhere/in any field.


No need to be overly fixated about this target/semi-target business. Get into the best uni you can/where you will succeed the most and then carry this mindset onward.

(Just for the record, you are pretty incorrect about audit. After qualification you're looking around the 42-45k mark in London. Partners make hundreds of thousands + Plenty of people from the top unis there, a lot of them by choice)

You're outlook is quite naive, though this will change the more exposure you get to these sorts of careers.
Original post by Tomatochuckers
No need to be overly fixated about this target/semi-target business. Get into the best uni you can/where you will succeed the most and then carry this mindset onward.

(Just for the record, you are pretty incorrect about audit. After qualification you're looking around the 42-45k mark in London. Partners make hundreds of thousands + Plenty of people from the top unis there, a lot of them by choice)

You're outlook is quite naive, though this will change the more exposure you get to these sorts of careers.


I hope so. Indeed, I do need to educate myself more about other careers at one point... What I fear of is the idea of me getting to a top 8 or even top 12 RG, but am still unable to get into the City, or for that matter any job that can pay close to 6 figures. I fear I could become an unlucky one locked out of the huge opportunities everybody else around me has, stuck at no more than £50k for all my life like some underused wimp. I actually need a good salary, if anything to simply play catch up to the average net worth of a Londoner (£460k, if you ignore how you need to own equity). I'm not at that, and need to get to at least that... It's funny, considering my household income is over the median eighth decile. I've got to get to that, and may very well struggle to get to simply that; let alone the idea of exceeding it by nearly twice (a kind of general goal of mine). I fear the idea of being stuck in a dead end job that won't put me in the upper-middle class. Not getting into the City severely hinders the opportunities I have to earn £100k+ by a relatively young age (35 max). Ha, and of course, the lucky, smart or privileged ones up there, in the City, get to a meagre £100k LONG before that.

I don't think people fully know or appreciate how good the exit opportunities are if you leave the City after 15 years, say...

One thing I have is the LITERAL offer of assistance to get into banking from one guy (the wealthiest person in my year as well lol), and, I suppose, a general backing from my peers... My extremely well connected, wealthy peers. I don't want to get complacent and think I should be fine, cos I don't know them well enough yet, but they may help. If I can't get in, I hope actuary or accounting can give me a satisfying and extremely (not very) rewarding career. Or, at least enough money for me to invest significantly.

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(edited 9 years ago)
Reply 13
Original post by Wisefire
Ha, and of course, the lucky, smart or privileged ones up there, in the City, get to a meagre £100k LONG before that.


Exactly what statistics are you basing this statement on?
Original post by Wisefire
I hope so. Indeed, I do need to educate myself more about other careers at one point... What I fear of is the idea of me getting to a top 8 or even top 12 RG, but am still unable to get into the City, or for that matter any job that can pay close to 6 figures. I fear I could become an unlucky one locked out of the huge opportunities everybody else around me has, stuck at no more than £50k for all my life like some underused wimp. I actually need a good salary, if anything to simply play catch up to the average net worth of a Londoner (£460k, if you ignore how you need to own equity). I'm not at that, and need to get to at least that... It's funny, considering my household income is over the median eighth decile. I've got to get to that, and may very well struggle to get to simply that; let alone the idea of exceeding it by nearly twice (a kind of general goal of mine). I fear the idea of being stuck in a dead end job that won't put me in the upper-middle class. Not getting into the City severely hinders the opportunities I have to earn £100k+ by a relatively young age (35 max). Ha, and of course, the lucky, smart or privileged ones up there, in the City, get to a meagre £100k LONG before that.

I don't think people fully know or appreciate how good the exit opportunities are if you leave the City after 15 years, say...

One thing I have is the LITERAL offer of assistance to get into banking from one guy (the wealthiest person in my year as well lol), and, I suppose, a general backing from my peers... My extremely well connected, wealthy peers. I don't want to get complacent and think I should be fine, cos I don't know them well enough yet, but they may help. If I can't get in, I hope actuary or accounting can give me a satisfying and extremely (not very) rewarding career. Or, at least enough money for me to invest significantly.

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Bud, drop this whole comparison thing with everyone else.

Try your best at each stage to tick all the boxes and do as well as you can and see where you get to - don't worry about other people or what they have. That isn't the way to money, happiness or a successful career. What matters is how you perform relative to yourself and keep pushing yourself.

I don't sit here and compare myself to Lloyd Blankfein and think what a **** life I have. I sit here and think I have a great life because my living standards are the best they've ever been in my life - although miles below everyone else.

You're good in that you're motivated, but it's not the right type or way, what you've got is really unhealthy. I'm telling you now because it will hit you like a brick wall in future and it won't be pretty.

Your motivation for the City shouldn't be about catching up with other people, it's about yourself and what you want to achieve with your own life (and not for the sake of what other people have.)

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Original post by ahpadt
Exactly what statistics are you basing this statement on?


FO positions, adding in bonuses (although these days it's actually salaries being bumped and bonuses cut) can exceed well over £100k a year of course... I'm referring to young traders (those in their twenties, which is years ahead of getting there aged 33), bankers and of course all those in senior positions, like directors. Salaries have been bumped by 170% for some (source for that: a director at a bank told me that's what happened to him on a workshop I was at).

Original post by will2348
Bud, drop this whole comparison thing with everyone else.

Try your best at each stage to tick all the boxes and do as well as you can and see where you get to - don't worry about other people or what they have. That isn't the way to money, happiness or a successful career. What matters is how you perform relative to yourself and keep pushing yourself.

I don't sit here and compare myself to Lloyd Blankfein and think what a **** life I have. I sit here and think I have a great life because my living standards are the best they've ever been in my life - although miles below everyone else.

You're good in that you're motivated, but it's not the right type or way, what you've got is really unhealthy. I'm telling you now because it will hit you like a brick wall in future and it won't be pretty.

Your motivation for the City shouldn't be about catching up with other people, it's about yourself and what you want to achieve with your own life (and not for the sake of what other people have.)

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You're right and I totally accept that. However, two things: firstly, having calculated it all, my personal goal, and what's going to solve these career anxieties/concerns of mine, is to see myself being successful enough to earn an £85k+ salary really (£55k actual money flow) in London. This comparison thing I do which you got on to is me putting into perspective how many people do get there, and THEN how many people also continue to go even further, again a fair few going much, much further. That's all brilliant and a bonus to me.

Secondly, I'm just fixated on seeing the most optimistic picture, not the average or pessimistic one. This comparison thing, which I can see what you mean, probably comes from how I've just been around vastly more successful people than me (well, the children of them) for a long time. It's done things to my attitude, I accept. You put it in a lovely way though: your own living standards are the best they've ever been, so well done, young IB-er(?) :smile: I only ask to become upper-middle class, maybe mildly rich. I won't pity myself for not becoming properly rich/a millionaire. But it could happen if I get far enough and work long enough. Irrelevant point that though.

I totally agree and actually do go by your mindset. I respect that.

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(edited 9 years ago)
Reply 16
Original post by Wisefire
FO positions, adding in bonuses (although these days it's actually salaries being bumped and bonuses cut) can exceed well over £100k a year of course... I'm referring to young traders (those in their twenties, which is years ahead of getting there aged 33), bankers and of course all those in senior positions, like directors. Salaries have been bumped by 170% for some (source for that: a director at a bank told me that's what happened to him on a workshop I was at).


I can't see that money fest going on for forever. It is only a matter of time before banks are put under even stricter rules and regulations.
Original post by ahpadt
I can't see that money fest going on for forever. It is only a matter of time before banks are put under even stricter rules and regulations.


Lol. Well, my hunches say otherwise. Simply, consider how 94% of wealth in the UK is owned by 2% of its citizens... Honestly though, don't view the successful negatively, however they got there; that's the way to always evade wealth yourself. Call me a sycophant. I'm not, at all; but I have a point.
Reply 18
Original post by Wisefire
Honestly though, don't view the successful negatively


Original post by Wisefire
Call me a sycophant. I'm not, at all; but I have a point


Dat generalisation. Money is also not the only measurement in determining whether someone or something is successful. You should probably go to university and work for a few years before you speak like one who knows it all about success.

Given the choice of working in a booming engineering company and FO analyst in a fancy bank, I know which I would choose. Banking is not the only route to success.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by ahpadt
Dat generalisation. Money is also not the only measurement in determining whether someone or something is successful. You should probably go to university and work for a few years before you speak like one who knows it all about success.

Given the choice of working in a booming engineering company and FO analyst in a fancy bank, I know which I would choose. Banking is not the only route to success.


You'd value money far more if you saw upfront how much it can alleviate, enlighten, strengthen and better oneself, whilst STILL keeping your 'humble' values if you wanted to. The good life, privileged... And either as you being a somewhat biased/deluded champagne socialist (it's the champagne ones that never get their cause quite right, and I can confirm that, as an ex-Socialist, and now Anarcho-Capitalist), OR as someone who's career-orientated, with a money-making mindset. Personally, I once held enough cockiness to level myself as a mercenary. I'm not one, yet. As one whose almost accidentally been introduced into a world of knowing people with brilliant privileges, I can tell you I've observed many things. I won't go any further than that. But know this: socioeconomic ostracism is innate. I successfully defied it up to where I am now, and I don't see myself not at least trying to break and excel up the class system of this world anytime soon. Money is a lot to me up to a certain point.

The scenario you presented isn't even half bad. A (decent) engineering job at a 'booming' company still gets you paid £90k+, no? If not, move to the States, where engineers are valued, respected and paid much more.

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