The Student Room Group

Ask an Admissions Tutor V, 18 August -12 September

Hello everyone and well done to everyone who got their A2 and AS results last week and especially to those who had their offers confirmed at Cambridge. As promised in this last thread, I am back to answer more questions about Cambridge admissions (and indeed admissions to Christ's College) until Friday 19 September.

To repeat the opening to last year's thread from ths time, I can't give specific advice as to whether this or that UMS will get you a place but I will provide a very rough guide here which will hopefully give you some sort of benchmark.

The average Cambridge applicant has about a 89% UMS average across their best three subjects and the average offer holder has about 94% average across their top 3 subjects. This does vary somewhat from subject to subject, with the average rising for both applicants and offer holders in the most popular subjects (such as Medicine, Engineering, Economics, Law, Nat Sci).

The average Cambridge entrant achieves just over 2.7 A*s at A Level, with Scientists achieving on average just over 3 A*s and Arts & Humanities students between 2 and 2.5.

If your top 3 UMS or Science UMS average is below 85% and there are not significant extenuating circumstances then it is unlikely that you will be called for interview. This number will rise somewhat in the more competitive subjects though there is no firm cut off and it will vary from college to college, from year to year and from subject to subject.

These are all just averages remember and each candidate is treated individually and UMS, important as it is, is not the be-all and end-all.

Anyway, I hope that is a useful summary and with that in mind do please fire away...

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Reply 1
Hi,

I recently received my A level results and am really pleased with them (4A*). I will be applying for physical natural sciences for 2015 entry (post A level) and I have a few questions.

1. I retook C3 maths module (sat this summer) and my score improved from 86 UMS to 100 UMS, which of these results would be used in calculating my averages?

2. I heard that along with the SUMS and Maths/physics UMS averages there is also a maths UMS average being used this year, is this the case for physical natural sciences? Also which average would be the most relevant for this subject given that I am looking to specialise in physics in later years?

Thanks for taking the time to answer these queries.
Hi there, many congratulations on your results.

1. We use the higher mark when calculating the average, so it is your resit of 100 UMS that will count. You still have to record the other mark in the SAQ so we can see that it has been resat.

2. The subject moderation spreadsheets which outlines the paper application of every candidate in every subject, have several columns for averages and have done for some time. They are a) Best 3 average b) Best 4 average c) Science average (SUMS) d) Maths & Physics average and e) Maths average. For Physical Natural Scientists, c, d and e are all important. It is c) (the SUMS) which determines things like automatic pooling and your place in the spreadsheet but d) & e) are helpful too, especially if you are planning on focusing on Physics.

It is worth poitning out, of course, that all this information is taken from the UCAS and SAQ forms and is, therefore, already available to Admissions Tutors and Directors of Studies and we will often use the SAQ to look more closely at individual modules than the spreadsheet allow. Taken alone the averages may be misleading, a 96% Maths average from three modules, for instance, may not be as impressive as a 94% average from six modules. Therefore, we don't use the spreadsheet averages in isolation, they are looked at contextually, as is everything.
Reply 3
Thank you for re-activating this thread which should be of great use to Cambridge applicants. I have three questions for your advice or reply:

a) For application to Land Economy, which are the three subjects to be considered most relevant in the process. The four AS subjects that have been taken were Maths, Economics, Chemistry and Biology (best three have average UMS is 95; whilst average four is 93), and I am thinking of dropping Chemistry in A2, Would the other three A2 subjects consitute a competitive application?
b) Would FM taken at AS level be desirable for applying Land Economy in coming year?
c) Given that Christ College makes use of interview (only) for assessing applicants, what sorts of questions we would expect or in what way should applicants prepare for interview as the LE comprises a very broad areas of law, economics and environment, especially for a canadidate who may not have in depth knowledge of law or environmental science.

Many thanks indeed.
Reply 4
Original post by Christ's Admissions
Hi there, many congratulations on your results.

1. We use the higher mark when calculating the average, so it is your resit of 100 UMS that will count. You still have to record the other mark in the SAQ so we can see that it has been resat.

2. The subject moderation spreadsheets which outlines the paper application of every candidate in every subject, have several columns for averages and have done for some time. They are a) Best 3 average b) Best 4 average c) Science average (SUMS) d) Maths & Physics average and e) Maths average. For Physical Natural Scientists, c, d and e are all important. It is c) (the SUMS) which determines things like automatic pooling and your place in the spreadsheet but d) & e) are helpful too, especially if you are planning on focusing on Physics.

It is worth poitning out, of course, that all this information is taken from the UCAS and SAQ forms and is, therefore, already available to Admissions Tutors and Directors of Studies and we will often use the SAQ to look more closely at individual modules than the spreadsheet allow. Taken alone the averages may be misleading, a 96% Maths average from three modules, for instance, may not be as impressive as a 94% average from six modules. Therefore, we don't use the spreadsheet averages in isolation, they are looked at contextually, as is everything.


Thanks for getting back to me, the information you have given is really helpful. I'll let you know if I have any other questions.
Original post by wltang
Thank you for re-activating this thread which should be of great use to Cambridge applicants. I have three questions for your advice or reply:

a) For application to Land Economy, which are the three subjects to be considered most relevant in the process. The four AS subjects that have been taken were Maths, Economics, Chemistry and Biology (best three have average UMS is 95; whilst average four is 93), and I am thinking of dropping Chemistry in A2, Would the other three A2 subjects consitute a competitive application?
b) Would FM taken at AS level be desirable for applying Land Economy in coming year?
c) Given that Christ College makes use of interview (only) for assessing applicants, what sorts of questions we would expect or in what way should applicants prepare for interview as the LE comprises a very broad areas of law, economics and environment, especially for a canadidate who may not have in depth knowledge of law or environmental science.

Many thanks indeed.


I hope it will be of use, thank you.

a) Maths and Economics would certainly be useful subjects for Land Economy (LE). Biology and Chemistry are both traditional academic subjects and, as such, highly valued but neither has direct relevance for Land Economy. Your Best 3 average, which we will focus on most closely, is simply that, your best three subjects.

b) FM AS would certainly not do you any harm - it is not necessary, however, as Maths is a much less significant part of the LE course than it is in Economics. I do not think any college would think any less of your application for LE if you were not doing FM at AS Level.

c) We do not expect specific knowledge of particular aspects of the LE course and it will often become clear from a candidate's personal statement or SAQ form about the areas which interest him or her and we may focus a little on those. As well as asking questions specific to them, there will usually be one or two questions that we ask everyone that may be on any aspect of LE but will not need specific knowledge.

I hope this is useful and good luck in your application.
Thanks for creating another of these threads, the first was very useful.

I was originally intending to apply to Cambridge this year, but to much to my disappointment and surprise, have received lower AS results than predicted/expected. Subsequently, it's probably a waste of an application this year. I sat AS exams in History, English Literature, Psychology, Government and Politics and Creative Writing, which I studied as an extra AS outside of timetabled lessons. I received A grades in Psychology, Politics, Creative Writing and (high) B grades in English and History, both of which I'm having remarked. I will be studying English, History, Politics and Creative Writing to A2 level. I had already intended to take a gap year and so will do so, but now, after receiving my results, believe I can do significantly better than my predicted grades (A*AAB, based solely on AS UMS and nothing else) and will likely end up with grades in the region of A*A*AA. My questions are the following:

If I applied post A-Level with those grades (A*A*AA), what would the chance of an offer for HSPS be? If one of the A*s was to be in Creative Writing (e.g. A* Creative Writing, A* History, A English and A Politics), would my chance of an offer be lower? Would my chance of an offer be higher if the A* grades were in say, English Lit and History instead of one in Creative Writing, despite the fact that I'm studying Creative Writing basically independently?

Finally, how much weight would be placed on the AS UMS of a post-A2 applicant?

Thanks again for creating this thread, and I hope my jumbled questions made enough sense! I really appreciate you taking the time to respond.
Original post by perflous
Thanks for creating another of these threads, the first was very useful.

I was originally intending to apply to Cambridge this year, but to much to my disappointment and surprise, have received lower AS results than predicted/expected. Subsequently, it's probably a waste of an application this year. I sat AS exams in History, English Literature, Psychology, Government and Politics and Creative Writing, which I studied as an extra AS outside of timetabled lessons. I received A grades in Psychology, Politics, Creative Writing and (high) B grades in English and History, both of which I'm having remarked. I will be studying English, History, Politics and Creative Writing to A2 level. I had already intended to take a gap year and so will do so, but now, after receiving my results, believe I can do significantly better than my predicted grades (A*AAB, based solely on AS UMS and nothing else) and will likely end up with grades in the region of A*A*AA. My questions are the following:

If I applied post A-Level with those grades (A*A*AA), what would the chance of an offer for HSPS be? If one of the A*s was to be in Creative Writing (e.g. A* Creative Writing, A* History, A English and A Politics), would my chance of an offer be lower? Would my chance of an offer be higher if the A* grades were in say, English Lit and History instead of one in Creative Writing, despite the fact that I'm studying Creative Writing basically independently?

Finally, how much weight would be placed on the AS UMS of a post-A2 applicant?

Thanks again for creating this thread, and I hope my jumbled questions made enough sense! I really appreciate you taking the time to respond.


Hi there, sorry to hear that your AS results were not quite as good as you would have wished but well done regardless. They are a decent base to build from if you plan to make a post A-Level application.

You should certainly be aiming for A*A*A post qualification as our average Humanities student has between two and 2.5 A*s at A2. I think we would prefer it if your A*s were in any of Politics, English Lit and History rather than Creative Writing but if you got an A* in Creative Writing and close to an A* in English or History then you would still be in a reasonable position.

Given that you wish to improve markedly between AS and A2 it is important not to overload yourself in year 13 and be able to concentrate on the areas where you are most likely to do well. Ultimately, of course, it is your life and your qualifications but it may be worth cosndiering whether the Creative Writing is going to detract from your performance in your three standard A2s.

Those who apply Post A-Level have both their As and A2 UMS as part of their average so it is likely that this will drag your average down a bit. However, as I said earlier to another query, we look deeper than just the average and if we can see a clear improvement between AS and A2, we will certainly be interested in that and see it as a good sign.

Good luck for next year and do feel free to ask more if you wish.
Original post by Christ's Admissions
Hi there, sorry to hear that your AS results were not quite as good as you would have wished but well done regardless. They are a decent base to build from if you plan to make a post A-Level application.

You should certainly be aiming for A*A*A post qualification as our average Humanities student has between two and 2.5 A*s at A2. I think we would prefer it if your A*s were in any of Politics, English Lit and History rather than Creative Writing but if you got an A* in Creative Writing and close to an A* in English or History then you would still be in a reasonable position.

Given that you wish to improve markedly between AS and A2 it is important not to overload yourself in year 13 and be able to concentrate on the areas where you are most likely to do well. Ultimately, of course, it is your life and your qualifications but it may be worth cosndiering whether the Creative Writing is going to detract from your performance in your three standard A2s.

Those who apply Post A-Level have both their As and A2 UMS as part of their average so it is likely that this will drag your average down a bit. However, as I said earlier to another query, we look deeper than just the average and if we can see a clear improvement between AS and A2, we will certainly be interested in that and see it as a good sign.

Good luck for next year and do feel free to ask more if you wish.


Thank you, that was very helpful, I really appreciate you taking the time to respond.
Original post by perflous
Thank you, that was very helpful, I really appreciate you taking the time to respond.


No problem! :smile: You are welcome!
Hello, it's great to see another one of these threads they're always really helpful!
I was wondering whether schools are contacted to provide proof of the ums provided on the saq, or whether I would just need to bring my results slip to interview? My school isn't very experienced with oxbridge applications, so they've asked me to check if there is any additional information (e.g. Ums scores) that they need to send. Thanks for the help!
Original post by junebugg99
Hello, it's great to see another one of these threads they're always really helpful!
I was wondering whether schools are contacted to provide proof of the ums provided on the saq, or whether I would just need to bring my results slip to interview? My school isn't very experienced with oxbridge applications, so they've asked me to check if there is any additional information (e.g. Ums scores) that they need to send. Thanks for the help!


Yes, proof of UMS has to be provided and colleges handle this slightly differently but the college to which you apply will explain their procedure to you. Essentially you either send them before hand or bring them to interview. Here at Christ's we ask you to send them to us, stamped by the school, by 15 November, one month after the UCAS deadline. I hope that's helpful.
When you talk about SUMS which AS subjects are included in this average?

Also, if you have already achieved A level maths in year 12 will this be included within the offer for engineering or will you still need A*A*A in year 13 (from further maths, physics and chemistry), presuming you get an offer?

Thanks
Original post by Christ's Admissions
Yes, proof of UMS has to be provided and colleges handle this slightly differently but the college to which you apply will explain their procedure to you. Essentially you either send them before hand or bring them to interview. Here at Christ's we ask you to send them to us, stamped by the school, by 15 November, one month after the UCAS deadline. I hope that's helpful.

So will my school be contacted directly or will I have to pass on the message? Thanks again for the help.
Original post by uklizzie
When you talk about SUMS which AS subjects are included in this average?

Also, if you have already achieved A level maths in year 12 will this be included within the offer for engineering or will you still need A*A*A in year 13 (from further maths, physics and chemistry), presuming you get an offer?

Thanks


It is the three most relevant Sciences which, in the case of Engineering is Maths & FM combined, Physics and Chemistry. If students are not taking the three 'most relevant' subjects, then it is calculated from three Science subjects if possible and from two if not. (so, if you were taking Maths, Physics, Biology, it would be those three, but if you were taking Maths, Physics and French it would only be Maths and Physics).

A-Levels taken early may or may not be included in the offer in Year 13. It is entirely dependent on the individual circumstances as to what the college decides to do - there is no hard and fast rule.
Original post by junebugg99
So will my school be contacted directly or will I have to pass on the message? Thanks again for the help.


It is up to you as the applicant to provide the information, so you will have to pass on the information to the school and chase them up.
Hi there, I'd like to have some feedback on what my chances are of an interview/offer from Cambridge for Economics.

I've listed my results below. Thank you so much for taking the time to read and reply to this. When I've talked about the marks I expected, that's based on my mock results, how much preparation I put in, and how I found the papers.

Spoiler


C1: 98/100
C2: 100/100
S1: 95/100
M1: 92/100
FP1: 80/100 (This was my first exam and terrible nerves + a high grade boundary meant I didn't achieve to my potential at all. I was seriously expecting 95+ otherwise.)

D1: 68/100 (I was very ill for this due to a severe reaction to some medicine - had to go to A&E and my heart rate had gone up to 200 which was absolutely mad! Was expecting 90+ for this.)


Economics (OCR) - I'm getting these papers re-marked because they are far far far below the result I expected

Unit 1: 82/100
Unit 2: 90/100

I expect these to go up to 95-100/100 each


Physics (OCR)

Unit 1: 84/90
Unit 2: 139/150 (I have recalled the scripts for both these papers and might get them remarked depending on whether my teacher thinks they've been marked incorrectly. I'm doing this because I had expected much higher results based on teachercol's mark schemes (a Student Room physics teacher)).


Latin (OCR)

Language: 100/100
Literature: 95/100

Critical Thinking - 190/200 but I realise this probably makes no difference at all



Overall average (not inc. CritT): 92.77%

I expect that this will go up to 94.?% once my re-marks from the economics papers come through.

I understand that my maths (and currently economics) scores are sub-par, but I really don't think I am a poor mathematician and I think this should come through during the interview, if I get one. Have they absolutely ruined my chances of a Cambridge interview/offer?

By the way, I got 12 A*s at GCSE, if that would change things at all.

Thanks in advance.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by surface2014
Hi there, I'd like to have some feedback on what my chances are of an interview/offer from Cambridge for Economics.

I've listed my results below. Thank you so much for taking the time to read and reply to this. When I've talked about the marks I expected, that's based on my mock results, how much preparation I put in, and how I found the papers.

Maths/Further Maths (MEI)

C1: 98/100
C2: 100/100
S1: 95/100
M1: 92/100
FP1: 80/100 (This was my first exam and terrible nerves + a high grade boundary meant I didn't achieve to my potential at all. I was seriously expecting 95+ otherwise.)

D1: 68/100 (I was very ill for this due to a severe reaction to some medicine - had to go to A&E and my heart rate had gone up to 200 which was absolutely mad! Was expecting 90+ for this.)


Economics (OCR) - I'm getting these papers re-marked because they are far far far below the result I expected

Unit 1: 82/100
Unit 2: 90/100

I expect these to go up to 95-100/100 each


Physics (OCR)

Unit 1: 84/90
Unit 2: 139/150 (I have recalled the scripts for both these papers and might get them remarked depending on whether my teacher thinks they've been marked incorrectly. I'm doing this because I had expected much higher results based on teachercol's mark schemes (a Student Room physics teacher)).


Latin (OCR)

Language: 100/100
Literature: 95/100

Critical Thinking - 190/200 but I realise this probably makes no difference at all



Overall average (not inc. CritT): 92.77%

I expect that this will go up to 94.?% once my re-marks from the economics papers come through.

I understand that my maths (and currently economics) scores are sub-par, but I really don't think I am a poor mathematician and I think this should come through during the interview, if I get one. Have they absolutely ruined my chances of a Cambridge interview/offer?

By the way, I got 12 A*s at GCSE, if that would change things at all.

Thanks in advance.


I can't offer specific advice as to your exact chances as one has to wait until one sees the whole gathered field of applicants and then, of course, wait for the interview and any test scores etc.

The biggest problem for you, as you recognise, is your Maths performance. The FP1 and, especially, the D1 scores bring your Maths average down a lot. This is mitigated by your performance in S1 which is strong but I think it would remain a worry for Economics DoSes who are very concerned with good scores in Maths. I assume you are doing FM next year and would encourage you to do both S2 and S3 as this will help your preparation for Economics at Cambridge. The 12 A*s at GCSE is also an encouraging sign.

It is very unlikely that you would not be called to interview but we would need to be convinced about your Maths ability at interview before being confident about making you an offer. I think that is about as far as one can go at this stage.
Original post by Christ's Admissions
I can't offer specific advice as to your exact chances as one has to wait until one sees the whole gathered field of applicants and then, of course, wait for the interview and any test scores etc.

The biggest problem for you, as you recognise, is your Maths performance. The FP1 and, especially, the D1 scores bring your Maths average down a lot. This is mitigated by your performance in S1 which is strong but I think it would remain a worry for Economics DoSes who are very concerned with good scores in Maths. I assume you are doing FM next year and would encourage you to do both S2 and S3 as this will help your preparation for Economics at Cambridge. The 12 A*s at GCSE is also an encouraging sign.

It is very unlikely that you would not be called to interview but we would need to be convinced about your Maths ability at interview before being confident about making you an offer. I think that is about as far as one can go at this stage.



Thanks for your help and for replying so quickly.
Original post by surface2014
Thanks for your help and for replying so quickly.


You are welcome and good luck!

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