Pakistan protesters to secure the red zone in Islamabad

Original post by Inzamam99

England should be bombed until its green fields invert.

Oh look, the above was offensive and bigoted.

Colonialism is not dead, it has merely reinvented itself.

I think I rustled your Jimmies bro :biggrin:

Reply 42

Ankabout

14

Oh wow, so many haters.

Back on topic, my dad is actually optimistic about the situation i.e. the corrupt government officials will resign and there would be another election. :eek:

God bless Pakistan. :colondollar:

(edited 9 years ago)

Reply 43

Aj12

18

Original post by Yi-Ge-Ningderen

For it to be fully effective, it would need to have submarines that can launch the weapon (other wise a surprise mass nuclear attack could take out their own weapons), does it have such?

Btw, the nuclear aspects of armies really is an all or nothing approach, I don't think any nation would use them just because they were losing a war, even when total loss is about to occur, I think many wouldn't use them as it means tat their own population will die.

There has been talk of building a submarine deterrent, but nothing too concrete. Generally the deterrent is land and air based, with ballistic missiles on the ground. Fairly sure Pakistan either is aiming to get or already has road mobile launchers. The country is fairly immune to having its deterrent taken out in a first strike, that and their command and control is quite dispersed with local commanders having launch authority.

Must admit I find the Pakistan-Indian rivalry as demonstrated within this thread bizarre. As well as the arguments over Kashmir that has contributed to issues between the two.

(edited 9 years ago)

Reply 44

Yi-Ge-Ningderen

Original post by Aj12

There has been talk of building a submarine deterrent, but nothing too concrete. Generally the deterrent is land and air based, with ballistic missiles on the ground. Fairly sure Pakistan either is aiming to get or already has road mobile launchers. The country is fairly immune to having its deterrent taken out in a first strike, that and their command and control is quite dispersed with local commanders having launch authority.

Must admit I find the Pakistan-Indian rivalry as demonstrated within this thread bizarre. As well as the arguments over Kashmir that has contributed to issues between the two.

I there even anything of value in Kashmir e.g. minerals etc. or is it just an issue of principles for land that both sides belong rightfully to them?

Reply 45

Original post by Inzamam99

Rape Capital of the world.

And even you must know how much the situation has deteriorated for women and minorities under Modi. Need I post links? Particularly to his ministers comments' justifying rape?

Are you serious?????

You are generalizing things based on one incident. and It is nothing to do with culture .
Rape is done by those peoples whose mentality can
And as for India it is a good country with good peoples.
And people who tell you that all such things happen in India frequently are politically motivated just focusing on to badmouth the current government and play political game at expense of their nation's dignity.
Go to India see by yourself instead of believing everything that the BBC is telling you mate .

1 United States: 95,136
2 South Africa: 52,425
3 Canada: 24,350
4 Australia: 15,630
5 India: 15,468
6 Mexico: 14,373
7 United Kingdom: 13,395
8 Germany: 8,615
9 France: 8,458
10 Russia: 6,978

Considering the population of India is 1.21 Billion, I think Indian government is making way more efforts than other western governments like USA, Canada, UK, France, Australia etc. Populationwise,Canada and Australia combined has got lesser population than 3 largest Indian cities. The total population of other 9 countries combined in top 10 is about one third of the total population of India.

India has a massive Muslim population which has influenced a lot of negative changes to their society and culture. One of them being cruel and barbaric Islamo-identical crimes against women. India is notorious for sexual assault. It’s perhaps not a coincidence that the majority of the worse rapes happen in North India, with the largest Muslim population and influence.

India was held hostage for 800 years to Muslim rule and lost over 100 million people to Muslim slaughter by moghul invaders. India’s ancient child marriages originate from Muslim invasion and presence, where small children – often orphans – would be married to adults for protection to try and keep them from extreme Muslim brutality that would victimize women and children into slavery, rape and murders.

Considering that there are approximately 176 million muslims in India, that number isn't a surprise. I imagine with the unreported rapes that are so common to muslims, the number is substantially higher.

Reply 46

Original post by Ggmu!

No such things as Hindu terrorist camps. Nobody gets blown up or there are no Hindus running around with AK-47's (unlike Indian mujahideen, who are slowly getting killed off).

BJP doesn't promote terrorism, they're famously against it.

Because Pakistan thought talking to Kashmiri separatists matters more than talking to Indian government officials.

Posted from TSR Mobile

hahahahah

Another deluded Indian here guys. All you guys need to do is research "Riots against Muslims/Christians" in India and also the extremely bigoted bordering on genocidal stance of some BJP's ministers. Just type into Google and you will get answers. The current leader of Congress, Rahul Gandhi himself said that Hindu extremists are a bigger threat to India than Muslim ones.

I also invite people here to go on Pakistani English news websites such as Dawn and Express Tribune- the vast majority of comments on there are needlessly hateful ones by Indians whereas you won't find any examples vice versa.

Why are Indians so obsessed with Pakistanis? Insecure about dick size?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/6161691.stm

Reply 47

Ggmu!

Original post by Inzamam99

Don't forget how you have readily acknowledged how Kashmiris don't deserve self determination and Indian funding of Baloch terrorists amongst others as even the US DoD have admitted.

OP, the army won't open fire. PM Nawaz Sharif has played this situation extremely well and has already emerged on top. If we look at history, sections of the army and ISI are behind these protests, hoping that the government would give orders to the police to open fire so that the army could then step in as saviour.

This will die out in a few days.

Yes, I have. Because J&K is a part of India for all Indians. We'd have a slippery slope denying similar 'rights' to North eastern state (eg tripura). You'd also have a slippery slope with denying similar rights to every secessionist movement....

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Reply 48

Original post by Yi-Ge-Ningderen

I there even anything of value in Kashmir e.g. minerals etc. or is it just an issue of principles for land that both sides belong rightfully to them?

There should be a referendum across Kashmir- the regions which wish to acede to Pakistan/India should be allowed to do so unless the majority vote for independence which should then be granted.

Ask our Indian friends here- none are in favour of Kashmiri self determination because they know exactly what will happen. They prefer to keep hold of occupied Kashmir by force.

Reply 49

Original post by Ggmu!

Yes, I have. Because J&K is a part of India for all Indians. We'd have a slippery slope denying similar 'rights' to North eastern state (eg tripura). You'd also have a slippery slope with denying similar rights to every secessionist movement....

Posted from TSR Mobile

There is no area in Pakistan where the majority want Independence- the most common case is Balochistan and fyi the majority of people living there are Pashtuns. 40% of the population is Baloch and amongst those, the only ones fighting against the state are the thugs of the feudal landlords who themselves have stolen billions.

Yes, the Baloch are disillusioned and deserve a lot more and yes, that is the fault of state but the feudal lifestyle of Interior Balochistan is the biggest curse upon the province.

Meanwhile it is painstakingly clear that most Kashmiris would rather be part of Pakistan or independent particularly in the Kashmir valley.

The fact that you wish to deny them this right through brutal force shows how low the Indian gov. is willing to sink.

Reply 50

Kutta

19

If Pakistan get a honest leader who actually cares about the country then we will see change, otherwise we're just stuck in a cycle of tutti.

We've seen a start with the operations and on going war v the Taliban, if we can defeat them then that's a major obstacle out of the way.

Secondly we should enforce education and teach kids to a better level.

And thirdly the economy needs to improve. At bare minimum more people should pay tax and there should be jobs available.

Reply 51

Original post by Ggmu!

Yes, I have. Because J&K is a part of India for all Indians.

Posted from TSR Mobile

LOOOOLLLLL

I'm sure Hitler and Stalin used that rationale as well.

Poland is a part of Greater Germany for all Germans.

Hungary is a part of the USSR for all Soviets.

Reply 52

Original post by Inzamam99

hahahahah

Another deluded Indian here guys. All you guys need to do is research "Riots against Muslims/Christians" in India and also the extremely bigoted bordering on genocidal stance of some BJP's ministers. Just type into Google and you will get answers. The current leader of Congress, Rahul Gandhi himself said that Hindu extremists are a bigger threat to India than Muslim ones.

I also invite people here to go on Pakistani English news websites such as Dawn and Express Tribune- the vast majority of comments on there are needlessly hateful ones by Indians whereas you won't find any examples vice versa.

Why are Indians so obsessed with Pakistanis? Insecure about dick size?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/6161691.stm

It's other way round actually.Pakistan political class and army class have made there career on anti India rhetoric's.
It,s in Pakistan curriculum of schools that anti India and anti Hindus teaching are being taught.
India is secular democracy which have larger population of Muslims then pakistan,just look out the condition of minorities in pakistan 1947 they were 11% now they are less then 2%

I believe it is Pakistan that is afraid of India. Every confrontation the two have had India has won or has had the advantage.

India is a Hindu majority country, Pakistan is a Muslim majority country....Pakistan has no identity, culture or sense of belonging of its own that is why these pakis keep trying to share a race with us noble Indians. Whereas by comparison India is one of the world's oldest civilisations - it is the land of ashoka, of arya bhutta and of Buddha...Pakistanis haven't even existed untill 1947...they are former Hindus who were forced to convert to islam by the invading muslims and now the idiots try and think they are superior to us when in fact they are a product of rape, imperialism and slavery. The world's first ever univerisites were built in India (the university of taxila and nananda) which were actually demolished by Muslim invaders. I can go on and on talking about India's contribution to the world in the field of maths, sciences, arts, medicine etc but a pakistani would struggle to think of even one paki contribution to the world. Pakis can't even contribute to their own country so how can they contribute to the rest of the world.

And Pakistan is a shattered country who is busy fighting it's own created monster......

Reply 53

Kutta

19

Original post by Inzamam99

There is no area in Pakistan where the majority want Independence- the most common case is Balochistan and fyi the majority of people living there are Pashtuns. 40% of the population is Baloch and amongst those, the only ones fighting against the state are the thugs of the feudal landlords who themselves have stolen billions.

Yes, the Baloch are disillusioned and deserve a lot more and yes, that is the fault of state but the feudal lifestyle of Interior Balochistan is the biggest curse upon the province.

Meanwhile it is painstakingly clear that most Kashmiris would rather be part of Pakistan or independent particularly in the Kashmir valley.

The fact that you wish to deny them this right through brutal force shows how low the Indian gov. is willing to sink.

Baloch are scum man...

Just the other day they did a target killing when I was on the other side of the road. I can't visit my nanis grave because they'll shoot me as im the wrong colour.

Sick people....

Reply 54

Ggmu!

Original post by Inzamam99

Rape Capital of the world.

And even you must know how much the situation has deteriorated for women and minorities under Modi. Need I post links? Particularly to his ministers comments' justifying rape?

Original post by Inzamam99

hahahahah

Another deluded Indian here guys. All you guys need to do is research "Riots against Muslims/Christians" in India and also the extremely bigoted bordering on genocidal stance of some BJP's ministers. Just type into Google and you will get answers. The current leader of Congress, Rahul Gandhi himself said that Hindu extremists are a bigger threat to India than Muslim ones.

I also invite people here to go on Pakistani English news websites such as Dawn and Express Tribune- the vast majority of comments on there are needlessly hateful ones by Indians whereas you won't find any examples vice versa.

Why are Indians so obsessed with Pakistanis? Insecure about dick size?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/6161691.stm

Lol, do you think Pakistan is better? Not worth criticising a nation for something you're really no better for. Besides, no Indians deny the extent of this problem. I don't see why you're trying to throw cheap shots lol.

Post them. These figures fluctuate constantly anyway, they really don't mean much. You're the same as the Indian media, judging him after no time to make real changes.
Plenty of state ministers, MP's and MLA's have made stupid comments, it's a problem. But I'm sure if I bothered to dig, I could find worse in Pakistan. People are free to say deplorable things in India, like a certain Akbaruddin Owaisi who incites so much hatred.

Lol you speak of genocide when the Muslim population has grown faster than the Hindu population, while the Hindu population in Pakistan has been destroyed. Stop misusing the word genocide so much.

Looooooool grow up kid, you think indians commenting on Pakistani newspapers looks that bad on us? Truly... Cheap shots..

Full of cheap shots. I suppose that's all you 'have' on India.

Yeah... Riots aren't the same as terrorists and terrorist camps

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Reply 55

Ggmu!

Original post by India4ever

It's other way round actually.Pakistan political class and army class have made there career on anti India rhetoric's.
It,s in Pakistan curriculum of schools that anti India and anti Hindus teaching are being taught.
India is secular democracy which have larger population of Muslims then pakistan,just look out the condition of minorities in pakistan 1947 they were 11% now they are less then 2%

I believe it is Pakistan that is afraid of India. Every confrontation the two have had India has won or has had the advantage.

India is a Hindu majority country, Pakistan is a Muslim majority country....Pakistan has no identity, culture or sense of belonging of its own that is why these pakis keep trying to share a race with us noble Indians. Whereas by comparison India is one of the world's oldest civilisations - it is the land of ashoka, of arya bhutta and of Buddha...Pakistanis haven't even existed untill 1947...they are former Hindus who were forced to convert to islam by the invading muslims and now the idiots try and think they are superior to us when in fact they are a product of rape, imperialism and slavery. The world's first ever univerisites were built in India (the university of taxila and nananda) which were actually demolished by Muslim invaders. I can go on and on talking about India's contribution to the world in the field of maths, sciences, arts, medicine etc but a pakistani would struggle to think of even one paki contribution to the world. Pakis can't even contribute to their own country so how can they contribute to the rest of the world.

And Pakistan is a shattered country who is busy fighting it's own created monster......

Quoting the very sad and painful truth that is this post.

Posted from TSR Mobile

Reply 56

Original post by aka r

you can say all you like, Pakistan army is one of the strongest armies in the world, Pakistan holds 100-120 nuclear warheads

I would like to only say that,Indian Army had defeated 3 times in the war with Pakistan.This the Major proof.That who is stronger !!!

India is superior.GFP ranking of India is 4 and ranking of Pakistan is 10.India has the 3rd largest army in the world.Indian airforce is 4 th most powerfull. India's navy is more powerfull than Pakistan.India has more nuclear weapon than Pakistan.Therefore, it could crush Pakistan within days if it wanted to!

Original post by aka r

If Pakistan was a failed state it would not have nuclear weapons in the first place, just keep your nonsense out of this thread you are making yourself look stupid, generalising a whole country based on a small number of terrorists and saying Pakistan should be bombed because of it, Pakistan nuclear weapons should be taken away so that India can just walk across the border with no issue and destroy Pakistan no mate, Nuclear warheads have protected Pakistan.

It was a failure from the day the land was stolen from India. Failed from day one when Jinnah demanded a separate muslim state and forced partition when India was becoming independent from Britain. Ill thought out and rushed through due to Jinnah's arrogance and impatience.

A country of people never satisfied, it has waged war with its neighbours ever since, always eyeing up their land to colonise.

Strange they call the west imperialists and colonialists land grab in SE Asia and beyond.

Poor, corrupt, dependent on aid, double dealing, under educated and barbaric traditions....yet British governments ( especially new labour) allowed millions from the failure to move to Britain and sadly they brought their ways with them.

We now have 'home grown Muslim terrorists' murdering British people in Britain and beyond, honour killings, forced marriage, child marriage, halal meat, bigamy etc etc

The nuclear option that Pakistan developed has been a windfall for those in power. Western nations are so worried that the weapons will fall into the "wrong hands" that they will pay millions just as long as the weapons are kept under control. Pakistan heavly depend on usa uk Germany and other western countries.Paks claim that Pakistan is a Paradise but in reality it is actually hell on Earth. though the people are very 'proud' of their Pakistaniness, they all run off to get a 'better life' and spread Islam into the Western countries, increasing crime, violence and fraudulent behaviour wherever they go.

Reply 57

Original post by Inzamam99

There should be a referendum across Kashmir- the regions which wish to acede to Pakistan/India should be allowed to do so unless the majority vote for independence which should then be granted.

Ask our Indian friends here- none are in favour of Kashmiri self determination because they know exactly what will happen. They prefer to keep hold of occupied Kashmir by force.

Original post by Inzamam99

There is no area in Pakistan where the majority want Independence- the most common case is Balochistan and fyi the majority of people living there are Pashtuns. 40% of the population is Baloch and amongst those, the only ones fighting against the state are the thugs of the feudal landlords who themselves have stolen billions.

Yes, the Baloch are disillusioned and deserve a lot more and yes, that is the fault of state but the feudal lifestyle of Interior Balochistan is the biggest curse upon the province.

Meanwhile it is painstakingly clear that most Kashmiris would rather be part of Pakistan or independent particularly in the Kashmir valley.

The fact that you wish to deny them this right through brutal force shows how low the Indian gov. is willing to sink.

No , the story is much more complex and options are tricky (all I have mentioned can be tracked with any international source)

1. India actually did not had any interest in Kashmir during independence, so it let it be as a separate country. Trouble started when Pakistan army started invading Kashmir with local terrorists , to overthrow the Hindu ruler and conquer the land. The king asked India for help, but Kashmir not being a part of India , it was not possible to send huge army and maintain a constant watch over another land . Thus the treaty was signed to keep Pakistan away.
Pakistan do not care for kashmiri people, it does not even care for its own. Their main motive was to occupy more land and resources of Kashmir. If pakistan any a fraction of remorse for kashmiri people then they would have not send terrorist , who kill every one to cause tension.

If one beg to differ that Pakistan did no such thing , then let me remind you Pakistan army has never won a single war against any country.
So when Indian army arrived , it first stopped Pakistan army from invading any further and took care of local terrorists.
Also the fact that India won four out of four battles with Pakistan , in which three, Pakistan lost so badly that with force alone India could have taken entire Kashmir back and much more. But due to internal (to maintain peace) and external (us , uk etc) pressure India did no such thing.
The line, where the war was fought became the cease fire in 3rd war and LOC in forth.

2. Kashmiri people have no interest in India and still want to remain independent, if could. Pakistan claim to Kashmir due to religion is very hollow. During the first war, Indian army struggled a lot with local terrorist and later with Pakistan sending or funding more terrorist till date, there is still some tension between Indian army and kashmiri's though much less now.
But in starting when tension was high , Pakistan and other group tried hard to show as if, India a Hindu majority country was being cruel to Muslim population of Kashmir, which was a stupid in its self, cause India is a secular country and had more Muslim population then Pakistan.
Till date some portion of pakistani population is under the same hoax of India being cruel to Muslims or that our constitution is anti Muslim which is false , also Kashmir does not follow Indian constitution, but India do regulate on human right issue in a consultative manner with Kashmir government.
Though even in worst situation there was never even a quarter agreement to join Pakistan, let alone a majority.
(Turning a nation into secular was not a day work , it took time ).

3. Segregation was never an option, specially with history with Pakistan.
During the segregation between India and Pakistan , where India became a secular country , Pakistan was a Muslim country .
India welcomed Muslim and Hindu people from Pakistan side during separation , even allotted them land , as red land (fertile) .. Though it was not anywhere enough for the huge losses these people have suffered.

But on pakistan side a blood war had started where hindus and other non Muslim, where thrown out, and put with death warnings by military.
India has no interest to see the same with kashmir with 15+ % non muslim population at that time. Other close regions with Hindu majority would also suffer from the same.

4. Kashmir now means different things for India and Pakistan.

For India it is a liability, because it covers a huge north portion in such a way , that if lost to Pakistan or china , it would have to spend much more in defence, since border would increase and from two side , west and north .
So economically a bad deal.

Pakistan
Kashmir has been seen as a soft target by Pakistan, as it blames every internal problem over it .
It also used to justify its out of proportion large army.
Terrorist in Pakistan also pressure on it, cause it will be a huge gate way to eastern countries like , Nepal , Bhutan etc.

5. Why take Hyderabad ? It was a silly issue where a king alone was being selfish trying to be in power.
Difference here was , people actually did not wanted to be independent and join India, unlike Kashmir who never had any intention to join Pakistan .
Also an example where India have shown proof for being not being Hippocratic is Bhutan and Nepal . With similar situation we allowed these to slit out cause we shared their border with china.

6. Pakistan is 12 on failed nation , while India is 76 th.
Who in the world (except pakistan ) thinks Kashmiri people want to join Pakistan.

7.In the 22 years since the Kashmir insurgency started, Indian economy has boomed while Pakistan economy has gone down the toilet

8.After Kashmir they will ask for Delhi , then UP then somebody will ask for separate Khalistan , separate Nagaland , separate Tamil Eelam etc...

Reply 58