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more hideous islamic scum...

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    (Original post by Howard)
    Well, I think we'll agree to disagree on this one. I don't find anything in the article inflammatory at all (apart from what is directly cited by the Journalist as having being said by the interviewees) What's the journalist supposed to do? Censor the ugly comments?

    I don't feel the journalist unfairly twisted the article to reflect on the entire Islamic community either. There just isn't any use of wording to that effect and nor can it be implied.
    if it portrays Muslims in a bad light then its obviously racist or biased or unfair, of course the other way around and its a different matter, just dont go criticise the muslims. people should just face it, parts of the muslim community in Britain are the biggest threat to British society and national security.
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    (Original post by vienna95)
    howard, is it me or is the entire forum full of idiots?
    I don't think it's you.

    I think this forum is full of people who need to experience losing a family member in a London bomb blast before coming to terms with the truth. Even then most of them will say "well, there's simply no evidence that an Islamic extremist group was behind it...........it was probably ETA" :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by vienna95)
    if it portrays Muslims in a bad light then its obviously racist or biased or unfair, of course the other way around and its a different matter, just dont go criticise the muslims. people should just face it, parts of the muslim community in Britain are the biggest threat to British society and national security.
    Hear Hear. There is a large and ugly 5th column growing in the UK. And let me be even more controversial in saying Powell probably was right after all. The streets will become rivers of blood.
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    All I can say is that what I've heard of ES journos, they're certainly not infallible. And it does seem unlikely that these men would be chatting so openly about terrorism if they were an actual threat - I'd think the same if it was Combat 18 or anarchists or animal liberationists that it was about.

    We all know that there is a threat from Islamic fundamentalist terrorism in this country - I'd question exactly what this article does thats constructive. It doesn't tell us anything new.
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    (Original post by BettyOblivious)
    All I can say is that what I've heard of ES journos, they're certainly not infallible. And it does seem unlikely that these men would be chatting so openly about terrorism if they were an actual threat - I'd think the same if it was Combat 18 or anarchists or animal liberationists that it was about.

    We all know that there is a threat from Islamic fundamentalist terrorism in this country - I'd question exactly what this article does thats constructive. It doesn't tell us anything new.
    The article informs. It's a public interest article. Just because it doesn't explain God that doesn't mean it serves no purpose. It's a media story. What do you want from it?
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    (Original post by Howard)
    It's a media story. What do you want from it?
    I guess that's an important point when looking at mainstream coporate media - what do we expect from it? I'm not doubting that there is a minority of very fcuked up Muslims in this country that do support terrorism targetting civilians. However, when reading any media story I think its important to take into account that the truth is often twisted. IMO, the ES is probably one of the less reliable sources of information available.
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    (Original post by Joseph_SOUTH)
    My ponit is that people shouldn't tip toe around the subject, just beacuse they are muslims and they don't wanna seem racist. They are bad bad people, it's ok to say it and we need to protect ourselves from them.
    Yeah, like?
    & they are terrorists BTW!!!!
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    (Original post by BettyOblivious)
    I guess that's an important point when looking at mainstream coporate media - what do we expect from it? I'm not doubting that there is a minority of very fcuked up Muslims in this country that do support terrorism targetting civilians. However, when reading any media story I think its important to take into account that the truth is often twisted. IMO, the ES is probably one of the less reliable sources of information available.
    There was an almost identical article in the Sunday Times, including such phrases as "Britain must choose between allowing flying the black flag of Islam over 10 Downing street and living in terror". So it's not just the ES.
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    (Original post by BettyOblivious)
    I guess that's an important point when looking at mainstream coporate media - what do we expect from it? I'm not doubting that there is a minority of very fcuked up Muslims in this country that do support terrorism targetting civilians. However, when reading any media story I think its important to take into account that the truth is often twisted. IMO, the ES is probably one of the less reliable sources of information available.
    Well I think this article just focused in on some of the "very fcuked up Muslims in this country that do support terrorism targetting civilians" Nothing more, nothing less.

    If the Guardian ran a similar story would you attach more weight to it? What about the Telegraph? The Observer? Are you prepared to ignore fact simply because you don't like the source?
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    I know people keep saying not all muslims are like that, and these extremists are only a small minority, but that's wrong...

    It makes me sad to say that most muslims (that I know at least) are in favour of Bin Laden etc but don't admit it openly. On September 11th, all relatives, shopkeepers etc in my area were celebrating, and that's just in Bradford. In Pakistan where all my family are, it was even worse...the day was even declared a national holiday. Just walking around Bradford I see how much hatred muslim people have against the west, and talking to some relatives who have come to settle here from Pakistan and hearing the twisted views they have (and at the same time, they are lovely lovely people) really really worries me....
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    There are some muslims in the UK that support all these ****e terrorist groups.I'm a muslim and try to act against them because their actions are unjustified and against any moral or religious views in existance.
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    (Original post by Adhsur)
    I know people keep saying not all muslims are like that, and these extremists are only a small minority, but that's wrong...

    It makes me sad to say that most muslims (that I know at least) are in favour of Bin Laden etc but don't admit it openly. On September 11th, all relatives, shopkeepers etc in my area were celebrating, and that's just in Bradford. In Pakistan where all my family are, it was even worse...the day was even declared a national holiday. Just walking around Bradford I see how much hatred muslim people have against the west, and talking to some relatives who have come to settle here from Pakistan really really worries me....
    Thankyou for that Adhsur. A very honest answer from someone who obviously has deeper links with the Islamic community than anyone else who has so far posted.
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    (Original post by Adhsur)
    I know people keep saying not all muslims are like that, and these extremists are only a small minority, but that's wrong...

    It makes me sad to say that most muslims (that I know at least) are in favour of Bin Laden etc but don't admit it openly. On September 11th, all relatives, shopkeepers etc in my area were celebrating, and that's just in Bradford. In Pakistan where all my family are, it was even worse...the day was even declared a national holiday. Just walking around Bradford I see how much hatred muslim people have against the west, and talking to some relatives who have come to settle here from Pakistan and hearing the twisted views they have (and at the same time, they are lovely lovely people) really really worries me....
    That is to do with nationality..Any pakistani or Arab i know supports these actions and it's simply because they are brainwashed by their stupid sheikhs...
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    (Original post by zazy)
    There are some muslims in the UK that support all these ****e terrorist groups.I'm a muslim and try to act against them because their actions are unjustified and against any moral or religious views in existance.
    Good. We all know that 99% of muslims are not plotting to blow everyone up and planning Britain's future as an Islamic state. It's that bastard 1% that's the problem.
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    (Original post by Howard)
    Are you prepared to ignore fact simply because you don't like the source?

    No, but when assessing whether or not something is "fact", you have to take the source into account. Its vital that you're conscious of the source when you read something. The Guardian may be more reliable than the ES, but it will have a more liberal bias etc. I actually think you have to be careful when reading any source - just because its in black or white, or on TV, doesn't automatically make it accurate or reliable. From what I know of experiences people have had with the media, whether it be the ES or Channel 4 news, manipulation and distortion are common. As I said before, the "news" is a product to be sold.
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    (Original post by Howard)
    Thankyou for that Adhsur. A very honest answer from someone who obviously has deeper links with the Islamic community than anyone else who has so far posted.
    Thanks..!

    I think people are too afraid of generalising and not willing to accept the threat many muslims seem to pose.

    I think generally the public are rather misinformed because not many muslims will openly wish to admit that they are in favour of islamic extremism...but many muslims do feel proud that Islam is "dominating" the world. Tut! :confused:

    I'm glad I'm not like that!!!
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    (Original post by Adhsur)
    I know people keep saying not all muslims are like that, and these extremists are only a small minority, but that's wrong...

    It makes me sad to say that most muslims (that I know at least) are in favour of Bin Laden etc but don't admit it openly. On September 11th, all relatives, shopkeepers etc in my area were celebrating, and that's just in Bradford. In Pakistan where all my family are, it was even worse...the day was even declared a national holiday. Just walking around Bradford I see how much hatred muslim people have against the west, and talking to some relatives who have come to settle here from Pakistan and hearing the twisted views they have (and at the same time, they are lovely lovely people) really really worries me....
    It's a bit off topic but do you think the government should actively prevent more Muslim people moving to the UK then? Because their views are anti west or whatever and are against the majority of the British public.
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    (Original post by hattori)
    It's a bit off topic but do you think the government should actively prevent more Muslim people moving to the UK then? Because their views are anti west or whatever and are against the majority of the British public.
    I think refugees rather than muslims would be a solution....Because most of them share extreme political views and imigrate to pursue them.....I have personally observed cases of these people.
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    (Original post by BettyOblivious)
    No, but when assessing whether or not something is "fact", you have to take the source into account. Its vital that you're conscious of the source when you read something. The Guardian may be more reliable than the ES, but it will have a more liberal bias etc. I actually think you have to be careful when reading any source - just because its in black or white, or on TV, doesn't automatically make it accurate or reliable. From what I know of experiences people have had with the media, whether it be the ES or Channel 4 news, manipulation and distortion are common. As I said before, the "news" is a product to be sold.
    The Daily Mail has been an object of derision for years in it's warnings that the multi-cultural experiment is failing. "Right wing scaremongering" screamed the liberal press.............until the CRE said........erm......."the multi cultural experiment is crap" (or words to that effect)

    "Asylum out of control" shriek the Mail's headlines. "Liars" counter the government and the liberal media. So what do you know when the Minister in control of immigration resigns a proven liar and the Mail's warnings are shown as fact.
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    (Original post by hattori)
    It's a bit off topic but do you think the government should actively prevent more Muslim people moving to the UK then? Because their views are anti west or whatever and are against the majority of the British public.
    Well, I find that hard to answer considering if that was the case, I probably wouldn't be here right now, but in Pakistan!

    But yes, I feel that there should definitely be some restrictions. Anyone who comes into this country should be able to accept and display an appreciation for British culture, otherwise it's very unfair. I don't know how it should be enforced, but Muslims should feel like they are a part of this country, and not that England "isn't their true country but simply a means for better quality of life" or whatever. Not many muslims who come here seem to appreciate the country at all...they keep saying how Pakistan is so much better!

    It is also very unsettling for people like me, because now my area is so predominantly asian that I'm not even allowed to wear skirts or short sleeved tops, as I could be vulnerable to religious hate: "How can a muslim girl wear stuff like that? It's a disgrace to our culture..." They'd probably end up throwing stones at our windows! That kind of stuff really bugs me...anyone who comes to this country should let other people do what is quite normal and not impose their own beliefs on them.

    I also think that quite a few muslims don't feel they belong here, which is a misconception they need to erase. The reason I know this is is that I know so many people here who put all their earnings together to make houses in Pakistan because they feel they don't belong here, and they should have somewhere to go if they are "kicked out". It's a shame really.
Updated: April 26, 2004
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