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MPs want to know: Why do an apprenticeship? What puts people off?

Were you put off doing an apprenticeship?

Why do an apprenticeship?

The Education Committee in the House of Commons has launched an inquiry looking at the effectiveness and range of apprenticeships and they want to hear your views.

Replies to this thread will be considered before the Committee takes evidence from the Minister responsible for apprenticeships, Nick Boles MP, in the new year.

What happens next?



About the Education Committee

(edited 9 years ago)

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i think that an appreticeship just isnt as valued as it should be in a world were loads of students are going to university and not achieving much upon graduation. The starting salries are a lot lower which is understandable and the sheer breadth of career oppurtunities offered by a degree outweighs the benefits of earning and learning imo. in short i think there should be more progression and oppurtunity for people doing apprenticeships than is currently offered. i am pleased to see accounting firms offering school leavers schemes and that should continue across other industries
Reply 2
Its not as valued for the long-term future, I know many people who have done apprenticeships and are now in College, most of them did it because they weren't clear on their future and they knew a one year position would give them time, something to do and of course a decent enough salary.
Original post by WWEfan
Its not as valued for the long-term future, I know many people who have done apprenticeships and are now in College, most of them did it because they weren't clear on their future and they knew a one year position would give them time, something to do and of course a decent enough salary.


In what ways do you mean it's not as valued for the future?

You mean that people who take apprenticeships don't see them as long term career choices?
A degree is for life, not just for one business.
Reply 5
Original post by Puddles the Monkey
In what ways do you mean it's not as valued for the future?

You mean that people who take apprenticeships don't see them as long term career choices?

Yes, people can get stuck with someone which doesn't open much careers for them.
Reply 6
People generally don't want to be in the position in which not having a degree would prevent them from ascending the hierachichal ladder.

I also see them as a convinient way for the government to reduce their NEET (not in education,employment or training) stats, when in reality theres probably not a single member of the parliament who has children who would be seen dead doing an apprenticeship.
Hi there,

I am Amit from RateMyApprenticeship.

Our website has a whole host of reviews from those who have embarked apprenticeships and other school leaver programmes.

Have a look at: http://www.ratemyapprenticeship.co.uk/

Hope this helps,

Amit



Original post by Puddles the Monkey
Were you put off doing an apprenticeship?

Why do an apprenticeship?

The Education Committee in the House of Commons has launched an inquiry looking at the effectiveness and range of apprenticeships and they want to hear your views.

Replies to this thread will be considered before the Committee takes evidence from the Minister responsible for apprenticeships, Nick Boles MP, in the new year.

What happens next?



About the Education Committee

(edited 9 years ago)
Reply 8
Because the pay on most of them is ridiculous and can get a better paid job working in Tescos.
Reply 9
Original post by Barlow
Because the pay on most of them is ridiculous and can get a better paid job working in Tescos.


This is a great point. They are seen as being low paid, because nobody realises/cares about the qualifications. More needs to be done to highlight the issue. Going to uni gets paid nothing (well, you get a loan to pay back, and sometimes grants) but most people don't say they'd be better off working in Tesco than getting a degree.

But I think this is part of a wider problem, in that unless you have parents to support you an apprenticeship is not an option. You're generally not eligible for a student bank account with overdraft, and can't live in student accommodation. Some apprenticeships will provide accommodation, but probably most don't. So for people from low income families it's unrealistic - their family can't support them whilst they earn £2 an hour.

An apprenticeship develops skills for a specific career/job, what about if you decide you no longer want to pursue it anymore? Especially in modern times where people do change careers more often than they did in the past where there was more of a 'job for life' mindset.

How are students (16-19 year olds) meant to know whether a certain career is for them or not? This links back to my previous point.

There are already lots of people out there with degrees and this is reflected in job requirements as jobs which once did not require a degree, now do, therefore by pursuing an apprenticeship, you will be closing yourself off to a lot of different jobs/careers. And yes, you could go back to Uni and then study and complete a degree but really was the apprenticeship then worth it?

Most degrees are transferable and no matter where you go or what you apply for, they'll be recognised, the same cannot be said for apprenticeships

There are some big companies which offer really good apprenticeships that have good pay and prospects however, there are a lot of apprenticeships out there which provide neither good pay or prospects, basically just working a usual job just with the word 'apprentice' added to the job title.

(edited 9 years ago)
In your first year of an apprenticeship you can be paid as low as £2.73 an hour. That is almost half the minimum for an 18 - 20. How is somebody supposed to live off that amount, it doesn't even cover rent?

It is actually more worthwhile to get a student loan, you might actually be able to afford a decent quality of life.
Original post by neal95
i think that an appreticeship just isnt as valued as it should be in a world were loads of students are going to university and not achieving much upon graduation. The starting salries are a lot lower which is understandable and the sheer breadth of career oppurtunities offered by a degree outweighs the benefits of earning and learning imo. in short i think there should be more progression and oppurtunity for people doing apprenticeships than is currently offered. i am pleased to see accounting firms offering school leavers schemes and that should continue across other industries


I totally agree.
I also think the actual money puts people off. As the minimum wage for apprentices is £2.73 an hour.
Original post by Fortitude


An apprenticeship develops skills for a specific career/job, what about if you decide you no longer want to pursue it anymore? Especially in modern times where people do change careers more often than they did in the past where there was more of a 'job for life' mindset.

How are students (16-19 year olds) meant to know whether a certain career is for them or not? This links back to my previous point.

There are already lots of people out there with degrees and this is reflected in job requirements as jobs which once did not require a degree, now do, therefore by pursuing an apprenticeship, you will be closing yourself off to a lot of different jobs/careers. And yes, you could go back to Uni and then study and complete a degree but really was the apprenticeship then worth it?

Most degrees are transferable and no matter where you go or what you apply for, they'll be recognised, the same cannot be said for apprenticeships

There are some big companies which offer really good apprenticeships that have good pay and prospects however, there are a lot of apprenticeships out there which provide neither good pay or prospects, basically just working a usual job just with the word 'apprentice' added to the job title.



You get that with most college courses though (e.g. nvq's, btec's, diplomas etc). They are all aimed at certain career areas/jobs.
Original post by Emma:-)
You get that with most college courses though (e.g. nvq's, btec's, diplomas etc). They are all aimed at certain career areas/jobs.


Yep, but I was talking from the point of view of doing an apprenticeship instead of the traditional Uni/A-levels.
Everyone comments are interesting
Original post by Fortitude

An apprenticeship develops skills for a specific career/job, what about if you decide you no longer want to pursue it anymore? Especially in modern times where people do change careers more often than they did in the past where there was more of a 'job for life' mindset.



That's the same for any degree, but I disagree that an apprenticeship pigeonholes you in any way. If you finish your degree aged 21, and realise that career path is not for you, you have the option of going back to university to incur more debt, or 'making do', neither of which sound particularly inspiring. After an apprenticeship, you have experience in the real world, no debt, and the option of doing a degree.



How are students (16-19 year olds) meant to know whether a certain career is for them or not? This links back to my previous point.



How is that different from any degree (which you'll be paying off for the next 25-30 years)?



There are already lots of people out there with degrees and this is reflected in job requirements as jobs which once did not require a degree, now do, therefore by pursuing an apprenticeship, you will be closing yourself off to a lot of different jobs/careers. And yes, you could go back to Uni and then study and complete a degree but really was the apprenticeship then worth it?



No, you differentiate yourself. You can study a degree part-time, or go to uni afterwards, with money in your pocket. That aside, most graduates are closed off from a wide range of jobs because they don't have the necessary practical skills (which can be acquired from an apprenticeship). Your cognitive biases are coming into play now; apprenticeships offer a lot of things that degrees don't.



Most degrees are transferable and no matter where you go or what you apply for, they'll be recognised, the same cannot be said for apprenticeships



Well that is a straight up non-truth. Ever heard of an OPITO apprenticeship? Or a Nuclear Skills Passport? Perhaps you're basing your points on your own limited experience, but Cogent and others standardised this a long time ago. Besides, you're talking in such vague terms, I might as well say, "you can't use a music degree for investment banking".



There are some big companies which offer really good apprenticeships that have good pay and prospects however, there are a lot of apprenticeships out there which provide neither good pay or prospects, basically just working a usual job just with the word 'apprentice' added to the job title.



Right, so did you do some research before you applied to your degree course? Of course you did. Due diligence is advised with any important decision - I fail to see why you neglect the fact that degrees are no different. Some degrees have good prospects, some don't. I could replace the word 'apprenticeship' with 'graduate scheme' and 'apprentice' with 'BA/BSc/BEng'.



..
Original post by DiddyDec
In your first year of an apprenticeship you can be paid as low as £2.73 an hour. That is almost half the minimum for an 18 - 20. How is somebody supposed to live off that amount, it doesn't even cover rent?

It is actually more worthwhile to get a student loan, you might actually be able to afford a decent quality of life.


Most people will be living at home and have few overheads. Some apprenticeships are above the NMW. The gov.uk site says:

*This rate is for apprentices aged 16 to 18 and those aged 19 or over who are in their first year. All other apprentices are entitled to the National Minimum Wage for their age.
Original post by Puddles the Monkey
Were you put off doing an apprenticeship?

Why do an apprenticeship?

The Education Committee in the House of Commons has launched an inquiry looking at the effectiveness and range of apprenticeships and they want to hear your views.

Replies to this thread will be considered before the Committee takes evidence from the Minister responsible for apprenticeships, Nick Boles MP, in the new year.

What happens next?



About the Education Committee



I'd like to know how many MPs have done apprenticeships.

And how many have done degrees.

The answer might give MPs a clue about why young people gravitate towards one route. Especially when most degrees don't commit students towards a specific career path while apprenticeships do.

17 yr olds not having their entire career mapped out isn't surprising surely? Especially when the current government slashed funding for careers advice in 2010.

Edit: given the timing of the enquiry and the election in May is this likely to get a response from the government?
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by addylad
Most people will be living at home and have few overheads. Some apprenticeships are above the NMW. The gov.uk site says:


Surely in a fair system one should always earn at least the "minimum" wage.

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