MPs want to know: Why do an apprenticeship? What puts people off?

Scroll to see replies

You ain't gonna make an "impact" in "real life" as a trainee accountant.

You are right, not for at least a year, no. But nor will you by sitting in a lecture hall for 3 years.
However, the difference comes with the idea of impact. As an auditor, I will get to talk to people about their financial statements and say, help them keep out of trouble - that is making an impact for me :wink:

Reply 41

MedicineMann

Original post by Casiolynn

Well I go to a private school and am not the only who is considering an apprenticeship. Our Careers fellow is really keen that everyone does what is right for them, for me is KPMG, for someone else is BBC .. Some jobs are easier to get at School Leavers level ..

You're describing internships. Think brick laying rather than working for the BBC. That's the level of job that this government wants working class children to aspire to.

Reply 42

Error404UNF

Original post by MedicineMann

You're describing internships. Think brick laying rather than working for the BBC. That's the level of job that this government wants working class children to aspire to.

Tbh, I've looked at quite a number of apprenticeships, internships, school leaver programmes and not a single website mentions anything about brick laying or any such manual work. It's always Law, Engineering, Banking, Finance, IT, Media

Reply 43

username421348

Original post by 1drowssap

If one were to work overseas, I'm pretty sure that a degree has a higher chance of being recognised(especially in the context of UK) compared to the programmes you mentioned.

Of course a degree would be recognised, but when looking to move to countries such as Australia, New Zealand, etc. more practical skills (i.e. those developed as an apprentice) are often required than simply having a bachelors degree. After all, they want somebody who can do the job, not somebody who has no actual experience but knows the theory behind something.

Original post by 1drowssap

Regarding your last point, yes, some apprenticeships have better prospects than some degrees. But in the same field, generally, graduate positions would have a better prospect than the apprentice positions, as graduates are usually expected to handle more complex tasks than the apprentice positions, and that would probably lead to higher pay for the graduate.

In my industry (I.T.) the majority of my colleagues who are project managers, senior engineers etc, came through from the apprentice routes.

I'm not doubting the requirement/validity of degrees. If there is an actual need for a degree (doctor for example), then of course they are relevant. However for a lot of industries we have too many people studying to degree level when in fact an apprenticeship would be more beneficial.

Everyone going to uni wants to be a chief; we need more indians.

Reply 44

Justpin

Apprenticeships are a good thing. I've seen people in metal workshops move from the floor sweeper to a skilled metal worker. Same with car mechanics where they are incrementally given pay rises and additional responsibility.

The problem is that it is being used as a scam to pay people less than the min wage.

If you look online in places such as the JCP website they have all sorts of apprentices.

Apprentice cleaner.

Apprentice receptionist

Apprentice sandwich artist

Apprentice this and that.

All jobs which can be learned in a day.

An apprenticeship should lead to a qualification and journeyman status. It shouldn't be a scam to pay people less. Since apprenticeships ARE being used as a scam by employers to pay people less they should be abolished.

Of course our MPs which take bribes from the corporates. I mean political donations LOVE apprenticeships because it allows those who pay them bribes. Sorry I mean donations to lower their labour costs.

Reply 45

Justpin

Original post by Casiolynn

You're naive to the extreme. Your financial statements say what your client wants them to say.

If you refuse they will take their business elsewhere.

Look at PWC and Tesco. Tesco wanted their accounts to say one thing. They were scared of losing a massive audit account so they went along with it.

You can write about ethics and accounting standards all you like but this is endemic in auditing.

Reply 46

Hal.E.Lujah

I've hired a few apprentices; it's a really good deal for both parties as far as I'm concerned, as long as the employer is respectable and the employee is willing to work hard.

For example, take one of my Chef apprentices. He started in October, and has gone from being completely no experience in the kitchen (In terms of prospects, would be applying to £5.20ph jobs) to being qualified to apply for some other trainee chef jobs. These jobs would pay in the £7-£8 per hour region. He's still with us because by the time he finishes with us and all the courses, he's going to be applying to £9-£10 ph jobs. He's been learning from an experienced chef, getting hygiene certificates and specialist cooking courses, and best of all is getting paid the amount someone would pay per year in tuition fees. For anyone who can't add that up, his job prospects at the end of a paid year are better than most graduates coming out with 3 years debt. It's a win/win for both parties.

And obviously from an employers perspective, he's already an asset. I have someone who is able to reproduce dishes set by the Head Chef with consistent quality, and I don't have to cripple wage cost in the quiet periods. He isn't capable of doing the work that the Chefs do - the infrastructure allows him to. But within that infrastructure he is capable of doing that work and I can pay him less to do so because we're investing in him and the community.

Reply 47

Jess & Nick RMA

Original post by charlotte_cool_no

Schools pressure students to go to university- my school gave no information to those not looking to go to university

Most apprenticeships are too poorly paid/not paid at all to be viable

Apprenticeships may tie you into one career whereas degrees can be applied to many

Hi there,

Interesting point and although apprenticeships can be verycareer focused they do attain qualifications which may be transferable in toother field. Have a look at www.ratemyapprenticeship.co.ukto see those who have done apprenticeships/ a school leaver scheme and reviewedthem. It’s a great tool for advice!
I hope this helps,
Amit

Reply 48

Tarte Tatin

Original post by neal95

i think that an appreticeship just isnt as valued as it should be in a world were loads of students are going to university and not achieving much upon graduation. The starting salries are a lot lower which is understandable and the sheer breadth of career oppurtunities offered by a degree outweighs the benefits of earning and learning imo. in short i think there should be more progression and oppurtunity for people doing apprenticeships than is currently offered. i am pleased to see accounting firms offering school leavers schemes and that should continue across other industries

I second this. Plus, the cost of sending people to university and student loans are just unsustainable.

Reply 49

Sandtrooper

Volunteer Team

I don't know about apprenticeships, but I know that I'm going to apply for some school leaver jobs at some investment banks next year, just in case I don't get into the universities I want to go to, and I think that these are definitely worthwhile.

Posted from TSR Mobile

Reply 50

Kabloomybuzz

I think because of the fact that people need to stay in education or work based training until the age of 18 now, a lot of those who aren't academically minded go on an apprentiship where thay would have gone into an entry level job. Problem is, because of the increase in demand for apprentiships, those which actually teach a skill which can lead to a career are high in demand but there aren't enough to meet demand, so they go quickly, So whats left is apprenticeships in areas that would have previously been in entry level jobs. An apprenticeship in retail for example whereas before you'd have to get a job in a shop and learn on the job.

Add that to the fact that because apprenticeships are so much cheaper for employers than taking on non apprenticed staff, it becomes harder for people to just get a standard part or full time job in such areas. It also puts a lot of pressure on 16 year olds who aren't particularly academic and suited to A levels to decide what they want to do before they're sure in the rush to get a decent, skilled apprenticeship and not a dead end one.

IMO, the apprenticeships and education system for 16-18s in particular is not working and its having a knock on effect on other areas of society and employment.

Reply 51

username457532

I was going to be an apprentice groom at a riding school but it was going to be 7:30am to 6:30pm manual work outside 6 days a week for £65 a week and a shared room in North London and I would have only 8 hours official learning a week and I'd have to pay for my own qualifications which was going to cost at least a grand to get qualified. Basically I would have been a doing a full time job for what they charged for two riding lessons. So I decided that it was practically slave labour and it wasn't right. Apprentices should have their qualifications paid for and bee paid a wage that is reasonable. Not all apprentices are 16 year old school-leavers living at home with no costs.

I've seen apprenticeships for shop workers and cleaners which ten years ago would have been jobs - it's just a money saver for companies. I've even seen 12 week unpaid traineeships in retail - that is slave labour.

Reply 52

nacho1996

Personally I believe the term apprenticeship is very wide these days. Some apprenticeship are longer than other, some qualify you better than others. When people say they've been to university it is accepted they are capable of learning to degree level education.

Personally I am doing a maintenance apprenticeship with an oil refiniery and I absolutely love it!!! It's a four year apprenticeship (first year college based) and I gain academic qualifications as well as work experience. I will be fully trained to carry out a maintenance tech position in my chosen discipline when I complete the programme.

However not all apprenticeships are the same and I often get the reaction of "why aren't you in university?" Due to my high achieving school qualifications. But the apprenticeship I'm on is by far the best opportunity I could have ever hoped for in my opinion and others that know the scheme well. Apprenticeship are great as long as it's a career path you'd like to choose.

Reply 53

nacho1996

Also great salary potential, higher chance of gaining employment (due to being trained for a job) and an opportunity to study for a degree once the apprenticeship has finished.

Reply 54

Loyale

I believe apprenticeships should allow progression for less able individuals, so they can grow into a person deemed suitable for the job. Yet simultaneously they should stretch able candidates and allow them to delve into the apprenticeship. However, i think there should be more apprenticeships for people who want to go into the medical route and that would actually be at that level of medical competency to deal with patients. Well, just my thoughts...

Reply 55

Kvothe the Arcane

You often do the same job as a real worker for ~ 2.50 an hr. Doesn't seem worth it.

Reply 56

Justpin

It's obvious that nothing will be done.

If it ain't zero hour its going to be a fake apprenticeship.

MPs do the bidding of their masters, i.e. those who pay them the bribes. They don't give a damn about the people.

Reply 57

CGEEZ_95

Everyone's different but I think they're great. At the age of 19 with just 1 years apprenticeship experience, I've already been offered a higher salary than most of my friends will probably be earning when they leave uni in 2 years time. I work for a media company in the advertising industry and so it doesn't require a degree but it just goes to show apprenticeships really can be an ACTUAL alternative to uni depending on which field you choose to work in. I've been very lucky with mine as most are purely a constant cheap labour process.

Reply 58

Jess & Nick RMA

Original post by Edminzodo

Hi there,

Thats a great idea - if you check out www.ratemyapprenticeship.co.uk you can see a ton of reviews from those who have embarked on similar schemes. The reviews tells you the ins and outs of working at the company, firm or bank as well info you may not find out online.

Good luck,

Amit

Reply 59

Official House of Commons

Official Rep

Thanks for all the great comments! If you chose not to do an apprenticeship due to lack of information, be sure to tell us what information you would have liked to receive on the thread: http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?t=3023165

(edited 9 years ago)