The Student Room Group

Intermediate Value Theorem

Let a,bRa,b \in \mathbb{R} and let f,gC([a,b])f,g \in C([a,b]). Suppose f(a)<g(a)f(a)<g(a) and f(b)>g(b)f(b)>g(b). Prove that there is a c(a,b)c \in (a,b) such that f(c)=g(c)f(c)=g(c).

Edit: Solved.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by SherlockHolmes
Let a,bRa,b \in \mathbb{R} and let f,gC([a,b])f,g \in C([a,b]). Suppose f(a)<g(a)f(a)<g(a) and f(b)<g(b)f(b)<g(b). Prove that there is a c(a,b)c \in (a,b) such that f(c)=g(c)f(c)=g(c).

Edit: Solved.


Your thread was originally "Answered", though no longer. It still says "solved" - is it?

As it stands, it's not true. Don't you mean f(b)>g(b)f(b)>g(b) ?
Original post by ghostwalker
Your thread was originally "Answered", though no longer. It still says "solved" - is it?

As it stands, it's not true. Don't you mean f(b)>g(b)f(b)>g(b) ?


Yes I do mean that - sorry for the typo (I will edit the post).

I think I have solved it.

I was thinking of assuming that f(a)<f(b), proving it holds for this case and then prove the other cases (f(b)>f(a), g(a)<g(b), g(b)<g(a)).

For the first case I get:

g(b)<f(b)<f(a)<g(a)

By IVT:
For all y in [g(b),g(a)] there exists c in [a,b] such that g(c)=y.

For all y in [f(b),f(a)] there exists d in [a,b] such that f(d)=z.

Then as f is continuous and bounded below and above by g(b),g(a) respectively, we can set z=y.

So if y=z, this implies, c=d hence, f(c)=g(c).
Original post by SherlockHolmes
Let a,bRa,b \in \mathbb{R} and let f,gC([a,b])f,g \in C([a,b]). Suppose f(a)<g(a)f(a)<g(a) and f(b)>g(b)f(b)>g(b). Prove that there is a c(a,b)c \in (a,b) such that f(c)=g(c)f(c)=g(c).

Edit: Solved.


I think this can be approached by considering f(a)g(a)f(a)-g(a) and so on.
Original post by SherlockHolmes


I was thinking of assuming that f(a)<f(b), proving it holds for this case and then prove the other cases (f(b)>f(a), g(a)<g(b), g(b)<g(a)).

For the first case I get:

g(b)<f(b)<f(a)<g(a)


You don't have to assume f(a)<g(b) - you're told that.

I'm not clear what your cases are there.

You might find a diagram useful.


By IVT:
For all y in [g(b),g(a)] there exists c in [a,b] such that g(c)=y.

For all y in [f(b),f(a)] there exists d in [a,b] such that f(d)=z.

Then as f is continuous and bounded below and above by g(b),g(a) respectively, we can set z=y.

So if y=z, this implies, c=d hence, f(c)=g(c).


In bold - interval is [f(a),f(b)], though even the idea that it is an interval requires the IVT.

We can't set z=y, as we don't even know if thest two intervals [f(a),f(b)], [g(b),g(a)] overlap.

The method to use is the one atsruser just posted. Construct the function g(x)-f(x) or the negative thereof, and consider what values it takes at a,b, in particular their sign.
Original post by ghostwalker
You don't have to assume f(a)<g(b) - you're told that.

I'm not clear what your cases are there.

You might find a diagram useful.



In bold - interval is [f(a),f(b)], though even the idea that it is an interval requires the IVT.

We can't set z=y, as we don't even know if thest two intervals [f(a),f(b)], [g(b),g(a)] overlap.

The method to use is the one atsruser just posted. Construct the function g(x)-f(x) or the negative thereof, and consider what values it takes at a,b, in particular their sign.

I am not assuming f(a)<g(b), I am assuming f(a)<f(b). My idea is that this would then give: g(b)<f(b)<f(a)<g(a) so we know [f(a),f(b)] is contained in the interval [g(a),g(b)]. So then we can set z=y. Then we can change the assumption to cover the other cases. So when f(b)>f(a) this would give: f(a)<g(b)<f(b)<g(a). Do the same for g(a)<g(b) and g(b)<g(a).

I am not sure if my proof makes sense to be honest.

Via the (better) approach that was suggested by atsruser, I have drawn a diagram as you recommended.

The diagram shows that the two functions will intersect, which means f(c)=g(c) is true. (I understood that the two intersected but wasn't sure how to prove it - my attempt tries to show this). Would I then have to say that a point (c,f(c)) and (c,g(c)) exists in the interval by IVT or is the diagram enough to answer the question?

uploadfromtaptalk1425597790115.jpg
Original post by SherlockHolmes
Via the (better) approach that was suggested by atsruser, I have drawn a diagram as you recommended.

The diagram shows that the two functions will intersect, which means f(c)=g(c) is true. (I understood that the two intersected but wasn't sure how to prove it - my attempt tries to show this). Would I then have to say that a point (c,f(c)) and (c,g(c)) exists in the interval by IVTThis paragraph makes no sense. What is c?

I think you're trying to say something like:

there exists a value c, s.t. f(c) = g(c) (and so (c, f(c)) and (c, g(c)) are the same point).

But the IVT doesn't say this, because the IVT only talks about one function. So you need to reduce your problem involving two functions into a problem only involving one function.

At this point, you may want to remember that atsruser suggested you consider the function f(x) - g(x)...

or is the diagram enough to answer the question?
No. For this type of analysis, a diagram may help show what's going on, but it is never going to be rigourous enough to answer the question properly.
Original post by SherlockHolmes
I am not assuming f(a)<g(b), I am assuming f(a)<f(b).


Sorry, misread. The whole thing got to be rather confusing - trying to follow what you were doing.
Original post by ghostwalker
Sorry, misread. The whole thing got to be rather confusing - trying to follow what you were doing.

That's fine. I think I am making it more complicated than it should be.

f(a) - g(a) < 0
f(b) - g(b) > 0

So by IVT there exists a cc such that f(c)-g(c)=0.

Then f(c)=g(c).

Is that right?
Original post by SherlockHolmes
That's fine. I think I am making it more complicated than it should be.

f(a) - g(a) < 0
f(b) - g(b) > 0

So by IVT there exists a cc in (a,b) such that f(c)-g(c)=0.

Then f(c)=g(c).

Is that right?


That's it. Added the bit in red - it's clear you mean that, but it's always good to be precise when dealing with analysis.
Thanks for the help all - much appreciated.

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