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US Presidential Election 2016 official thread

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Original post by KimKallstrom
Given that Cruz's wife works for them, can you imagine the party they'll be having at Goldman Sachs HQ if it's a Cruz versus Clinton election? Urgh.....


The thing about Goldman's is that they play to win no matter what the outcome. Hence their slavering over Hilary, although the ties between Big Wall St and the Clintons go way back. They really are not just another monster bank, they are more like a bloated parasite feeding off the US body politic. Witness for example how easily they got off their disgracefully devious and lying role in the 2008 collapse and the ninja loan repackaging saga, actually getting the taxpayer to repay them for the losses on all the dodgy mortgage-backed financial 'products' they sold to AIG and others. That showed how their political connections help them out at times of crisis and ensure that Goldman investors (which almost beyond doubt include people like the Clintons) continue to profit no matter how hard the financial house of cards crashes down on poor and middle class Americans.

Then there are the journalists who act puzzled that there is so much anger amongst ordinary voters across the US. :rolleyes:
Original post by Fullofsurprises
It really does make one wonder if the establishment aren't going to 'insert' a more mainstream candidate into the proceedings before the big state votes. Bloomberg perhaps.


I don't think the establishment is really clocking on to the significance of what's happening. They will keep their money on Rubio and Clinton in the belief that 'America will never elect a socialist'.
Original post by Midlander


2. Bill's actions were brought on after Wall St lobbying and private donations. The repeal of that legislation gave free rein to people to commit fraud as a business model. Selling dodgy mortgages with one hand, then betting on them to fail with the other. The result was the most horrendous financial crash in 80 years and it came about because politicians removed the safeguards.George W Bush and Obama had the chance to put them back into place, neither did, and both have taken Wall St donations.


It's interesting to read about how Clinton took those decisions. His impulses were all free market anyway, hence his commitment to policies like NAFTA and his Third-Wayism always contained a lot more market liberalism than it did real commitment to social democratic values. (He transmitted that to Blair and Brown by a process of mental induction and possibly the use of electrodes. :teehee:)

There was a big discrepancy between his commitments to the working class (although they avoid using that term) and what his liberal-tax base government could do. One of the things to paper the cracks and keep the poorer (and especially urban, poor and black) vote on board was the rapid promotion of superficially cheap loans for house buying. Repackaging these into bonds and marking them triple-A was the ultimate way of recycling all that rubbish, but the original impetus came from the need to sustain a myth of economic growth for the US lower classes, whilst the reality was (and continues to be) stagnant or declining real incomes.

In effect, Clintonism was a sort of clown masquerade using funny money and tricks to keep some mildly 'cooler' politicians in office in DC who culturally loathed Republicans but had little to offer by way of genuine change.
Original post by Fullofsurprises
It's interesting to read about how Clinton took those decisions. His impulses were all free market anyway, hence his commitment to policies like NAFTA and his Third-Wayism always contained a lot more market liberalism than it did real commitment to social democratic values. (He transmitted that to Blair and Brown by a process of mental induction and possibly the use of electrodes. :teehee:)

There was a big discrepancy between his commitments to the working class (although they avoid using that term) and what his liberal-tax base government could do. One of the things to paper the cracks and keep the poorer (and especially urban, poor and black) vote on board was the rapid promotion of superficially cheap loans for house buying. Repackaging these into bonds and marking them triple-A was the ultimate way of recycling all that rubbish, but the original impetus came from the need to sustain a myth of economic growth for the US lower classes, whilst the reality was (and continues to be) stagnant or declining real incomes.

In effect, Clintonism was a sort of clown masquerade using funny money and tricks to keep some mildly 'cooler' politicians in office in DC who culturally loathed Republicans but had little to offer by way of genuine change.


There is something about American political speak I have never understood and it's that 'middle class' refers to the baseline voter whereas here it's 'working class'. Is that because they don't think it's worth acknowledging them or because they don't think a blue collar class exists?

His repeal of Glass-Steagall, which was in effect dead by that point anyway, shows what Wall St donations achieved. In this week's Democrat town hall Hillary said she took the speaking fees 'because that's what all Secretaries of State do'. If that is the best she can do to defend the current way of working then it says an awful lot. New Hampshire is Bernie's to lose, that much is clear.

What I find amusing is that rich white lady Hillary Clinton is trying to persuade herself as a civil rights crusader to win the ethnic vote and characterise old white man Bernie as unsuitable for that. If Obama couldn't reverse things like institutional racism I don't know how either of them can.
Original post by F.borne
http://edition.cnn.com/interactive/2016/politics/election-candidate-matchmaker/

Have you guys taken this? Everyone I know seems to have gotten Hilary Clinton, a few got Martin O'Malley, there was a Jeb Bush in there as well


I got the 3 Democrats with Hillary top and Bernie second. Not sure how, based on my answers.
Reply 565
Original post by Midlander
I got the 3 Democrats with Hillary top and Bernie second. Not sure how, based on my answers.


1. Christie
2. O'Malley
3. Sanders

:lolwut:

:lol:
Original post by F.borne
http://edition.cnn.com/interactive/2016/politics/election-candidate-matchmaker/

Have you guys taken this? Everyone I know seems to have gotten Hilary Clinton, a few got Martin O'Malley, there was a Jeb Bush in there as well


1. Sanders
2. Clinton
3. O'Malley

Original post by Rakas21
Surprised i got Cruz though.


Original post by Midlander
Not sure how, based on my answers.




There's also www.isidewith.com which is quite a bit more extensive, and from what I can tell more accurate for a larger number of people.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by Josb
1. Christie
2. O'Malley
3. Sanders

:lolwut:

:lol:


It took me a while to accept that Chris Christie was a genuine name.
Reply 568
1. Sanders: 74%
2. Trump: 71%
3. Cruz: 71%

:lol:
Original post by Josb
1. Sanders: 74%
2. Trump: 71%
3. Cruz: 71%

:lol:


6 possible entries, 5 different names, that's one hell of a variance :ahee:
Original post by Fullofsurprises
It really does make one wonder if the establishment aren't going to 'insert' a more mainstream candidate into the proceedings before the big state votes. Bloomberg perhaps.


Rand Paul a moderate?
On the CNN thing I got

1. Sanders
2. O'Malley
3. Clinton

On isidewith I got:

1. Bernie Sanders (84%)
2. Hillary Clinton (80%)
3. Ted Cruz (66%)
4. Donald Trump (65%)
5. Jeb! Bush (64%)

http://www.isidewith.com/elections/2016-presidential/1823106280

:dontknow:
Reply 572
Clinton
O'Mailey
Sanders

That fits with my personal views. I like Sanders, I think he is asking the right questions, he has injected something into American politics that has been missing for a long time. But I don't think his answers are the right ones. I think his plans don't make much economic sense, and I am unsure about where he stands on foreign policy. I don't like Clinton much, she comes across as dishonest and a professional politician. But, that being said, she seems the only alternative. Ah politics is so cynical.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by Fullofsurprises
It really does make one wonder if the establishment aren't going to 'insert' a more mainstream candidate into the proceedings before the big state votes. Bloomberg perhaps.


The primaries are run by the state governments on behalf of the parties. Republican filing dates are usually considerably earlier than Democrat ones. It would be impossible now to add Bloomberg to most state primaries and the involvement of state governments make changing the rules much harder.

That means Bloomberg's only chance of running (or being co-opted following an independent campaign) as a Republican would be following a brokered convention.
Original post by nulli tertius
The primaries are run by the state governments on behalf of the parties. Republican filing dates are usually considerably earlier than Democrat ones. It would be impossible now to add Bloomberg to most state primaries and the involvement of state governments make changing the rules much harder.

That means Bloomberg's only chance of running (or being co-opted following an independent campaign) as a Republican would be following a brokered convention.


I thought states have different rules and they also vary by party? Maybe it's too late though as you say, apart from at the convention.

It's interesting on the main topic to look at how endorsements are going, that's been one of the big predictors in past primaries. Rubio and Bush currently lead the pack for those on the Rep side.
http://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2016-endorsement-primary/
Original post by Fullofsurprises
I thought states have different rules and they also vary by party? Maybe it's too late though as you say, apart from at the convention.

It's interesting on the main topic to look at how endorsements are going, that's been one of the big predictors in past primaries. Rubio and Bush currently lead the pack for those on the Rep side.
http://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2016-endorsement-primary/


It would be interesting to see Labour or the Tories have an endorsement primary in terms of helping create a unified party.
Original post by Fullofsurprises
I thought states have different rules and they also vary by party? Maybe it's too late though as you say, apart from at the convention.


Yes they do.

The dates are here. He is too late for New York, Texas, Illinois and Florida but in time for California

https://ballotpedia.org/Ballot_access_for_presidential_candidates
Original post by Aj12
I am unsure about where he stands on foreign policy.


This is arguably going to be Sanders' biggest weakness going forward, he needs to start being more assertive on his positions here.
Sanders foreign policy will be somewhat similar to Obama's by the looks of things. He won't charge in to Iraq 2.0 but he will remain in Syria.
Original post by Midlander
There is something about American political speak I have never understood and it's that 'middle class' refers to the baseline voter whereas here it's 'working class'. Is that because they don't think it's worth acknowledging them or because they don't think a blue collar class exists?.


I find this very strange as well. When watching a few of Bernie Sanders debates/demonstrations etc. I was very confused every time he appealed to the ''middle class'' as I thought the average American would've classed themselves as working class :s-smilie:.

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