Feel like life can never be truly 'great' if you don't attend Oxbridge
Nothing to shout about every time you go to a dinner, an event or meet someone new. Have to work much harder to get top jobs. Going to just another Russell Group is OK and gives you a fighting 1/1000000 chance, but nowhere near 'elite'. The next 50 years of your working life will be dull and you won't be special. The few sacrifices from the ages of 16-21 are all made up for 10fold by the benefits.
The only option left to truly 'make it' and be 'great' is to create a hugely successful business, be a sporting prodigy - something which is decided by early 20s - maybe 23-24 at the latest - or make a serious discovery/invention in the fields of technology or science, maybe become a politician... but then you're middle aged minimum anyway, probably at least 50+ and no one will really have heard of you.
Discuss.
My situation:
I never did any work, only revised for GCSEs/A levels the night before exams (got A*s to Bs, so way above average but nothing out of ordinary from a good private school) and wrote all my uni essays overnight/in the morning before the deadlines which were usually 4pm and got 2:1s. I literally took the ****. 12k dissertation in 6 days. If I did just a little bit more, nothing like the 10 hours a day some people do, I'm sure I could have challenged for Oxbridge and my school suggested I did, but I could never get motivated and always prioritised sport, which I was near pro level in one before injury, and academy level before I quit in the other when 16. I feel I will go down the route of being in a reputable career, do well for a bit, then invest/go businessman mode to try and 'make it' along with trying to push for a political career at some point if I can, as something I have been interested in since school.
Note:
I am not hellbent in my views here and wanted to start a little debate.
The only option left to truly 'make it' and be 'great' is to create a hugely successful business, be a sporting prodigy - something which is decided by early 20s - maybe 23-24 at the latest - or make a serious discovery/invention in the fields of technology or science, maybe become a politician... but then you're middle aged minimum anyway, probably at least 50+ and no one will really have heard of you.
Discuss.
My situation:
I never did any work, only revised for GCSEs/A levels the night before exams (got A*s to Bs, so way above average but nothing out of ordinary from a good private school) and wrote all my uni essays overnight/in the morning before the deadlines which were usually 4pm and got 2:1s. I literally took the ****. 12k dissertation in 6 days. If I did just a little bit more, nothing like the 10 hours a day some people do, I'm sure I could have challenged for Oxbridge and my school suggested I did, but I could never get motivated and always prioritised sport, which I was near pro level in one before injury, and academy level before I quit in the other when 16. I feel I will go down the route of being in a reputable career, do well for a bit, then invest/go businessman mode to try and 'make it' along with trying to push for a political career at some point if I can, as something I have been interested in since school.
Note:
I am not hellbent in my views here and wanted to start a little debate.
(edited 9 years ago)
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I didn't even go to a Russel group uni and people are impressed when they find out I have a physics degree. 
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by ChaoticButterfly
I didn't even go to a Russel group uni and people are impressed when they find out I have a physics degree.
It's interesting to think what percentile that would put you at in the country compared with the rest of the population. Too hard to find figures on that kind of thing.
I know exactly what you mean, I used to think that for a long time. But if you get a first then you can be confident in your ability and subject, and you can always think of a postgrad at Oxbridge if you really want. If not then you could set your sights on a new discovery/invention as you said and see where life takes you
Well, I study at Oxford (PPE) and I doubt my prospects would be hindered by a PPE-like degree from another university such as LSE, UCL, Warwick. I'd go as far as saying that a hypothetical 1st class degree from UCL for PPE (yes, they now have their own PPE course) can be better than a low 2:1 from Oxford. Nevermind 2:2. This is especially the case if you want to go into academia or seek employment upon graduation in the UK. Admittedly, this is less so in countries such as Finland [my country], wherein employers do not really distinguish between 2:1 v 2:2 and for them Oxford is just Oxford.
Another point I would make is that there is probably a bigger disparity within the Russell Group universities than between Oxbridge and the rest. Say, you graduate with Chemistry from Oxford v Chemistry from ICL and Leeds, all with 1st class. There is probably a bigger disparity between Imperial and Leeds than between Imperial and Oxford.
Another point I would make is that there is probably a bigger disparity within the Russell Group universities than between Oxbridge and the rest. Say, you graduate with Chemistry from Oxford v Chemistry from ICL and Leeds, all with 1st class. There is probably a bigger disparity between Imperial and Leeds than between Imperial and Oxford.
Original post by Gaiaphage
I know exactly what you mean, I used to think that for a long time. But if you get a first then you can be confident in your ability and subject, and you can always think of a postgrad at Oxbridge if you really want. If not then you could set your sights on a new discovery/invention as you said and see where life takes you
Yeah, I'm probably smart enough to have gone and I believe a lot of people are, but simply don't do enough work. I never did anywhere near enough work, always doing the bare minimum... in general a serial dosser as I had no motivation to get A*s every time like other seemed to do, paying close attention from 8:45 in the morning registration time right till 4pm, then go home to do it again, whereas I was counting down the hours to go home, play sport and to get that Friday night feeling. I'm good but probably not good enough in sports, on the earlier rounds of the political stuff so could end up a MP, not into science/technology and studying law. I think I will maximise my sport/politics/business avenues.
Did you get a first and post-grad at Oxbridge?
(edited 9 years ago)
That's pretty much true, though it's not really attending Oxbridge itself that's the magic bullet - friends who have gone there have fallen firmly on their feet but nothing stratospheric or outside the realm of what could reasonably be achieved by a Russell Group alumnus. What makes the difference is having the sort of background and connections which also themselves mean you walk into Oxbridge; to think it's all down to Oxbridge itself is to ignore the class system and buy into the myth of meritocracy.
Original post by Xin Xang
I totally agree. Its like paying £500 for Nokia Brick Phone when you could have bought an IPhone for the same price only if you had put in a bit more effort.
People who say that I have no life for studying a lot, can s**k it. We'll see who has the last laugh.
People who say that I have no life for studying a lot, can s**k it. We'll see who has the last laugh.
Sorry, if you have to study a lot to get your grades, you've already lost. Plenty of talented people who can rock up to the exam and get a first as well as row for their college and act in 20 Footlights plays per term.
Original post by ZolaCFC25
Yeah, I'm probably smart enough to have gone and I believe a lot of people are, but simply don't do enough work. I never did anywhere near enough work, always doing the bare minimum... in general a serial dosser as I had no motivated to get A*s every time like other seemed to do, paying close attention from 8:45 in the morning registration time right till 4pm, then go home to do it again, where as I was sleeping haha. I'm good but probably not good enough in sports, on the earlier rounds of the political stuff so could end up a MP, not into science/technology and studying law. I think I will maximise my sport/politics/business avenues.
Did you get a first and post-grad at Oxbridge?
Did you get a first and post-grad at Oxbridge?
To be a professional football player in the UK you have to live very close to an academy and start training there at no later than 11 otherwise you won't make it into the elite academy by 14 and therefore won't get a contract by 16, once you've missed that deadline there's no chance of a decent career. I don't know enough about other sports but my friend is a semi-pro rugby player and started playing there at around 10 - he may well be an anomaly for all I know!
In my opinion being an MP isn't really anything special, you just need to choose to stand and be popular with voters. Being in the cabinet would be much more impressive but would take some serious work! I think the business world is your best bet, it takes a huge stroke of luck to make it big but you can make your own luck with ability.
Not old enough to have finished a degree but I have a cambs offer, what about you?
Original post by William Pitt
Well, I study at Oxford (PPE) and I doubt my prospects would be hindered by a PPE-like degree from another university such as LSE, UCL, Warwick. I'd go as far as saying that a hypothetical 1st class degree from UCL for PPE (yes, they now have their own PPE course) can be better than a low 2:1 from Oxford. Nevermind 2:2. This is especially the case if you want to go into academia or seek employment upon graduation in the UK. Admittedly, this is less so in countries such as Finland [my country], wherein employers do not really distinguish between 2:1 v 2:2 and for them Oxford is just Oxford.
Another point I would make is that there is probably a bigger disparity within the Russell Group universities than between Oxbridge and the rest. Say, you graduate with Chemistry from Oxford v Chemistry from ICL and Leeds, all with 1st class. There is probably a bigger disparity between Imperial and Leeds than between Imperial and Oxford.
Another point I would make is that there is probably a bigger disparity within the Russell Group universities than between Oxbridge and the rest. Say, you graduate with Chemistry from Oxford v Chemistry from ICL and Leeds, all with 1st class. There is probably a bigger disparity between Imperial and Leeds than between Imperial and Oxford.
Say we set aside the big London 3 (UCL, LSE, Imperial), then maybe 1 or 2 of Russell Group (Warwick for some courses, maybe Durham - and I actually applied, but just missed by Durham grades, and then turned down Warwick for a 'lesser' Russell Group that you have mentioned due to far superior sporting opportunities that meant/mean a lot to me)... then we have the rest of the Russell Group unis that put you in the almost guaranteed middle class, and quite easily very wealthy bracket, as long as you are switched on and didn't do a pointless degree like sports science. But the point is surrounded in a job or social circle, as you generally would be, where all of your friends are the same and most of the top dogs all went to Oxbridge, you are not really going to stand out.
So if you want to be special, you are better off pursuing something perhaps with a little more risk, adventure or at the very least, initiative to reach the major. Otherwise you can probably settle on 70-100k a year by the time you are 40 odd, if you do well, but probably never anything substantially more without investments and definitely not fame through your profession.
But then again, you look at all the 'nice' people who went to Oxbridge and were happy with a career in academia with a decent lifestyle as a history or classics teacher at a independent school somewhere and you realise not everyone is motivated through their ego.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by scrotgrot
Sorry, if you have to study a lot to get your grades, you've already lost. Plenty of talented people who can rock up to the exam and get a first as well as row for their college and act in 20 Footlights plays per term.
That's why you won't be going to Oxbridge. That idiotic mentality that believes such stories is almost certainly going to fail.
You think that I don't put up a front. I spend enough time socialising and playing in my school orchestra that people often ask me how I end up doing well without revising. When I tell them after results day, they feel cheated but that's the way of life.
Believe me. Those that do REALLY well put up a front. People like you fall for it, and are abruptly knocked out the competition.
Original post by Xin Xang
That's why you won't be going to Oxbridge. That idiotic mentality that believes such stories is almost certainly going to fail.
You think that I don't put up a front. I spend enough time socialising and playing in my school orchestra that people often ask me how I end up doing well without revising. When I tell them after results day, they feel cheated but that's the way of life.
Believe me. Those that do REALLY well put up a front. People like you fall for it, and are abruptly knocked out the competition.
You think that I don't put up a front. I spend enough time socialising and playing in my school orchestra that people often ask me how I end up doing well without revising. When I tell them after results day, they feel cheated but that's the way of life.
Believe me. Those that do REALLY well put up a front. People like you fall for it, and are abruptly knocked out the competition.
^ Obviously a guy who does really well and puts up a front, you know exactly what you're talking about
Original post by Gaiaphage
^ Obviously a guy who does really well and puts up a front, you know exactly what you're talking about
lol not sure if being sarcastic?
Original post by Gaiaphage
To be a professional football player in the UK you have to live very close to an academy and start training there at no later than 11 otherwise you won't make it into the elite academy by 14 and therefore won't get a contract by 16, once you've missed that deadline there's no chance of a decent career. I don't know enough about other sports but my friend is a semi-pro rugby player and started playing there at around 10 - he may well be an anomaly for all I know!
In my opinion being an MP isn't really anything special, you just need to choose to stand and be popular with voters. Being in the cabinet would be much more impressive but would take some serious work! I think the business world is your best bet, it takes a huge stroke of luck to make it big but you can make your own luck with ability.
Not old enough to have finished a degree but I have a cambs offer, what about you?
In my opinion being an MP isn't really anything special, you just need to choose to stand and be popular with voters. Being in the cabinet would be much more impressive but would take some serious work! I think the business world is your best bet, it takes a huge stroke of luck to make it big but you can make your own luck with ability.
Not old enough to have finished a degree but I have a cambs offer, what about you?
I hear all that. Although being an MP will give you more fame than most people can dream of, and definitely more fame then most Oxbridge people anyway, so as I said in a previous post, many won't be pursing money/fame.
Already doing post-grad at Russell Group uni and going into law, so financially should be ok, but only in a profession which is limited.
I was very good at cricket (and rugby) as a youngster and could have gone pro without a bit of bad luck and injuries... cricket and rugby you don't really need to be very good at until you are 16+, even early 20s. Premier League football is completely different and you are literally in such a small cut-off bracket. Not much money in other sports though... well virtually none at all, but a bit of fame for just having fun and following your passion, and you can carry on studying and pursuing other things in the winter/free time.
Plan is probably to go down the law route for a while, hopefully get a decent training contract at a solid firm (not necessarily magic or silver circle) then continue the politics as I go along and probably go into business. I will inherit and takeover a lot as my dad started off as a professional then became a pretty successful businessman, so I guess I already have a massive headstart that only very few could have in that regard. I also have a good business mind, to my view, as opposed to one geared towards doing the donkey work for someone else.
(edited 9 years ago)
Original post by Xin Xang
That's why you won't be going to Oxbridge. That idiotic mentality that believes such stories is almost certainly going to fail.
You think that I don't put up a front. I spend enough time socialising and playing in my school orchestra that people often ask me how I end up doing well without revising. When I tell them after results day, they feel cheated but that's the way of life.
Believe me. Those that do REALLY well put up a front. People like you fall for it, and are abruptly knocked out the competition.
You think that I don't put up a front. I spend enough time socialising and playing in my school orchestra that people often ask me how I end up doing well without revising. When I tell them after results day, they feel cheated but that's the way of life.
Believe me. Those that do REALLY well put up a front. People like you fall for it, and are abruptly knocked out the competition.
Put up a front, you mean people are just pretending not to revise? I should think that's projection. I know this can't be right because I'm the counter-example: I'm really lazy, have basically never done any proper work or revision and have still always got A's and firsts. I've never done really well, I suppose, but I'm not too bothered. I'm sure you can probably make it up with a lot of hard work but at some point you're going to be out-competed if it doesn't come naturally, same as sports or indeed the orchestra. And really life is too short to be consigning yourself to working hard all the time.
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