College Culture (America vs. Britain)

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spencer smith

Yes she is. Sales is considered a front office job, but it is one of the least respected. There are like 20 people in Sales for one Trader in the Sales, Trading and Research dept (also known as Markets).

I thought she got in Morgan or Lehman (or some American BB) Investment Banking Division, which is a lot more glamorous. I was wrong and wholly surprised esp. because of her Stanford background.

An arts (non-numerical) degree really can't take people far.

how is sales one of the least respected?some people choose sales and trading, because they offer human hours, rather than the 20 hours day IBD sessions.

Reply 1661

dismal_laundry

spencer smith

Ya I guess most are unhappy with the new interface as well.

I miss being able to change colors...

Reply 1662

pendragon

Im for Clinton and MCain.

Reply 1663

frankiehills

What do you think would be a more enjoyable experience:
4 years at UCLA or 3 years at Cambridge?

Reply 1664

maths-enthusiast

enjoyable depends on perspective, own choice, likes, dislikes etc

Reply 1665

dismal_laundry

Also depends on what degree you propose to do and how happy you are with your choice- in the US students generally do a variety of general classes for the first two years and then specialize in the last two. In the UK students get right into the subject(s) with the start of year 1. Also, be aware that studying long term in the US will be very expensive. Even if you are lucky enought to get aid, a significant proportion of that will be loans.

Reply 1666

frankiehills

Yeah, I'm actually looking for sponsorship now.Thanks for replying.

Reply 1667

Tajel

spencer smith

An arts (non-numerical) degree really can't take people far.

I'll be sure to mention that to the many extremely wealthy and successful clients I see with liberal arts degrees.

Reply 1668

tomilis

Hello,

Hmmm... having read all 84 pages of the thread ( :eek:

), relevant information to the topic was only found in a handful of the posts. What I wanted to know was a bit more about the differences in college culture and life in the US as opposed to the UK. Currently I am at a UK university in my first year, but I've had a US education abroad (from Pre-K to Grade 12), having done the IB in the last two years.

Now all this business about American students being immature compared to British students, is it true? Is there a major difference? Personally, everyone here looks like they're about to be executed, so a bit of frivolity would be much appreciated. On a similar note, has anyone noticed anything markedly different between the humor of US students and that of the British students? Seems to me Americans are a little bit more random and spontaneous in their jokes whereas Brits thrive on cynicism. Is there a marked difference?

Other than that, if I was going to look at US universities, I am a great admirer of the liberal arts education. How different is it from the University lifestyle in the US and the UK? Is there a real strong sense of community? Does it seem like people are there to have fun and develop rather than get trained for a job? And how is the work? is it more essay-work or more group projects, fieldwork, etc.? I understand its taught in classes and therefore not many lectures? How big are the classes and how many are there in a week?

Apart from academics, how do most people spend their time? Is there a lot more community service, group travel (excursions, etc.) or is it largely the same in terms of opportunities and events?

Sorry for the huge amount of questions, its just I've been having my doubts about whether the UK system is right for me, but this may just be the effect of transitioning between two different educational philosophies. For example, some of my friends in the US talked about having things like capture the flag matches during orientation week. Something like that would be unthinkable at most UK universities I feel, it would be rubbished, but heck, its just as fun as getting wasted every night.

Reply 1669

devil09

tomilis

about American students...British students...Is there a major difference?

No.

tomilis

On a similar note, has anyone noticed anything markedly different between the humor of US students and that of the British students? Seems to me Americans are a little bit more random and spontaneous in their jokes whereas Brits thrive on cynicism. Is there a marked difference?

Eh, I didn't notice much of a difference. I did notice that Americans tended to be much more outspoken in class than their British counterparts, and I had several lecturers tell me they liked American students for that reason. Not sure why that is.

tomilis

Is there a real strong sense of community?

Depends on the college.

tomilis

Does it seem like people are there to have fun and develop rather than get trained for a job?

I wouldn't say it's an either/or scenario; most colleges encourage both. There are A LOT of very driven and ambitious pre-professional students at my school, but they also know how to kick back and relax.

tomilis

And how is the work? is it more essay-work or more group projects, fieldwork, etc.?

Depends on the class.

tomilis

I understand its taught in classes and therefore not many lectures?

Some classes are seminars, where you sit and discuss things. Some classes are lectures, where you sit and take notes. Some classes are field or lab based, where you're doing hands on work. It varies. In general, though, the majority of classes involve at least some lectures.

tomilis

How big are the classes and how many are there in a week?

College size runs from 26 (Deep Springs) to 38000 (Ohio State). Class sizes vary accordingly.

How many depends on the college and how many courses you take. I'd guess about 12-15 hours a week in class is average.

tomilis

Apart from academics, how do most people spend their time? Is there a lot more community service, group travel (excursions, etc.) or is it largely the same in terms of opportunities and events?

Once again, depends on the college. Students at NYU would be more likely to explore NYC, whereas Kenyon students would be more likely to participate in on-campus events (theater, clubs, music ensembles, intramural sports, etc.).

Reply 1670

tomilis

devil09

Thanks for the info, although, sorry if I didn't make this clear, what I was looking for specifically was a comparison of the liberal arts colleges to universities in the UK and US. Are the majority of classes there essay-based or is there more of a culture of doing projects and the like? Is there anything particularly different that students do apart from the liberal arts academia that give them the alleged "all-rounded"-ness?

Reply 1671

beautiful sunrise

devil09

Think it's to do with how kids are schooled in America. Bill Bryson made that comparison when he moved his kids there - how they were not just encouraged, but expected to speak up and contribute in classes, and that it was influential in turning them into confident young adults. Or something to that effect. I think the approach to teaching in the UK is slightly more laissez-faire - I went to a fantastic school, but I was pretty shy and I managed good grades without saying a whole lot in my 7 years there.

Reply 1672

Bismarck

beautiful sunrise

I was under the impression that it was the structure of the degree that marked out American degrees, particularly liberal arts degrees, i.e. module choices - more freedom to structure your degree as you like in the US whereas it's more rigid here. But the modules themselves I would imagine are the same on both sides of the pond - taught by lectures and tutorials, tested by essays, projects and exams. How much is weighted towards essays or exams depends on the uni, the course, the module and the course leader.

You might get a more detailed answer in a US forum. I would imagine there aren't many posters here who have a detailed knowledge of american degrees - they're more likely to be embarking on one themselves. Or do a side-by-side comparison of modules you like the look of from particular universities in the US and the UK.

American modules more heavily emphasize exams. A typical module in the US lasts one semester (compared to two in Britain), and despite this, manages to fit in 2-3 exams. If there is an essay, it's usually a fairly short. If it's a long one, then it replaces the final exam (as a general rule). The class format is different as well (though there's a lot of variation). Instead of the British system of separate lecture and tutorial classes, American universities usually have merge the two (some entry-level classes excepted; they often have a separate lecture and discussion sessions), where a professor is expected to both lecture and get the class involved at the same time. Also, each class is weighed equally (assuming the same amount of credit hours). That means a class taken in the first semester counts as much as one taken in the final semester. Slacking off at the beginning is hard to make up at the end.

tomilis

Grades are heavily based on exams and to a lesser extent class participation. Essays aren't as frequent as they are in Britain (though this varies by field) and projects are even less so.

Reply 1673

Turdburger

pendragon

Im for Clinton and MCain.

(Jan08)

Unlucky :p:

Reply 1674

tomilis

Bismarck

Ah, thanks for that. So, in conclusion, the largest differences between having a liberal arts education in a liberal arts college in the US compared to in the UK are simply theres a greater breadth of study and that you are living in a different culture.

But what about the spiel earlier in this thread about smaller student bodies, smaller classes, more teaching-orientated teachers that actually interact meaningfully with students? The, from the British PoV, so-called "hand-leading"? Would you say this is the case?

I'm also surprised at what people say about the British education being more about critical learning as opposed to rote as seen in the American system. My preconception, having been educated in a American variation that was clearly anti-rote, was that it was the other way around. Surely its more in the British mindset to support the accumulation of knowledge as opposed to the American liberal arts education where personal exploration and connections are meant to be made?

Please enlighten me.

Reply 1675

Champagne Breakfast

tomilis

But what about the spiel earlier in this thread about smaller student bodies, smaller classes, more teaching-orientated teachers that actually interact meaningfully with students? The, from the British PoV, so-called "hand-leading"? Would you say this is the case?

I'm also surprised at what people say about the British education being more about critical learning as opposed to rote as seen in the American system. My preconception, having been educated in a American variation that was clearly anti-rote, was that it was the other way around. Surely its more in the British mindset to support the accumulation of knowledge as opposed to the American liberal arts education where personal exploration and connections are meant to be made?

Please enlighten me.

I'm a British student studying at an American college. From my experience, classes have been a mix of smaller discussion sections with a focus on participation (usually humanities classes and my Core classes in things like literature, philosophy etc.. often capped at 22 students), and large/medium-sized lectures with smaller 'recitations' or 'discussion sections' separate from the lecture. These smaller classes are sometimes voluntary, sometimes not, but generally you will gain from going to them.

For my major Economics however, in terms of actual discussion of concepts--very little. You go to lecture to learn the concepts and benefit from the professor's insight, and then you go to recitation to cover the mathematical concepts. The only discussions I was able to have were during office hours. I personally think it makes sense as Economics is definitely more a science than an art, and this would definitely not be the case if you were majoring in Philosophy, for instance. I also like the independence at my college--the resources are out there if you want more (reading lists, professor's office hours, etc) but you really have to go out and do it yourself. But definitely not for everyone. Of course, you have to remember that things are different depending on the type of college you go to. I am at a large research university, whereas if you go to a 'liberal arts college' like Williams/Amherst you can expect much smaller classes, friendlier professors and definitely more of that 'exploration' stuff you mention.

I think what is perhaps most telling about the liberal arts philosophy though is that, despite being an Economics major, I have taken year-long seminar classes in literature and philosophy (with a heavy focus on discussion), am required to take 2 years of a foreign language, 3 science classes, a writing class, an art and music class, and even two PE classes. Personally I'm extremely happy here, and the research university/liberal arts balance is perfect for me. But definitely not for everyone.

Reply 1676

pendragon

Turdburger

(Jan08)

Unlucky :p:

Well at least Hillary is secretary of state. :smile:

Reply 1677

get_more

drinking culture? visit Manchester first. :p:

Reply 1678

England_Rugby

You are generally right. Here in the UK college is completely different to college in the US. For a start college in the UK doesn't normally last 4 years, mostly it's 2 to 3 years and then off to Uni or work. As we have something called apprenticeships which are focused more on the job than college. We don't drink much at college, we come to college study and meet friends and socialise and then go home. Whereas I'm led to believe that college in America is about 4 years, and you stay in or around college for that period whilst studying. Also,you guys drink a lot more than us, well that's what the American Pie films show us Brits. You guys tend to enjoy yourselves more and as you said have the best years of you're lives!