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Should inheritance be banished?

Idea came up in another thread. The logic being, if people had to earn their worth from society regardless of who their parents were, then people would cooperate together more and their greed would be more limited.

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Most people are not greedy because of their inheritance. There are plenty who make their own living and are yet greedy
I think the more people have to work for something, the more selfish they'll become over it.

On a related note, if people were required to earn everything they have, does this also involve the removal of (equally-unearned) social security benefits, or is it more of a 'remove an unfair advantage' type concept?
Absolutely not, and I say this even though I have never inherited anything money wise from family members. This logic is why only a set few in society become wealthy enough to even leave anything for their family members to inherit in the first place.

The way I see it, if you have worked hard for your money then you should have every right to allow your family members to inherit your money. Although I am not a strong pro-capitalist, this socialist notion of sharing everything would in my view really reduce creativity in the world. Why work hard when its just going to be shared anyway? Human nature is intrinsically selfish, I hardly doubt that will ever change.
Many parents work their whole lives just for the future of their kids. It should defineatly not be stopped.
Came here looking for a thread about abolishing inheritance tax which I could get behind. I am disappointed.
Never, otherwise i would not work. Even at my young age, i'm working for my offspring brah!
Original post by aaronlowe
Idea came up in another thread. The logic being, if people had to earn their worth from society regardless of who their parents were, then people would cooperate together more and their greed would be more limited.


"then people would cooperate more and be less greedy"
you can't change human nature, and you can't change the fact that people's money rightfully belongs to them, the earners, not society or the state.
Reply 8
Original post by zippity.doodah
"then people would cooperate more and be less greedy"
you can't change human nature, and you can't change the fact that people's money rightfully belongs to them, the earners, not society or the state.


But we can manage that human nature, and the definition of "rightfully" is variable. I'm only posing the question as an abstract debate, not for people to get too worried about. I don't think it's happening any time soon :wink:
Original post by aaronlowe
But we can manage that human nature, and the definition of "rightfully" is variable. I'm only posing the question as an abstract debate, not for people to get too worried about. I don't think it's happening any time soon :wink:


haha don't see it happening either plus the rich would just go to another country or use their powerful lawyers,accountants to come up with new schemes. So it's virtually impossible.
Reply 10
Original post by Bill_Gates
haha don't see it happening either plus the rich would just go to another country or use their powerful lawyers,accountants to come up with new schemes. So it's virtually impossible.


So, if inheritance was fundamentally illegal, like written into the constitution or something, how would they "get round" it. In that system I think the government could confiscate any assets directly or indirectly linking a person to their benifactor. The benefactor would become the state, making everyone stakeholders in society. It would be like an anti-anarchy policy.
Original post by aaronlowe
But we can manage that human nature,


indoctrination?

and the definition of "rightfully" is variable. I'm only posing the question as an abstract debate, not for people to get too worried about. I don't think it's happening any time soon :wink:


no I meant that objectively - if two people voluntarily deal/contract with one another in the transfer of money/wealth, property or services/time, then that, due to that consent, is the only truly fair and legitimate manner of transference or attainment of those latter things. if I told you that we could say that rape can sometimes be subjectively good if it is ordered to occur by a state or a democratic (mob-majoritarian) society, would you think I was correct or would you think I was crazy? look at my first sentence again and tell me.
Original post by aaronlowe
Idea came up in another thread. The logic being, if people had to earn their worth from society regardless of who their parents were, then people would cooperate together more and their greed would be more limited.


people with no assets are as greedy as people with loads of assets. its in human nature. what would suggest happens to all the assets ppl accumulate in their lives - go to you?
Original post by aaronlowe
So, if inheritance was fundamentally illegal, like written into the constitution or something, how would they "get round" it. In that system I think the government could confiscate any assets directly or indirectly linking a person to their benifactor. The benefactor would become the state, making everyone stakeholders in society. It would be like an anti-anarchy policy.


it's not illegal to take your assets and leave the country now is it?
Reply 14
Original post by zippity.doodah
indoctrination?

We are already indoctrinated. The question is, what do we want to be indoctrinated by?

Original post by zippity.doodah

no I meant that objectively - if two people voluntarily deal/contract with one another in the transfer of money/wealth, property or services/time, then that, due to that consent, is the only truly fair and legitimate manner of transference or attainment of those latter things. if I told you that we could say that rape can sometimes be subjectively good if it is ordered to occur by a state or a democratic (mob-majoritarian) society, would you think I was correct or would you think I was crazy? look at my first sentence again and tell me.


I'm exploring whether that is the only truly fair and legitimate manner. I'm not necessarily saying it is, but if it is, then it should stand up to scrutiny.

I'm not sure that broadening the debate to include crime makes it easier to frame the idea. I struggle to draw a parallel and would prefer that was a separate debate that had it's own focus. Only saying I'm not sure I can answer your question within the context of the original post, sorry.
Reply 15
Original post by Bill_Gates
it's not illegal to take your assets and leave the country now is it?


No, of course not, but you'd be heavily taxed. You'd be taxed earning the money. Then taxed spending it. Then finally taxed exporting it.

If you're lucky you'll get half the value after all of that and the government gets the other half. Should a state be so inefficient that it requires half the output of society to function? Imaging a manager of a department needed a salary equal to half the total salaries of the other employees in that department. Would that be considered efficient?

I would call that dysfunctional.
Original post by aaronlowe
We are already indoctrinated. The question is, what do we want to be indoctrinated by?


what are we really indoctrinated by in 2015? we are indoctrinated to put food into our stomachs and serve it on silverware on wooden tables three times a day when the sun goes into certain positions in the sky, and we are indoctrinated to wear clothes in hot weather, but are we really indoctrinated by the idea that consent is a wrong way of organisation in society?

I'm exploring whether that is the only truly fair and legitimate manner. I'm not necessarily saying it is, but if it is, then it should stand up to scrutiny.

I'm not sure that broadening the debate to include crime makes it easier to frame the idea. I struggle to draw a parallel and would prefer that was a separate debate that had it's own focus. Only saying I'm not sure I can answer your question within the context of the original post, sorry.


I'm not too sure there are ways other than consent which could really make for a fair society - if people make mistakes, and they lose property in their lives and become poor, or they do not work effectively enough to get property in the first place, I wouldn't say that their life was based on any kind of organised unfairness
Reply 17
No government in the UK would ever back this idea (especially not a conservative one) but I certainly agree with it in an abstracted principle. If money exists as an abstract symbol of your personal capital it should not be passed between people without an equivalent exchange of capital in the from of goods or services. Problem is there are a lot of questions that rise in terms of alternatives, if you collect 100% of inheritance and confiscate it as tax then there is little incentive for the rich to not just go on a spending spree or give their money away before they die. Also how do you handle inheritance of material assets, if I have a million pounds and spend it all on diamonds right before I die does my family inherit the diamonds? I'd suggest selling all assets on a public market and then using the money gained as tax but then what if its a sentimental item. In my diamonds example selling on a market would make sense but what happens when its someone's wedding ring or prized collection of biscuit tins they spent their life collecting.

TL;DR: I agree, but there are a lot more questions than answers.
(edited 8 years ago)
Reply 18
Original post by zippity.doodah
I'm not too sure there are ways other than consent which could really make for a fair society - if people make mistakes, and they lose property in their lives and become poor, or they do not work effectively enough to get property in the first place, I wouldn't say that their life was based on any kind of organised unfairness


But we are indoctrinated to interpret 'fair' here as meaning the aspiration of owning things. But when you die you can't take that with you. It'd be nice if we lived our lives in terms of legacy. What can be given, not what can be taken.

Original post by zippity.doodah
What are we really indoctrinated by


I think it would be easier to answer what we are not indoctrinated by. Do you really think that any thought you've ever had has not been formulated for you or thought many times before?
Reply 19
Original post by JamesFL
No government in the UK would ever back this idea (especially not a conservative one) but I certainly agree with it in an abstracted principle. If money exists as an abstract symbol of your personal capital it should not be passed between people without an equivalent exchange of capital in the from of goods or services. Problem is there are a lot of questions that rise in terms of alternatives, if you collect 100% of inheritance and confiscate it as tax then there is little incentive for the rich to not just go on a spending spree or give their money away before they die. Also how do you handle inheritance of material assets, if I have a million pounds and spend it all on diamonds right before I die does my family inherit the diamonds? I'd suggest selling all assets on a public market and then using the money gained as tax but then what if its a sentimental item. In my diamonds example selling on a market would make sense but what happens when its someone's wedding ring or prized collection of biscuit tins they spent their life collecting.

TL;DR: I agree, but there are a lot more questions than answers.


I love this post. You really got my cogs turning :smile:

Let me see - the incentive would be worked into the minds of our children at school. The definition of a good person would be a productive person for society as a whole. I hope I don't sound too communist lol

The state would have an absolute responsibility to the citizen and the citizen would have an absolute responsibility to the state. Physical assets would be stripped, divided and fed back into the society so that there was no wastage.

Sentimental items would not have any meaning, since the state/individual relationship would replace the sense of family. Family would then be seen as an eccentric emotional luxury, to be sympothised with maybe, but not encouraged. After all, the whole of society would be your family. Every man and woman would be your brother and sister.

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