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Reply 20
Your reason for it not being taught: no single person can do justice in conveying the absolute horror, or should it be taught as part of a lesson for humanity?(sic).

The same could reasonably be said for any event has ever occurred or that ever will occur that involves more than one person. If we accept this, we must abandon history altogether or live as hypocrites. Thus, I propose that we do not accept your reason for removing study of the Holocaust from the curriculum.
Original post by meems5
I personally think it's disrespectful NOT to teach it. One of the most horrific times in history should be made aware by everyone. Yes I agree that the extent of their suffering is extremely difficult to convey in a manner for us to understand but it should definitely be taught no questions asked.

I read a book called 'The Storyteller' by Jodi Picoult which is based on the holocaust and some chapters are written from the point of view of a refugee. I cried so many times in the duration of reading this book; I highly recommend it.


I agree. There's so much essential education about humanity, politics and culture in the history of the Holocaust. There's also great literature. Discussing the Holocaust is as important as discussing any other form of imperialism, fascism, totalitarianism, racism...
Original post by boods8897
Have you been watching The History Boys by any chance?

And yes I think it should be taught. The only 'benefit' that can come from such atrocities is that they enable us to learn from the past and ensure it never happens again. If it wasn't taught, and was never mentioned, it could end up being forgotten as the last Holocaust survivors die and their memories die with them - surely it would be more disrespectful to not teach it as that would be almost like pretending it never happened.

Posted from TSR Mobile


I have, and I thought it an interesting question to ask TSR, who were sadly less open in their views, and everyone has come back with the same response. Oh well.

This point is the essence of what everyone else has said, but from the experience of being taught it, and a member of the class openly exclaiming how boring it was to my teacher, I've always thought it a difficult thing to teach properly, and give a respectful account that conveys the extent of the horrors.
Reply 23
What is it exactly you would like to teach the Holocaust?
Original post by DK_Tipp
What is it exactly you would like to teach the Holocaust?


Very good...
Original post by thehistorybore
I have, and I thought it an interesting question to ask TSR, who were sadly less open in their views, and everyone has come back with the same response. Oh well.

This point is the essence of what everyone else has said, but from the experience of being taught it, and a member of the class openly exclaiming how boring it was to my teacher, I've always thought it a difficult thing to teach properly, and give a respectful account that conveys the extent of the horrors.


I get what you mean. Someone in my brother's class asked if there were any bloopers after watching Schindler's List. Maybe it shouldn't be compulsory; after all, there are other equally important periods. We did a huge thing on Vietnam which is probably more relevant to people now than the Holocaust. Do you think they could teach about terrorism? Maybe if more learnt about 9/11 or the IRA then less would be swayed by extremists and radicalists nowadays.

Posted from TSR Mobile
Original post by boods8897
I get what you mean. Someone in my brother's class asked if there were any bloopers after watching Schindler's List. Maybe it shouldn't be compulsory; after all, there are other equally important periods. We did a huge thing on Vietnam which is probably more relevant to people now than the Holocaust. Do you think they could teach about terrorism? Maybe if more learnt about 9/11 or the IRA then less would be swayed by extremists and radicalists nowadays.

Posted from TSR Mobile


I'm actually laughing at how horrific that question is. My God... I suppose it is, but most relevant to studying modern military history, as it was the first time the US had faced all out guerrilla warfare. Well this is the thing, would it be worth teaching about terrorism more than the holocaust? More people would be in a position to contribute to terrorist activities than administer mass genocide, so surely that is more relevant.
Original post by thehistorybore
Should it be taught or shouldn't it?

Whilst it is obviously a topic that can be studied historically (it has origin/effects etc), is it disrespectful to teach it, as no single person can do justice in conveying the absolute horror, or should it be taught as part of a lesson for humanity?

Interested to know what everyone thinks.


I kinda agree with you. I think the manner some history is taught perpetuates social division. It can create a kind of 'us' and 'them' mentality, particularly in terms of modern tragedies. I don't think it is intellectually sound to redact history, it's exactly what Winston Smith was doing at the Ministry of Truth, but perhaps it be taught in a more objective and detached way.
Original post by callum_law
I kinda agree with you. I think the manner some history is taught perpetuates social division. It can create a kind of 'us' and 'them' mentality, particularly in terms of modern tragedies. I don't think it is intellectually sound to redact history, it's exactly what Winston Smith was doing at the Ministry of Truth, but perhaps it be taught in a more objective and detached way.


Thank you! Finally someone who understands what I'm getting at, and props for the literary reference there.
Original post by thehistorybore
I'm actually laughing at how horrific that question is. My God... I suppose it is, but most relevant to studying modern military history, as it was the first time the US had faced all out guerrilla warfare. Well this is the thing, would it be worth teaching about terrorism more than the holocaust? More people would be in a position to contribute to terrorist activities than administer mass genocide, so surely that is more relevant.


For most people know the Holocaust is just something that happened in the past and is unlikely to happen again whereas terrorism is a very real problem that's only getting worse... I'm guessing most of the people that are travelling to Syria now don't really know what they're getting themselves into, so education around the effects of terrorism / extremist indoctrination could make more sense. Prevention is better than cure after all :/
Original post by thehistorybore
Should it be taught or shouldn't it?

Whilst it is obviously a topic that can be studied historically (it has origin/effects etc), is it disrespectful to teach it, as no single person can do justice in conveying the absolute horror, or should it be taught as part of a lesson for humanity?

Interested to know what everyone thinks.



In my own opinion we should not teach this topic as the government does not teach genocides like the Bosnian one or what the Israelis are doing to the Palestinians so unless they teach other groups problems but they only teach problems of groups which have helped the British conquer
Original post by boods8897
For most people know the Holocaust is just something that happened in the past and is unlikely to happen again whereas terrorism is a very real problem that's only getting worse... I'm guessing most of the people that are travelling to Syria now don't really know what they're getting themselves into, so education around the effects of terrorism / extremist indoctrination could make more sense. Prevention is better than cure after all :/


Certainly, teaching the current issues would cause people to become more interested, but the issue with teaching them from a historical perspective lies in the lack of historical maturity/sources.
No, keep teaching it. Things like that should never be forgotten. Nor should the people who went through it or the people who fought to liberate it.
Original post by AwareConscious
We should teach people to QUESTION the 6 million Holocaust.

How can you realyl be sure Jews were exterminated? Many people died, many were killed by Nazi's, Communists.. even Allied forces are guilty of enough crimes.

Why don't we learn about Holodomor? because the victims were not Jews and Bolshevik Jews were involved in this crime.

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The Armenian genocide? It is no coincidence that during the early 1900's many Jews emigrated to Turkey. Many in the Young Turks have been suspected of being Jewish descent, but we know for a fact the finance minister Mehmet Cavit Bay was Jewish.

You don't know this because the Jews hide being political correctness and use the anti-Semite make themselves out to be victims when we expose crimes they were involved in.



What proof really is there that millions of Jews were exterminated? Where are these photos of all the gassed Jews?


So many died in this war, you could post just as many photographs of dead Germans as you could dead Jews.


Watch David Cole's Auschwitz documentary if you believe in the 6 million Holocaust. He is Jewish, so you can't go crying anti-Semitism against someone is a Semite.

After helping debunk the Holocaust he was branded a traitor, attacked and threatened with his life many times by fellow Jews.. he's back now and awhile back wrote a book called Republican party animal.


Oh for God's sake who let the holocaust deniers in?
Original post by AwareConscious

What proof really is there that millions of Jews were exterminated? Where are these photos of all the gassed Jews?



Gas chambers, hundreds of bodies which under post mortem were revealed to have been gassed, witness accounts from both German soldiers and camp survivors. The evidence is literally endless. The holocaust revisionist perspective is as outrageous as it is unfounded. There is zero evidence that the holocaust was a fabrication, and holocaust deniers are almost always just using it as a means to vent their anti semitism.
It should definitely be taught, lets not shelter younger people and let them believe the world is wonderful, but rather show them how evil the world and humans can be, and let them know why it is horrible.

But also according to that, many genocides and horrific acts of the past (and even the present) should be taught.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by thehistorybore
Certainly, teaching the current issues would cause people to become more interested, but the issue with teaching them from a historical perspective lies in the lack of historical maturity/sources.


Yeah I suppose. The most recent event that gets taught in schools is Vietnam, or maybe even as recent as the fall of the Berlin Wall, so any events around that timeframe could theoretically be studied. I've never really thought too much about the teaching of the Holocaust, but you've made me think maybe it's not always appropriate to teach it. If it was only taught to older, maturer students, say college or university level who would study it because they had a genuine interest, rather than introducing it in High School where the students may uninterested or as though it's nothing to do with them would be more respectful. What about books written on the Holocaust? Fiction ones I mean. Could they also be seen as disrespectful or romantisising it?
Original post by boods8897
Yeah I suppose. The most recent event that gets taught in schools is Vietnam, or maybe even as recent as the fall of the Berlin Wall, so any events around that timeframe could theoretically be studied. I've never really thought too much about the teaching of the Holocaust, but you've made me think maybe it's not always appropriate to teach it. If it was only taught to older, maturer students, say college or university level who would study it because they had a genuine interest, rather than introducing it in High School where the students may uninterested or as though it's nothing to do with them would be more respectful. What about books written on the Holocaust? Fiction ones I mean. Could they also be seen as disrespectful or romantisising it?


I believe there is a GCSE unit that is based around the war on terror, and goes up to 2007. As a historian, the prospect of such a course being taught as History terrifies me. How can you ever be accurate/distanced when the issues are so recent?

Indeed, that is what I'm getting at. Younger students often lack the maturity to treat the subject with respect.

I haven't read any fiction books on the holocaust, but I can't imagine that they would romanticise it? Surely they would only serve to present the horror?
Reply 38
There is an interesting question in here as to how proximate an event can be taught as history. When I was at school (a long time ago) a fair number of my teachers had served during WWII, it was a near event, something my parents lived through.

So, maybe slightly tangential, how recent an event can be seen as history? I was at university during the Falklands conflict, now over thirty years ago, is that now history?

The history I was taught at school in the the 1970s covered up to the General Strike into the mid 1930,s, thirty five to forty years earlier, is this the required gap?

I think sensitivities is not the main constraint, it it objectivity that needs to be considered. Is the Khymer Rouge, as portrayed in the film The Killing Fields a legitimate topic? It is more proximate and the death toll could be anything up to 3 million (possibly less, but likely over a million)
(edited 8 years ago)
We should teach EVERYTHING, but every country has it's own agenda. So this will never happen.

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