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Original post by senz72
Ah right, I'll probably abstain then. For me, 2 kids supported by the state seems reasonable. If he wants to increase the cap at 3, that would be fine. But anymore, I probably won't vote.


So should we stop offering free schooling/NHS funding for the fourth child too?
Wow thats an intelligent reply. The reason people could now elect a left wing government is because we are all living with the effects of an experiment in neo liberal economics that began under thatcher. This has resulted in millions relying on foodbanks, a privatised rail system where tax payers directly line shareholders pockets, a nation of renters who pay a higher proportion of wages on rent than virtually anywhere else in Europe, and an NHS in jeopardy. Its not 1974 anymore, and even if Corbyn doesn't win he will provide a voice of genuine opposition and help shift the debate, and bring back ideas that have been burried by the corrupt relationship between media state and big business.
Original post by MagicNMedicine
It's difficult to assess how effective Jeremy Corbyn would be as leader in terms of attracting votes to Labour, because we aren't really hearing from the people he needs to be winning back.

All the people passing comment on the Corbyn debate seem to be in two camps:

1. Tories, the right-wing media and right-wing groups, who are going on about Corbyn being the loony left, proof Labour haven't moved on etc. Lets be honest none of these are going to vote Labour, whether it's Corbyn, Burnham or Tony Blair as leader.

2. Labour activists who actively support one of the other leadership contenders. They are posturing against Corbyn now but would probably vote Labour whoever was leader, even if its more reluctantly in some cases than others.

The issue is it's difficult to know what the public generally thinks about him, rather than what press commentators say the public should think about him!

My guess (and this is just a rough guess) would be that Corbyn will attract these types of voters:

- The Labour diehards, who will vote Labour whoever is leader
- A large chunk of Scottish voters that voted SNP last time because of their left-wing platform but are not that bothered about independence
- The youth vote that the Lib Dems picked up in 2005 and 2010
- A large chunk of Green vote (Greens might have to do some tactical alliances with Labour and not field candidates against them in some cases)

Will that be enough to win the next election...unclear, but it's not as outrageous as people think. They would win back a lot of Scotland and so the Conservatives would have to actively make headway in to existing Labour seats: which is not an easy thing especially as after 10 years the country might be starting to get tired of them and the full impact of cuts and austerity will be biting in those areas.


It's nowhere near enough to win the next election - even his own team admit it and are pedaling him as an 'opposition candidate' in phone interviews.

Most of the SNP vote is based on nationalism rather than being 'left wing' - hence why the vote they got was similar to the people voting yes to independence. Regardless of who is leading the Labour party they will be relying on the SNP to **** up to get votes in Scotland.

As for winning over greens - yay half a million votes...it is nothing in the grand scheme of things.

Young people don't vote, Jeremy Corbyn isn't going to change that (my prediction is he won't do as well in the leadership election as in the polls precisely because of this but we will see).
Society is screwed because of the viscous cycle. Nobody has money for taxes, so taxes are kept low. Low taxes results in no houses being built and therefore high house prices, high house prices means people have no money so can't pay taxes etc etc. Only a real Labour party committed obliterating our rent bills can save the state.
Original post by jacktrex
Society is screwed because of the viscous cycle. Nobody has money for taxes, so taxes are kept low. Low taxes results in no houses being built and therefore high house prices, high house prices means people have no money so can't pay taxes etc etc. Only a real Labour party committed obliterating our rent bills can save the state.


Jesus Christ that's not why taxes are lowered. Learn some political theory, please. Also, you've gone quite on the 'Corbyn-mania is a joke' thread - do I take it you know you've lost the argument?
His opinion about Kosovo is completely correct. I really do not see anything wrong with it.
Original post by Graham 14
There's a real labour fixation with being in the centre ground, I don't think it'll make them relevant anymore, if jeremy corbyn's supportters are to go by, people don't want austerity anymore.


Yeah but Jeremy Corby's supporters number about 2-300000 at most so that's not really going to help win any elections.
Hi Graham have a read of this its what I have thought for a long time the elite don't want him so are orchestrating a plan to discredit him.

PM me for the link
(edited 6 years ago)
Original post by Graham 14
Jeremy Corbyn as you know is gaining a lot of traction for his talk about renationalisation, scrapping tution fees etc. For once, I've actually been enthused by a politician that speaks about the things I care about, who speaks his mind and doesn't dodge questions with scripted answers. However, within Labour it seems jeremy corbyn, would be a disaster, I can't understand why, the rest of the candidates are all tory lite and complete sell outs, it's like labour has completely forgotten who it represents, why is it so wrong for a politician to talk about the austerity myth, the growing gap between rich and poor, ever rising rents, young people ever owning their own home, the increase in child poverty, and providing welfare for the most vulnerable, can someone explain what is so wrong about his politics?


1.) He is a loud mouthed idiot. Yes he will have his supporters by offering the whole world for free but it never works out like that. The rich would end up paying 45% straight line tax with no threshold to fund his fantasies while him and McDonnell invest in a tax avoidance fund.

2.) Jeremy Corbyn has dodged questions and calls for An enquiry to anti semitism within the PLP

3. He describes our enemies such as Hamas and the IRA as friends while the majority of the British public despise the IRA he was meeting with them in Parliament (Gerry Adams) so we know under prime minister Corbyn we would be at grater terror threat.

4. He wanted to bring Calais jungle to Britain increasing our terror threat when ISIS stated they was going to exploit the migrant crisis to move terrorists around the continent as soon as civilians vacated some ISIS members would of followed them in to Europe. We have zero legal obligation to have them as per 1951 Geneva convention they must settle in the nearest safe country
Original post by Stewpid
1.) He is a loud mouthed idiot. Yes he will have his supporters by offering the whole world for free but it never works out like that. The rich would end up paying 45% straight line tax with no threshold to fund his fantasies while him and McDonnell invest in a tax avoidance fund.

2.) Jeremy Corbyn has dodged questions and calls for An enquiry to anti semitism within the PLP

3. He describes our enemies such as Hamas and the IRA as friends while the majority of the British public despise the IRA he was meeting with them in Parliament (Gerry Adams) so we know under prime minister Corbyn we would be at grater terror threat.

4. He wanted to bring Calais jungle to Britain increasing our terror threat when ISIS stated they was going to exploit the migrant crisis to move terrorists around the continent as soon as civilians vacated some ISIS members would of followed them in to Europe. We have zero legal obligation to have them as per 1951 Geneva convention they must settle in the nearest safe country


Idiot.
Original post by Graham 14
Jeremy Corbyn as you know is gaining a lot of traction for his talk about renationalisation, scrapping tution fees etc. For once, I've actually been enthused by a politician that speaks about the things I care about, who speaks his mind and doesn't dodge questions with scripted answers. However, within Labour it seems jeremy corbyn, would be a disaster, I can't understand why, the rest of the candidates are all tory lite and complete sell outs, it's like labour has completely forgotten who it represents, why is it so wrong for a politician to talk about the austerity myth, the growing gap between rich and poor, ever rising rents, young people ever owning their own home, the increase in child poverty, and providing welfare for the most vulnerable, can someone explain what is so wrong about his politics?


That's a good question. Who does labor represent? I've moved around a good deal in the UK... and have generally observed wealthier neighborhoods voting more often for Labor than the other way round.

That's just my experience. I am sure there are statistics on this. They may even prove me wrong.

London to start with, has been historically biased in favor of Labor. I'm sure the large immigrant population also has something to do with it, which arguably is not particularly wealthy necessarily.
(edited 6 years ago)
Original post by DeBruyne18
Idiot.


Yes we know Jeremy Corbyn is a idiot you don't have to tell us.
Original post by Graham 14
Jeremy Corbyn as you know is gaining a lot of traction for his talk about renationalisation, scrapping tution fees etc. For once, I've actually been enthused by a politician that speaks about the things I care about, who speaks his mind and doesn't dodge questions with scripted answers. However, within Labour it seems jeremy corbyn, would be a disaster, I can't understand why, the rest of the candidates are all tory lite and complete sell outs, it's like labour has completely forgotten who it represents, why is it so wrong for a politician to talk about the austerity myth, the growing gap between rich and poor, ever rising rents, young people ever owning their own home, the increase in child poverty, and providing welfare for the most vulnerable, can someone explain what is so wrong about his politics?


NOTHING IS WRONG WITH HIM. NOTHING. People are terrified of the idea of having a genuine, fair and smart yet non-traditional man in charge of Britain. He is exactly what we need, and the retaliation he receives from the media is so telling of the dire state of post-brexit England. If you care about equality and justice for everyone, not just those with tons of money, then you should care about Corbyn.
Original post by Stewpid
Yes we know Jeremy Corbyn is a idiot you don't have to tell us.


No, I know you spew out a load of bs. Your username suits you.
Original post by DeBruyne18
No, I know you spew out a load of bs. Your username suits you.


Please tell me what part of my post isn't factually correct?
Original post by Stewpid
Please tell me what part of my post isn't factually correct?


LOL. Corbyn and McDonnel investing in tax avoidance schemes....

You failed to mention that the Tories were also meeting with the IRA at the time.
Original post by englitgal123
NOTHING IS WRONG WITH HIM. NOTHING. People are terrified of the idea of having a genuine, fair and smart yet non-traditional man in charge of Britain. He is exactly what we need, and the retaliation he receives from the media is so telling of the dire state of post-brexit England. If you care about equality and justice for everyone, not just those with tons of money, then you should care about Corbyn.


We need a pacifist who himself would like to leave NATO? We need a republican with questionable views on at least one part of the union?

Even putting aside your bias i am incredibly curious as to why we need the aforementioned. Putting the extreme left economically in power is one thing, putting somebody who wants to rip up historical institutions is another.
Jeremy Corbyn left school with only 2 A-Levels in which he scored 2 E's. I don't know which idiot would legitimately listen to what he has to say..

EDIT: Not to mention the fact he came from a relatively comfortable background of prep school, then grammar school. After grammar school he dropped out of polytech with nothing to show for it after 12 months.
(edited 6 years ago)
A. The values he 'stands for' are flawed - free uni fees and handouts etc and plans on funding this with loans and taxes from people who actually work and keep the country going. If he cared about young people he wouldnt discourage them from working and supporting themselves by offering handouts. Also note in most of the recent important govt. decisions involving students, a shameful amount of labour mps including him fail to turn up when theres no votes to win.

B. He is dishonest and cunning. He says hes a working man, for the many blah blah blah yet owns two houses with 6+ bedrooms with another semidetached house to look urban, sends his kids to private school and went there himself.
He exploites the youths developing minds for votes.

C. In todays international climate, he wants to scrap trident etc. If ww3 goes down, i wanna be on the side with weapons and a stable economy

Basically, every labour prime minister in the last 30 years has plunged us into deficit and credit crunch.
Original post by Graham 14
Jeremy Corbyn as you know is gaining a lot of traction for his talk about renationalisation, scrapping tution fees etc. For once, I've actually been enthused by a politician that speaks about the things I care about, who speaks his mind and doesn't dodge questions with scripted answers. However, within Labour it seems jeremy corbyn, would be a disaster, I can't understand why, the rest of the candidates are all tory lite and complete sell outs, it's like labour has completely forgotten who it represents, why is it so wrong for a politician to talk about the austerity myth, the growing gap between rich and poor, ever rising rents, young people ever owning their own home, the increase in child poverty, and providing welfare for the most vulnerable, can someone explain what is so wrong about his politics?


Corbyn seems like a nice man but he will never be able to make britain a fair place to live, as the rich white 1% have the best legal teams to reduce their taxes.

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