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Feminism and Meninism

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Reply 40
Original post by Birkenhead
Give me three specific examples of inequalities you want to confront in our society.


LBGT rights, inequalities men face when applying for custody, and people of colours rights? Does that help?
Original post by flamboy
because "feminists" today are total hypocrites so the meaning of feminism has accordingly adjusted in light of this. they don't campaign for equality. they don't campaign for both men's issues and women's issues. they want positive discrimination. therefore, they don't want strict equality, they want shameless gynocentricism and women's rights at the expense of men's


Where are your sources from? I'm pretty sure that's 'matriarchy' you're taking about there, that's very different to feminism. Also for someone who thinks feminism is a joke these days, you sure have done plenty of research into it.
Reply 42
Original post by flamboy
if you had said that "feminism" benefits everybody because everybody is a man or woman, and it (claimed) fights for gender equality for both genders, then that would make made sense. but "feminism" doesn't advance anybody else other than women in and of itself in an objective sense. you can be a feminist and many other kinds of egalitarian, but feminist is a specific one based on gender by definition. that's probably why you are trying to make "intersectional feminism" a thing - how does adding "intersectional" change the meaning of the word "feminism" on the end?


You're so determined to try and prove me wrong like I'm just trying to help here haha.

Some feminists admittedly don't want to advance equality in areas that don't affect themselves, such as they don't want to fight inequalities that men face, as you said. But some do. Unfortunately because of this, within feminism there are subcategories because some people understand the true meaning of the movement (intersectional) and some don't.

Okay. So. Sections. The main factor is gender. But within gender there are sections:
- Religion
- Sexuality
- Race
- Class
etc.

Intersectional means that they cover all these sections! Regardless! If you're not an intersectional feminist then you only care about one of these sections, or even only a tiny part of that section. So if you're not intersectional, you might care about gender, but only women. Or you care about sexuality, but only gay, not transgenders or bisexuals or asexuals.

I'm honestly not trying to argue with you I'm just trying to explain.
Original post by kate37
LBGT rights, inequalities men face when applying for custody, and people of colours rights? Does that help?


No, it doesn't. You haven't explained what exactly you think warrants change in the status quo.

What more 'rights' do LGBT need?
What more 'rights' do ethnic minorities need?

I find the phrasing of your second example interesting, in that you choose not to use the word you used for the examples on either side ('Male custody rights'), despite the fact that this example is the only one to identify a specific problem.
Meninism is actually a thing? 😂
Reply 45
Original post by flamboy
racist ˈ
reɪsɪst/Submit noun
1. a person who believes that a particular race is superior to another. "I had a fear of being called a racist"

yes you can
you are talking pure bull****.
it's like saying that atheists can't be religiously-discriminatory
it's like saying that short people can't be heightist
it's like saying that poor people can't be anti-rich/classist
clearly you aren't thinking whatsoever and you are also making feminism look ****ing ridiculous by saying that you can't be racist towards a certain race. does that mean that white people aren't deserving of racial protection laws at all if they are discriminated against in society? that's literally racism.


No. Sorry.

Okay so in today's society, white people do not face oppression because of their skin colour.
Black people do. They face oppression because of their skin colour.
If a white person slanders a black person because of their skin colour they're being racist.
BUT because white people do not face oppression because of their skin colour they can not be subject to racism.

I'm not giving feminism a bad name? All of your examples are completely irrelevant. Please tell me how white people face oppression because of their skin colour?
Original post by kate37
No. Sorry.

Okay so in today's society, white people do not face oppression because of their skin colour.
Black people do. They face oppression because of their skin colour.
If a white person slanders a black person because of their skin colour they're being racist.
BUT because white people do not face oppression because of their skin colour they can not be subject to racism.

What 'oppression' do black people suffer in our society today?

Whether someone can be subject to racism or not is completely independent to whatever advantage or disadvantage their skin colour brings them in society.
Reply 47
Original post by kate37
No. Sorry.

Okay so in today's society, white people do not face oppression because of their skin colour.
Black people do. They face oppression because of their skin colour.
If a white person slanders a black person because of their skin colour they're being racist.
BUT because white people do not face oppression because of their skin colour they can not be subject to racism.

I'm not giving feminism a bad name? All of your examples are completely irrelevant. Please tell me how white people face oppression because of their skin colour?


so if a black person discriminates against a white person because of the colour of their skin (let's say the black person is an employer), you'd say that's *not* "racism"?!
Reply 48
Original post by Birkenhead
No, it doesn't. You haven't explained what exactly you think warrants change in the status quo.

What more 'rights' do LGBT need?
What more 'rights' do ethnic minorities need?

I find the phrasing of your second example interesting, in that you choose not to use the word you used for the examples on either side ('Male custody rights':wink:, despite the fact that this example is the only one to identify a specific problem.


Okay :smile:

1. Violence against Trans and Queer people. Trans and Queer people face violence and abuse for being themselves... In 2013 238 Transgender people were murdered in Europe for being Trans. How many cisgender people were killed for being cis? 0!

2. Have you been looking at the news? In America, African Americans are facing constant police brutality, and have even been murdered by the police, when they haven't even done anything. A black man was shot for walking away from a police man because he couldn't hear him as he had headphones in.
Dylan Roof, the white man who murdered black people in the church was given a bulletproof vest to wear by the police to protect him, and was taken to Burger King. Do you honestly see nothing wrong with this?
Reply 49
Original post by punkroses
Where are your sources from? I'm pretty sure that's 'matriarchy' you're taking about there, that's very different to feminism. Also for someone who thinks feminism is a joke these days, you sure have done plenty of research into it.


literally - any modern feminist "campaign" today - these are demonstrations of the lack of credibility of feminism
"rape culture", "ban page 3/women are objectified", "the everyday sexism project", "him for her", "like a girl", "never okay", "ban bossy" etc - they are all modern feminist campaigns, are they not?
Original post by flamboy
literally - any modern feminist "campaign" today - these are demonstrations of the lack of credibility of feminism
"rape culture", "ban page 3/women are objectified", "the everyday sexism project", "him for her", "like a girl", "never okay", "ban bossy" etc - they are all modern feminist campaigns, are they not?


Doesn't mean that's what all feminists think. It depends on the person. They're all radical feminists you're talking about there, I personally just think the pay gap is ridiculous and so is the disrespect women get when getting a job...Don't just concentrate on radical feminists, most feminists believe in equality for all. :smile:
Reply 51
Original post by punkroses
Doesn't mean that's what all feminists think. It depends on the person. They're all radical feminists you're talking about there, I personally just think the pay gap is ridiculous and so is the disrespect women get when getting a job...Don't just concentrate on radical feminists, most feminists believe in equality for all. :smile:


are you trying to imply that most "feminists" today oppose these campaigns?
Reply 52
Original post by Birkenhead
What 'oppression' do black people suffer in our society today?

Whether someone can be subject to racism or not is completely independent to whatever advantage or disadvantage their skin colour brings them in society.


Did... Did you honestly just ask that??

I almost don't know how to respond to that, so I'll just leave this here:

Original post by flamboy
are you trying to imply that most "feminists" today oppose these campaigns?


No, I'm implying that most feminists today are not extremist like the ones you're suggesting. The ones that get the attention from the media are always extremist, it's like with any religion or belief.
Reply 54
Original post by flamboy
so if a black person discriminates against a white person because of the colour of their skin (let's say the black person is an employer), you'd say that's *not* "racism"?!


What is the likelihood of that happening?
How many cases of white people being discriminated against in the work place are there? Probably extremely little, if not 0 at all.
How many cases of black people being discriminated against in the work place has their been? Oh yeah. Loads.

Honestly I don't even understand what you're trying to fight for anymore? Because your points aren't even relevant.
Original post by kate37
What is the likelihood of that happening?
How many cases of white people being discriminated against in the work place are there? Probably extremely little, if not 0 at all.
How many cases of black people being discriminated against in the work place has their been? Oh yeah. Loads.


You have failed to present any valid evidence of this being the case.
OK I planned on just lurking but this..

Original post by flamboy
are you trying to imply that most "feminists" today oppose these campaigns?


Original post by punkroses
No, I'm implying that most feminists today are not extremist like the ones you're suggesting. The ones that get the attention from the media are always extremist, it's like with any religion or belief.


How is the 'no' not contradictory to the rest of that sentence?
Reply 57
Original post by Birkenhead
You have failed to present any valid evidence of this being the case.


Sorry, where's your evidence of all these white people facing racism? I assume you're white, how many times have you faced racism?
Original post by kate37
Sorry, where's your evidence of all these white people facing racism? I assume you're white, how many times have you faced racism?


This isn't what I've been saying. What I've been saying is that you've not provided any valid evidence that any ethnicity faces 'loads' of racism in the workplace or anywhere else.
Original post by kate37
Did... Did you honestly just ask that??

I almost don't know how to respond to that, so I'll just leave this here:



What reason do you have to believe that this is because of their skin colour? It's more likely because whites have higher educational levels, or some other such innocuous factor.

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