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Why are some left wingers so classist?

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Reply 20
Original post by driftawaay
I really don't understand how some people on TSR can actually believe this when it is the complete opposite. It is always the far right parties who believe there is a Jewish conspiracy, anti-semitism is fuelled by the far right wing parties in Europe to this day. The Illuminati isn't a left wing belief either and lots of what they believe (homosexuality was invented by jews to destroy the world etc) is definitely not something left wingers would entertain.


Difficult to understand why right wingers would be concerned about the conspiratorial activities of Jews who are universally considered to be pretty right-wing according to the prevailing narrative. You don't think the Illuminati would be considered a right-wing elitist group?

I think we're on much safer ground discussing toys.
Reply 21
Original post by MatureStudent36
Tony Benn avoided inheritance tax.

Dianne abbott sent her kid to private school.

Emily Thornberry mocked 'white van man'

Ed Milliband felt a referendum on Europe was too complicated for the British electorate to handle.

Arthur scargill , well the way he shafted over the miners is well documented.

I do find it amazing that labour supporters generally buy into the 'labour looks after people' the conservatives don't.

Both political parties have a vested interest in keeping the majority of the electorate happy as otherwise they won't get voted in. That's why new labour shifted to the right into the centre ground. That's where the majority of people are. That's why after much huff and puff about the conservators trying to have shut down the bugs over the last 30 odd years, the nhs is still here with greater investment in it than the ever so socialist SNP have managed in NUS Scotland.


^This.

Also, while Russell Brand wasn't born into a well-off family he certainly rakes in millions now and hangs around the upper middle class BBC set.

Could you expand on your last point about the NHS? :smile:
Original post by T.L
Difficult to understand why right wingers would be concerned about the conspiratorial activities of Jews who are universally considered to be pretty right-wing according to the prevailing narrative. You don't think the Illuminati would be considered a right-wing elitist group?

I think we're on much safer ground discussing toys.


I am not saying *right wingers* are anti semitic, I am not talking about the tories. I specifically said far right wingers, who are the ones still perpetuating anti semitism across Europe to this day. You are saying that the left wing is anti semitic, which is not true. I am sure the far left wing is anti semitic, but there is a far smaller presence of a far left in this country and the entire continent, the are irrelevant and obscure, they are certainly not the poster children for Nazism. Your assertion that 'left wingers hate the Jews' is hilarious and is simply not true.

Yes, the Illuminati would be considered a right wing elitist group ruling the world, and that's an idea kept alive by uneducated far right wingers who think everyone is taking over and stealing their country, their culture, their ethnic profile their traditions, their wallets and their entire lives - Jews, Muslims, blacks, immigrants, homosexuals, communists/liberals etc. Thats what the Illuminati is all about. Its always the hysterical far right and the religious right that are the conspiracy theorists, look at those loonies from America who think tsunamis etc happen because God is punishing the country for abortion/gay marriage etc. Irrational hysteria/conspiracy theories are far right ideologies.
(edited 8 years ago)
Reply 23
Plagioclass
I genuinely don't understand what you're talking about - could you please explain, for instance, how Russell Brand looks down on the working-class? You are describing the opposite of my experience, I can't think of any classism in the mainstream left wing since that's literally the opposite of what it's trying to achieve. If someone's trying to maintain class structure then they're probably not particularly left-wing...


See my reply to Mature Student above (as well as his post for an example of classism) - I wasn't saying that Russell Brand looked down on the working class, hence why I said in the OP that I wasn't talking about champagne socialist types. He earns millions, but that's besides the point.

This is partly a middle class thing as well, but, if self-identifying left wingers claim to be the champions of the poor and whatnot, they should cut out the snobbery as well (I'm not necessarily talking about politicians here, but your average middle class Labour diehard Joe). As someone brought up working class it's one of the reasons I take such claims with a pinch of salt.

Look at some of the comments on this article:

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2012/jun/05/why-working-class-people-vote-conservative
Reply 24
Original post by driftawaay
I am not saying *right wingers* are anti semitic, I am not talking about the tories. I specifically said far right wingers, who are the ones still perpetuating anti semitism across Europe to this day. You are saying that the left wing is anti semitic, which is not true. I am sure the far left wing is anti semitic, but there is a far smaller presence of a far left in this country and the entire continent, the are irrelevant and obscure, they are certainly not the poster children for Nazism. Your assertion that 'left wingers hate the Jews' is hilarious and is simply not true.

Yes, the Illuminati would be considered a right wing elitist group ruling the world, and that's an idea kept alive by uneducated far right wingers who think everyone is taking over and stealing their country, their culture, their ethnic profile their traditions, their wallets and their entire lives - Jews, Muslims, blacks, immigrants, homosexuals, communists/liberals etc. Thats what the Illuminati is all about. Its always the hysterical far right and the religious right that are the conspiracy theorists, look at those loonies from America who think tsunamis etc happen because God is punishing the country for abortion/gay marriage etc. Irrational hysteria/conspiracy theories are far right ideologies.


Stay on topic.
Original post by Popsy1234
Stay on topic.


I am sorry, are you a mod? No. bye.
Reply 26
Original post by driftawaay
I am sorry, are you a mod? No. bye.


I knew I'd get an immature response based on your other posts on this forum, well done for proving me right. :lol:

*reports* :h:
Original post by Popsy1234
I knew I'd get an immature response based on your other posts on this forum, well done for proving me right :clapping:

*reports* :h:


PMS spotted.
Reply 28
^didn't read lol
Original post by Popsy1234
^didn't read lol


Lol yes you did. :frown:
WHAT?

left wing is all about as having a level field as possible

its the right wing that thinks all people on benefits are lazy drug addicts and that the working class should just try harder
Original post by driftawaay
There is no such thing as a 'champagne socialist', it's a term made up by loony right wingers who cannot come to terms with the fact that just because someone has money doesn't mean they are a selfish money obsessed prick who doesn't give a **** about anyone else.


There are champagne socialists. People who espouse socialist values whilst showing none of them themselves. Too many left wing politicans speak about values which they don't show. For example;

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/labour/11510523/Labour-MPs-accused-of-hypocrisy-over-use-of-zero-hours-contracts.html

Labour MP's themselves use a lot of zero hour contracts.

However, I do think the term is over used to the point of where any successful person is automatically a champagne socialist. This is where it gets stupid;
Poor and left=jealous.
Rich and left=hypocrite.

So for me, champagne socialists do exist-they are the ones who expect others to have values they themselves do not.
People like Russel Brand on the other hand are not; they are just successful left wing people. He holds the values he speaks of. The right in his case can't take the fact that someone is rich but still cares about others so resort to cliche insults.
The left thinks it is morally wrong to disagree with its beliefs. This is especially true in University life.

Rebecca Roache a Philosophy Lecturer at Royal Holloway wrote a blog about this on an Oxford University website after a Government was elected she didn't approve of.

It is both chilling and revealing.

Think of her pupils with differing political views. How fair will her assessment be of a UKIP supporting student of hers, who holds "objectionable" opinions?

"One of the first things I did after seeing the depressing election news this morning was check to see which of my Facebook friends ‘like’ the pages of the Conservatives or David Cameron, and unfriend them. (Thankfully, none of my friends ‘like’ the UKIP page.) Life is too short, I thought, to hang out with people who hold abhorrent political views, even if it’s just online.

Well, the view that I have arrived at today is that openly supporting a political party that—in the name of austerity—withdraws support from the poor, the sick, the foreign, and the unemployed while rewarding those in society who are least in need of reward, that sells off our profitable public goods to private companies while keeping the loss-making ones in the public domain, that boasts about cleaning up the economy while creating more new debt than every Labour government combined, that wants to scrap the Human Rights Act and (via the TTIP) hand sovereignty over some of our most important public institutions to big business—to express one’s support for a political party that does these things is as objectionable as expressing racist, sexist, or homophobic views. Racism, sexism, and homophobia are not simply misguided views like any other; views that we can hope to change through reasoned debate (although we can try to do that). They are offensive views. They are views that lose you friends and respect—and the fact that they are socially unacceptable views helps discourage people from holding (or at least expressing) them, even where reasoned debate fails."

http://blog.practicalethics.ox.ac.uk/2015/05/if-youre-a-conservative-im-not-your-friend/
Original post by MatureStudent36
Tony Benn avoided inheritance tax.

Dianne abbott sent her kid to private school.

Emily Thornberry mocked 'white van man'

Ed Milliband felt a referendum on Europe was too complicated for the British electorate to handle.

Arthur scargill , well the way he shafted over the miners is well documented.

I do find it amazing that labour supporters generally buy into the 'labour looks after people' the conservatives don't.

Both political parties have a vested interest in keeping the majority of the electorate happy as otherwise they won't get voted in. That's why new labour shifted to the right into the centre ground. That's where the majority of people are. That's why after much huff and puff about the conservators trying to have shut down the bugs over the last 30 odd years, the nhs is still here with greater investment in it than the ever so socialist SNP have managed in NUS Scotland.


Add to that the number of Labour MP's fiddling their expenses and employing people on zero hour contracts
The number sitting in the House of Lords doing nothing
Doing nothing to stop tax evasion by large companies over my lifetime; Osbourne had to introduce the diverted profits tax.
Being in favour of the mass immigration which hurts the very people Labour are supposed to represent.

Too many on the left are just ridiculous.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdR7WW3XR9c

A great video. Some on the left would rather the poor were poorer as long as the rich were less rich.

Labour claim to look after the left; well the SNP and UKIP took a lot of votes from them-hopefully for their sake they reailse that they actually don't. I mean it is the Tories who will be increasing the minimum wage to £9 by 2020 as well.
(edited 8 years ago)
This has been the case for centuries.. The liberal intelligencia.

Most of these types just like protesting and ramming their views down the throats of the less educated.
It seems the right wingers will do all they can to change the goalposts.
If you're poor and you complain about inequality then you're jealous.
If you're rich and you complain about inequality then you're a champagne socialist or hypocrite.
If you're average income - well you're classist.

Apparently.
Original post by Bornblue
It seems the right wingers will do all they can to change the goalposts.
If you're poor and you complain about inequality then you're jealous.
If you're rich and you complain about inequality then you're a champagne socialist or hypocrite.
If you're average income - well you're classist.

Apparently.

But that isn't what we are talking about. We are referring to how leftists react to rightist or non leftist working class/poor/non-white people. A right wing non-white or immigrant in the extreme leftist country of Sweden can expect to be called a uncle tom or a house n*gger etc.
Original post by The_Mighty_Bush
But that isn't what we are talking about. We are referring to how leftists react to rightist or non leftist working class/poor/non-white people. A right wing non-white or immigrant in the extreme leftist country of Sweden can expect to be called a uncle tom or a house n*gger etc.


lmao /fail
Original post by driftawaay
lmao /fail

What I said is undoubtedly true. They are by some distance the most PC country in the world with significantly socialistic economic policy. In no other European country would you get politicians of the ruling party referring to ISIS as freedom fighters or wanting returning ISIS militants to be given all kinds of benefits and "rehabilitated" because they are supposedly victims of violence rather than savages.
Reply 39
Original post by Bornblue
It seems the right wingers will do all they can to change the goalposts.
If you're poor and you complain about inequality then you're jealous.
If you're rich and you complain about inequality then you're a champagne socialist or hypocrite.
If you're average income - well you're classist.

Apparently.


Someone did not read the OP. :rolleyes:

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