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If you thought the Sun couldn't get any worse...

I'm sure you're all aware of this front page from, the bigoted piece of claptrap, The Sun.



But, if you actually see where they got their research from, it paints an entirely different picture. http://survation.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/Islamic-Identity-Community-Relations-Survey.pdf

The Sun, that implies muslims are a threat to Britain, knowing that it will cause tensions and could provoke a terror attack. When we need british muslims to know that there is no divide between 'us' and 'them', when we should embrace that most muslims living here indeed consider themselves British.

I will also say, that when you remember Khadiza Sultana, Amira Abase and Shamima Begum, the young girls that travelled to Syria, and also consider how much grooming and indoctrination probably had to play in that, it's quite clear how there are those who harbour sympathies for people like those 3 young girls, who've effectively renounced themselves of Islam and have ruined their lives.

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Reply 1
I just want to print my own newspaper at this point. Not bias and false accusations fueled by rumors when there is clear evidence that suggest otherwise.

Though I do feel a little sympathy for the girls as they felt like they had to go there to feel part of something? Why could they not feel that way here? They are much safer here than there.
Sad part is I know people who trust this sh**
http://www.comres.co.uk/polls/bbc-radio-4-today-muslim-poll/



One in four (27%) British Muslims say they have some sympathy for the motives behind the attacks on Charlie Hebdo in Paris.

However, two thirds (68%) say acts of violence against those who publish images of the Prophet can never be justified while a quarter (24%) disagree

One in nine (11%) British Muslims feel sympathetic towards people who want to fight against western interests while 85% do not.

Half (49%) believe Muslim clerics preaching that violence against the west can be justified are out of touch with mainstream Muslim opinion, while 45% disagree.

Not all of course. But to deny that there is a significant minority that are a genuine threat is to deliberately lie. Rags like the Sun do not help things. But it is true. There is a minority, a significant minority, that do agree with things like Sharia law, dislike the west and support violence against it.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/one-in-four-british-muslims-have-some-sympathy-for-motives-behind-charlie-hebdo-attacks-10068440.html
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by aamirac
I just want to print my own newspaper at this point. Not bias and false accusations fueled by rumors when there is clear evidence that suggest otherwise.

Though I do feel a little sympathy for the girls as they felt like they had to go there to feel part of something? Why could they not feel that way here? They are much safer here than there.


"Oh no, you jihadi sympathising-" - The Sun

It's a shame that those girls went, and there's nothing from with feeling sympathy for them. There certainly is something wrong with what the Sun are doing though.
Reply 5
I thought the Sun had reached new lows earlier in the year when it got rid of topless models on page 3. Thankfully, saner editorial minds prevailed and they restored the feature to its former glory.
Original post by AlwaysWatching
http://www.comres.co.uk/polls/bbc-radio-4-today-muslim-poll/



One in four (27%) British Muslims say they have some sympathy for the motives behind the attacks on Charlie Hebdo in Paris.


Those 27% were obviously bitter about the fact that the satire mocked their prophet and everything they hold sacred, having sympathy for something does not mean condoning it. The question's phrasing is deliberately phrased as such to distort the two.

However, two thirds (68%) say acts of violence against those who publish images of the Prophet can never be justified while a quarter (24%) disagree


Still a far cry from condoning the Charlie Hebdo shooting

One in nine (11%) British Muslims feel sympathetic towards people who want to fight against western interests while 85% do not.


To many, western interests include imperialism, the forceful taking of a country's natural resources, and the bringing of instability to certain regions, I too am sympathetic towards those who want to fight against western interests, that does not make me sympathetic to jihadists.

Half (49%) believe Muslim clerics preaching that violence against the west can be justified are out of touch with mainstream Muslim opinion, while 45% disagree.


There's obviously a divide here, but disagreeing with that statement does not mean condoning the preaching of violence, for the reasons I mentions previously.

Not all of course. But to deny that there is a significant minority that are a genuine threat is to deliberately lie.


Having an opinion does not equal a genuine threat.
Original post by James Milibanter
I'm sure you're all aware of this front page from, the bigoted piece of claptrap, The Sun.



But, if you actually see where they got their research from, it paints an entirely different picture. http://survation.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/Islamic-Identity-Community-Relations-Survey.pdf

The Sun, that implies muslims are a threat to Britain, knowing that it will cause tensions and could provoke a terror attack. When we need british muslims to know that there is no divide between 'us' and 'them', when we should embrace that most muslims living here indeed consider themselves British.

I will also say, that when you remember Khadiza Sultana, Amira Abase and Shamima Begum, the young girls that travelled to Syria, and also consider how much grooming and indoctrination probably had to play in that, it's quite clear how there are those who harbour sympathies for people like those 3 young girls, who've effectively renounced themselves of Islam and have ruined their lives.


Which part of the poll do you think is a lie? Like which question is wrong, and what should be the right answer?
Reply 8
I only use it occasionally, even then it's only for a certain page....
Original post by AlwaysWatching
Which part of the poll do you think is a lie? Like which question is wrong, and what should be the right answer?


The question "do you have sympathy for jihadists" was not asked
Original post by James Milibanter
Having an opinion does not equal a genuine threat.


It can become a threat. Having an opinion is one step away from acting upon it. Look what happened when people had an opinion on Jews in the 1930s. Look what happened when ISIS had an opinion on homosexuals. The list goes on.

If people with these opinions become a majority, what do you think happens then?
Original post by James Milibanter
I'm sure you're all aware of this front page from, the bigoted piece of claptrap, The Sun.



But, if you actually see where they got their research from, it paints an entirely different picture. http://survation.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/Islamic-Identity-Community-Relations-Survey.pdf

The Sun, that implies muslims are a threat to Britain, knowing that it will cause tensions and could provoke a terror attack. When we need british muslims to know that there is no divide between 'us' and 'them', when we should embrace that most muslims living here indeed consider themselves British.

I will also say, that when you remember Khadiza Sultana, Amira Abase and Shamima Begum, the young girls that travelled to Syria, and also consider how much grooming and indoctrination probably had to play in that, it's quite clear how there are those who harbour sympathies for people like those 3 young girls, who've effectively renounced themselves of Islam and have ruined their lives.


I am quick to chew the islamists and illiberal head in the sanders a new one so will jump in and say yes this is an utter turgid piece of sensationalist scare mongering
it is the truth, they can not publish bs they have to have some evidence @James Milibanter
Original post by AlwaysWatching
It can become a threat. Having an opinion is one step away from acting upon it. Look what happened when people had an opinion on Jews in the 1930s. Look what happened when ISIS had an opinion on homosexuals. The list goes on.

If people with these opinions become a majority, what happens then?


Whether it can do or not is irrelevant, you claimed that the statistics you offered suggested a genuine threat, they do not.
I don't like the sun, not to say this isn't true. I think your are over estimating how many muslims feel British, as far as I can see Islam is a much more powerful bond than nationality, a lot of muslims seem to talk about muslims as a collective, and pledge allegiance to allah and islam. I don't think they give much of a fig for nationality. And if so many feel British why do they go fight in Syria, or make trips to horrendously unstable places in the middle east?
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by judogainz
it is the truth, they can not publish bs they have to have some evidence @James Milibanter


:facepalm:

Go through the survey they conducted and tell me where in their own research it states that 1 in 5 muslims sympathises with jihadists
Original post by SaucissonSecCy
I don't like the sun, not to say this isn't true. I think your are voer estimating how many mulsims feel British, as far as I can see Islam is a much more powerful bond than nationality, most muslims talk about muslims as a collective, and pledge allegiance to allah and islam. I don't think they give much of a fig for nationality. And if so many feel British why do they go fight in Syria, or make trips to horrendously unstable places in the middle east?


Most muslims in the UK consider themselves to be as much British as they are Muslism
Original post by James Milibanter
The question "do you have sympathy for jihadists" was not asked


It was implied in question 6. 20% of them do have sympathy to those young people (jihadists) to join fighters in Syria.

It was poorly worded, but it still 20% of Muslims who have some sort of sympathy.
To be honest bigger things on the cover page caught my attention.
Original post by James Milibanter
Whether it can do or not is irrelevant, you claimed that the statistics you offered suggested a genuine threat, they do not.

It is a threat if they act upon it.

What happens if they acted upon it, became a majority and voted on their opinions? A threat then?

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