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David Cameron on UK Muslim Communities: "We won’t let women be second-class citizens"

Poll

Should migrants be deported if their English doesn't improve after a couple of years?

Writing in The Times, Mr. Cameron's subtitle reads:

'Forcing all migrants to learn English and ending gender segregation will show we’re serious about creating One Nation'

Article body quoted from Conservatives Facebook Page:

"Where in the world do you think the following things are happening? School governors’ meetings where male governors sit in the meeting room and the women have to sit out of sight in the corridor. Young women only allowed to leave their house in the company of a male relative. Religious councils that openly discriminate against women and prevent them from leaving abusive marriages.

The answer, I’m sorry to say, is Britain. Last week, I chaired a meeting of a group of brilliant Muslim women role models. And while I heard great examples of so many women who are flourishing in our country, some painted an alarming picture of forced gender segregation, discrimination and social isolation from mainstream British life.

Of course, this does not describe the life of every British Muslim woman. Nor are these problems unique to Muslim communities. And it cannot be said often enough that the fear of Islamophobic hate crime for instance, the disgraceful pulling of women’s headscarves in the street is widespread and incredibly threatening, as well as being completely disempowering for women. But these problems are being consistently brought to our attention by Muslim women, and we have a duty to them to speak out and to act.

That must begin by understanding the root causes. Some are, of course, cultural. But the standing rebuke to our society is that we have allowed this to continue. All too often, because of what I would call “passive tolerance”, people subscribe to the flawed idea of separate development. Ed Husain put it brilliantly last week when he said that our political correctness stops us from identifying this separatist mentality terming it “the racism of low expectations”. It helps explain why, for instance, some so-called progressive politicians see fit to host gender-segregated political meetings.

It is time to change our approach. We will never truly build One Nation unless we are more assertive about our liberal values, more clear about the expectations we place on those who come to live here and build our country together and more creative and generous in the work we do to break down barriers. And this is a challenge that government cannot meet on its own. I do want every part of government to play its part health visitors, job centres, nurseries, schools but we all have a shared responsibility to tackle prejudice and bigotry, and help integration.

Why does this matter so much? Because we don’t just need a strong economy to thrive, we have to build a strong society. Segregation drives us apart, not together. And tolerating the development of parallel communities can also mean failing to get to grips with appalling practices like FGM and forced marriage.

There is also an important connection to extremism. I am not saying separate development or conservative religious practices directly cause extremism. That would be insulting to many who are devout and peace-loving. But they can help a young person’s slide towards radicalisation. Think about the young boy growing up in Bradford. His parents came from a village in Pakistan. His mum can’t speak English and rarely leaves the home, so he finds it hard to communicate with her, and she doesn’t understand what is happening in his life. At the same time, as a teenager he is struggling to identify with Western culture. Separate development and accepting practices that go against our values only emphasise differences and can help prompt the search of something to belong to. When that happens, the extremist narrative gives him something however ridiculous to believe in.

So what can we do about this? First, we need some clear thinking. This is Britain. In this country, women and girls are free to choose how they live, how they dress and who they love. It’s our values that make this country what it is, and it’s only by standing up for them assertively that they will endure. In Britain, men are not frightened of women’s success; it is celebrated proudly. So we must take on the minority of men who perpetuate these backward attitudes and exert such damaging control over their wives, sisters and daughters. And we must never again allow passive tolerance to prevent us from telling the hard truths.

We also need a clear and positive policy agenda. So we will review the role of religious councils, including Sharia councils. We’re teaching British values in our schools because I want every young boy and girl growing up here to feel proud of our country and properly connected to it. And we’ll end the forced gender segregation, as we issue clear guidance to local authorities to stamp out this practice.

We must also make more progress on English language. It is at the heart of solving this. Consider this: new figures show that some 190,000 British Muslim women or 22 per cent speak little or no English despite many having lived here for decades. 40,000 of these women speak no English at all. So it’s no surprise that sixty per cent of women of a Pakistani or Bangladeshi heritage are economically inactive.

This has to be tackled head on. We’ve already introduced a language test for new migrants, but I believe it’s time to be much more demanding. Yes, we have responsibilities to migrants, but they have responsibilities too. At the moment, someone can move here with very basic English and there’s no requirement to improve it over time. We will change that. We will now say: if you don’t improve your fluency, that could affect your ability to stay in the UK. This will help make it clear to those men who stop their partners from integrating that there are consequences.

We’ll also fund a dramatic improvement in the way we provide English language services for women. With a new £20m programme, we’ll make sure every woman from isolated communities with no English at all has access to classes, whether through community groups or FE colleges.

Britain has a claim to be the most successful multi-faith, multi-racial democracy on the planet. We got here because we fought and won those long struggles for liberty, equality and mutual tolerance. But the job of building a more cohesive country is never complete. With English language and women’s empowerment as our next frontier, I believe we can bring Britain together and build the stronger society that is within reach."
(edited 5 years ago)

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Next week: David Cameron tackles the same issues in the Jewish community...

...Or not.
And if the men decide not to let the women go to these classes?
If the women have had it drilled too hard into thier heads that thier needs and wants dont matter?
When muslim men rape and beat thier wives to teach them a lesson and to keep them in line?
When the male leaders of these communities who rule through indoctrinated suppression say "no you cant" what then?

Where will David Cameron be?
I'm quite glad for times like these when Cameron can demonstrate he's not just the evil nonsensical c**t everyone seems to love branding him as.

It seems as soon as any politician comes into power the British public automatically hates them. It even seems the Americans at least treat their leader with some amount of respect; it's a sad state of affairs if they're beating us in that area...
Yes

I expect if you want the state to support you and your children you should be able to ask for this in the language of this country
22% of British female Muslims can't speak English (BBC).


The segregation does need to end, and I applaud Cameron for not being afraid to admit it.
Reply 6
liar who doesnt understand Islam.
Only if we also take back the lazy feckless Brits who live in other countries who are too lazy to learn the local language.

I'm not sure how deporting these women helps alleviate their oppression... Cameron, PR mastermind appeasing the liberal Guardinistas and immigrant hating Kippers in one fell stroke.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by ChaoticButterfly
Only if we also take back the lazy feckless Brits you live in other countries who are too lazy to learn the local language.


You say that but I now people from the UK who live in Spain France Germany and Japan to name a few and all of them can speak the local language well enough to get by at places like the shop or at a doctors.

But if other countries decided to enforce this does that mean you would have no issue with this in the UK as well?
Original post by BaconandSauce
You say that but I now people from the UK who live in Spain France Germany and Japan to name a few and all of them can speak the local language well enough to get by at places like the shop or at a doctors.

But if other countries decided to enforce this does that mean you would have no issue with this in the UK as well?


I also know someone who can't speak a word of Indian who lived in India for two years. Luckily they spoke English!

Look. Our language is everywhere. Stop moaning and get this stick out our collective arse about people not being able to speak perfect english when we are so useless as a nation in being able to speak other languages at the same time as our language is taking over the world.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by BaconandSauce
Yes

I expect if you want the state to support you and your children you should be able to ask for this in the language of this country


Those Afghan interpreters who helped with the interrogation and torture of their own countrymen on the promise of resettlement in the UK, and who were subsequently denied, would like to raise an objection to your statement.


Those tinpot dictators who receive foreign aid, have submitted a request in their own national language. Cameron has approved their application.
Original post by sjgriffiths
I'm quite glad for times like these when Cameron can demonstrate he's not just the evil nonsensical c**t everyone seems to love branding him as.


Cameron is an evil ****.

This has got all the hallmarks of party politics written all over it.
Original post by ChaoticButterfly
I also know someone who can't speak a word of Indian who lived in India for two years. Luckily they spoke English!

Look. Our language is everywhere. Stop moaning and get this stick out our collective arse about people not being able to speak perfect english when we are so useless as a nation in being able to speak other languages.Meanwhile our language is taking over the world.


English is the lingua franca. You can't draw parallels to expats living in English-speaking nations and then say "because of this, we should be learning Urdu in England to appease the immigrants". That's insanity.

The entry-point to a culture is through the common language. If you can't speak English you can't learn our customs, you cannot assimilate in the slightest. Those old people in Spain who don't learn a word of Spanish? They have their own money and don't need to assimilate. They're also not raping local women. On the other hand, the expats who are still of working age DO speak Spanish, unless they want to lock themselves to only working within the small expat marketplace or as a mediocre English teacher.

You're trying to bait-and-switch by guilting the British who are, in your opinion, incompetent. What you need to understand is that English people abroad reflect very little of what English people who have remained in their homeland actually want. All countries can fight to maintain their culture, some succeed and others fail. But they should all *try*. You don't want to try.
Original post by TheArtofProtest
Those Afghan interpreters who helped with the interrogation and torture of their own countrymen on the promise of resettlement in the UK, and who were subsequently denied, would like to raise an objection to your statement.


Those tinpot dictators who receive foreign aid, have submitted a request in their own national language. Cameron has approved their application.


They would be able to ask for help in English (the point) if they were here would hey not.

And tin pot dictators don't live in the UK on the whole.

But it seems it's a difficult issue for you to understand (it this because your parents don't speak English at home a lot?)
Original post by ChaoticButterfly
Stop moaning and get this stick out our collective arse about people not being able to speak perfect english


No

It's not too much to expect people who want to emigrate to this country to speak the language of this country
Original post by BaconandSauce
They would be able to ask for help in English (the point) if they were here would hey not.


Are you suggesting that the Afghan interpreters illegally immigrate to the UK?

And tin pot dictators don't live in the UK on the whole.


We've given shelter to a fair few and give state money to some who squirrel it away for their own ends.

But it seems it's a difficult issue for you to understand (it this because your parents don't speak English at home a lot?)


I'd rather you focus on the arguments made, lest you betray the fact that you have no arguments.
Original post by TheArtofProtest
Are you suggesting that the Afghan interpreters illegally immigrate to the UK?



We've given shelter to a fair few and give state money to some who squirrel it away for their own ends.



I'd rather you focus on the arguments made, lest you betray the fact that you have no arguments.


I see you are building from straw again

none of your posts are relevant to the OP

we are talking about muslim women who have chosen and been accepted into the UK are you worried because you know family who might be affected negatively because of this?
Original post by BaconandSauce
No

It's not too much to expect people who want to emigrate to this country to speak the language of this country


Do you agree with (I think) Dubai deporting people who refuse to learn Arabic (just out of interest)?
Look at DC doing something for women!! Good on him.

Meanwhile George keeps going with his cuts that are disproportionately affecting women.

Every little helps I suppose.
Original post by abruiseonthesky
Do you agree with (I think) Dubai deporting people who refuse to learn Arabic (just out of interest)?


Yes if that's what Dubai wants but as far as I am aware none of the people who work in Dubai are allowed to become actual citizens

https://www.justlanded.com/english/Dubai/Dubai-Guide/Visas-Permits/Citizenship

But I have no issue with any country saying if you want to be a citizen you must be able to speak the local language

Do you?

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