The Student Room Group

Are Public Schools such as Eton and Harrow a blight on British society?

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they are not a blight, they are the things that foreigners think of our country when it was a great imperial power. remove them and you are eradicating history and excellent works of art such as tom browns school days/ flashman etc
Reply 42
Original post by MalayHKG
Dealing with this problem is incredibly hard.

There is no real 'solution' to this problem.

I propose that more money is invested into state primary schools as this will help build the foundations for success. This will ideally reduce the number of people who are illiterate and become more intelligent and allow people from a lower socioeconomic status to expect more from themselves. This with the help of public schools opening up places to a larger group of people from lower social classes through bursaries and scholarships , will increase the number of people who receive a world class education.


In my opinion, you're right. I think that it's a social problem rather than one with education, however. People need to value themselves and see the possibilities. But relating to the initial topic, they are not the blight, just exclusive.
Original post by stefano865
.


I am not sure why I found this so funny.
Original post by callum_law
I am not sure why I found this so funny.



Yep. I actually can't look at Boris Johnson and not laugh.

It's physically impossible.
Original post by stefano865
Yep. I actually can't look at Boris Johnson and not laugh.

It's physically impossible.


Almost as funny as his craic. "Great supine protoplasmic invertebrate jellies."
Original post by TimmonaPortella
Attendance at Oxbridge is an indication of academic attainment and ability, not of wealth.


There goes your credibility on this issue. Can't say that I expected much better.
Original post by Hydeman
There goes your credibility on this issue. Can't say that I expected much better.


Well I'm glad I didn't disappoint you, at least.
Yes, yes they are

Not enough people care to make a change though
Original post by TimmonaPortella
Well I'm glad I didn't disappoint you, at least.


Probably not as glad as you are of overstating your own achievements, but hey-ho. Your self-esteem has to come from somewhere.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by Hydeman
Probably not as glad as you are of overstating your own achievements, but hey-ho. Your self-esteem has to come from somewhere.


I don't take much pride in my own educational achievements. I'm aware of the factors that led to them. They include my own abilities, which are just as much unearned as my circumstances.

The point I was trying to make, before you started trying to bicker with me for some reason, was not that there is no link between Oxbridge attendance and background, but that one does not indicate the other. In fact, I've already expanded upon that view, so I don't really feel the need to do it again.

If you're interested in discussing it, you may feel free to respond. What I'm not interested in is exchanging petty insults with some random person on the internet.
Original post by TimmonaPortella
The point I was trying to make, before you started trying to bicker with me for some reason, was not that there is no link between Oxbridge attendance and background


Original post by TimmonaPortella
Attendance at Oxbridge is an indication of academic attainment and ability, not of wealth.


It's best not to make a habit out of lying about what you said one page previously, if what you're here to do is discuss the issue.
Original post by Hydeman
It's best not to make a habit out of lying about what you said one page previously, if what you're here to do is discuss the issue.


I think I'll just paste my response. Hope you've got out of your system whatever you were trying to get out of your system :dontknow:

Original post by TimmonaPortella
Oh, sure, there's no doubt that background is a factor in determining how likely someone is to reach the required standard at 18. Incidentally, this differs as much between good and bad state schools as between state and private schools (there are some top state schools in, ah, 'leafy' areas which send loads of people to Oxbridge), and is affected by parents and other home factors too, not just by schooling.

The answer to this, as far as there can be one, is to make sure everyone has access to the sort of educational environment that can prepare them adequately for Oxbridge. This does not justify the government telling people that they can't spend their money on their children's education, even if it would solve the problem -- which it categorically wouldn't.

Beyond improving state schooling, there are some deeper problems, such as a lack of academic motivation, lack of respect for education, amongst people from certain backgrounds, etc, that will always be difficult. At this point the state ends up with a bit of a leading a horse to water situation. We should do what we can, through state programs, to motivate people from all backgrounds to take advantage of the opportunities available to them, but we shouldn't necessarily expect that we will ever have equal numbers of attendees of Oxbridge or other top universities from all backgrounds, because there's unfortunately no equally effective replacement for parental motivation.
Original post by TimmonaPortella
I think I'll just paste my response. Hope you've got out of your system whatever you were trying to get out of your system :dontknow:


I have no idea what you're referring to. You made a false statement and then attempted to pretend that you hadn't; I pointed it out.

I'm done here. There's little point (beyond pointing out the contradictions) in arguing with a privately-educated person who is convinced that he earned his place at Cambridge.
Original post by Hydeman
I have no idea what you're referring to. You made a false statement and then attempted to pretend that you hadn't; I pointed it out.

I'm done here. There's little point (beyond pointing out the contradictions) in arguing with a privately-educated person who is convinced that he earned his place at Cambridge.


I went to a state sixth form, which is the most relevant stage of education, but I wasn't talking about myself anyway.

I find talk of 'earning' or 'desert' problematic and unhelpful. We act according to our environment.
Original post by Hydeman
It's best not to make a habit out of lying about what you said one page previously, if what you're here to do is discuss the issue.


There might be a link between my hunger level and my buying a McDonald's, but my being hungry does not indicate that I have bought a McDonald's. Likewise, whilst there is a link between those at Oxbridge and those who have experienced private education, their being at Oxbridge does not indicate that they were privately educated.
[quote=MalayHKGBut the thing is the majority of people who gain places to Oxbridge come from independent schools and they significantly outnumber the number of state school students. 7% of the British population are privately educated, yet 50% of Oxbridge students are from private schools.

You say attendance to Oxbridge is an indication of academic attainment, but the problem is that the people who attain these grades are all privately educated which is absolutely preposterous which signifies that wealth plays a key role.

The larger part of this is correlation and not causation.

Students who go to public schools and then on to Oxbridge almost invariably come from families somewhere between affluence and staggering wealth, in which discipline and self-confidence are instilled at a young age and they are raised in atmospheres of learning and culture and given tuition either by their families and/or by private tutors.

I think that last one is especially underrated. I did not receive any home tuition at all during my school years, except on one occasion when I visited a privileged friend in Germany during a holiday. This was prep/primary school. I was in the bottom set for Latin, scoring around 45% in tests and generally pretty crap. His father was home at the weekend and he tutored both of us through Latin for a solid two hours or so for our Common Entrance mocks...I ended up getting the highest mark in the year when we went back.

Playing fields, old buildings and slightly smaller class sizes have very little relevance to the numbers of private school students at Oxbridge except insofar as they are a reliable indicator of the material advantages behind the scenes.
(edited 8 years ago)
Original post by callum_law
Without them, we'd not have nearly as many fine Sky TV shows. I say let them stay.


like what?
Original post by MalayHKG
That applies with all fee paying schools. However, for the minority of students who go to these places on a bursary the benefits they receive are endless and significantly more than what they'd receive at a state school.

Society will always be a place where the wealthy dominate. Take a look at our cabinet ministers and our Prime Minister. 50% went to Oxbridge wit the majority going to public and independent schools like Eton.


And there doing a great job aren't they? ...not


Posted from TSR Mobile
The schools themselves aren't the problem - it's the distribution of wealth which permits educational resources to be distributed unequally.

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