German government plans to spend 93.6 billion euros on refugees by end 2020
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Original post by AhmedMA99
And at that time marrying 9 years old was an okay thing. Keep in mind that was 1400 years ago.. Being gay in the UK was illegal 50 years ago..
Ahmed everyone, this is the people we are importing
@Josb @Erebor @Jebedee @Mathemagicien @Zas_21 @DanteTheDoorKnob @anosmianAcrimony @CarlTheCuck @AhmedMA99 @Dima-Blackburn @KimKallstrom @lolatmaths @slaven @Daniel9998 @betelgeuse
I'm German. Speak to any German in private and they will tell you that the reason why Merkel did what she did was so that Germany will in the near future have adequate manpower to wash the toilets, work in the cafes, stack shelves, clear the rubbish, sweep the streets etc.
The German government knows that german citizens shun these jobs. also given that university is free and the fact that the government encourages us to learn skills such as carpentry, designing etc, it shows the government knows what its doing.
However what Merkel and her colleagues did not envision was the huge numbers that came. Now that the dust has settled (the hundreds of rapes and molest in Cologne and several parts of Germany on New Year's Day), the government will now begin filtering all these migrants and assigning them jobs such as washing the toilets, working in the cafes, stacking shelves, clearing the rubbish, sweeping the streets etc.
You only have to see what the German police commissioner said on national TV to understand the true extent of the migrant crisis. Mind you, the higher command in Germany gave him a piece of their mind following the telecast of this interview. Watch it to believe it.
[video="youtube;SOi8QJD8fiw"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SOi8QJD8fiw[/video]
Political correctness was what got many, many good, wonderful members on this forum banned for merely questioning the policy decisions linked to immigration/migration such as the one made by my Chancellor to allow all these migrants into my countrySomeone recently asked me why should people wanting to enter into another country, be checked for HIV/AIDS? This is because the government owes a duty to its citizens to protect them from people who may want to infect others with their communicable diseases. This is an extension of a 'social contract theory'. Read up on it if you have time. Educate yourself.
You may have read or heard, many of these migrants have turned my country upside down. I hope all of you reading my post, bears this in mind. A country's sovereignty, security and safety of its citizens is so so important. With Merkel's blunder, we have become a carbon copy of UK & the rest of EU and their set of problems.
Merkel has been in hiding for many months now. She's pushing 62 years of age. She won't throw in the towel just yet. If UK decides to remain in the EU, I am certain they will make EU into a united states of Europe and she would be the major contender for the post of PM of the USE. Tony Blair has quietened down way too much to be able to stake a claim for that coveted position.
Merkel studied physics and then chemistry. She has no knowledge and understanding about politics, law, finance and sociology. She tells the German public one thing and tells the EU another thing and then tells the world another thing. Sometime back she said that refugees must now return back to their countries of origin after the wars back home have ended.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-eu...-idUSKCN0V80IH
With Turkey's inclusion into the EU imminent, there will be 77 million Turks who will get to make their debut appearance in any of the EU member states. They will not go to France because France has zero tolerance towards Muslims. They will either come to Germany or go to the UK.
Fun times ahead.
I'm German. Speak to any German in private and they will tell you that the reason why Merkel did what she did was so that Germany will in the near future have adequate manpower to wash the toilets, work in the cafes, stack shelves, clear the rubbish, sweep the streets etc.
The German government knows that german citizens shun these jobs. also given that university is free and the fact that the government encourages us to learn skills such as carpentry, designing etc, it shows the government knows what its doing.
However what Merkel and her colleagues did not envision was the huge numbers that came. Now that the dust has settled (the hundreds of rapes and molest in Cologne and several parts of Germany on New Year's Day), the government will now begin filtering all these migrants and assigning them jobs such as washing the toilets, working in the cafes, stacking shelves, clearing the rubbish, sweeping the streets etc.
You only have to see what the German police commissioner said on national TV to understand the true extent of the migrant crisis. Mind you, the higher command in Germany gave him a piece of their mind following the telecast of this interview. Watch it to believe it.
[video="youtube;SOi8QJD8fiw"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SOi8QJD8fiw[/video]
Political correctness was what got many, many good, wonderful members on this forum banned for merely questioning the policy decisions linked to immigration/migration such as the one made by my Chancellor to allow all these migrants into my country
•
without checking if they are holding genuine passports
•
without checking if they have links to terrorist groups
•
without checking if they have criminal records in their home countries
•
without checking if they have HIV/AIDS
You may have read or heard, many of these migrants have turned my country upside down. I hope all of you reading my post, bears this in mind. A country's sovereignty, security and safety of its citizens is so so important. With Merkel's blunder, we have become a carbon copy of UK & the rest of EU and their set of problems.
Merkel has been in hiding for many months now. She's pushing 62 years of age. She won't throw in the towel just yet. If UK decides to remain in the EU, I am certain they will make EU into a united states of Europe and she would be the major contender for the post of PM of the USE. Tony Blair has quietened down way too much to be able to stake a claim for that coveted position.
Merkel studied physics and then chemistry. She has no knowledge and understanding about politics, law, finance and sociology. She tells the German public one thing and tells the EU another thing and then tells the world another thing. Sometime back she said that refugees must now return back to their countries of origin after the wars back home have ended.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-eu...-idUSKCN0V80IH
With Turkey's inclusion into the EU imminent, there will be 77 million Turks who will get to make their debut appearance in any of the EU member states. They will not go to France because France has zero tolerance towards Muslims. They will either come to Germany or go to the UK.
Fun times ahead.
Original post by Audrey18
Fun times ahead.
indeed
Original post by AhmedMA99
And at that time marrying 9 years old was an okay thing. Keep in mind that was 1400 years ago.. Being gay in the UK was illegal 50 years ago..
It seems as if the system of morality you subscribe to is eternal and unchanging only when you want it to be.
Original post by Audrey18
I'm German. Speak to any German in private and they will tell you that the reason why Merkel did what she did was so that Germany will in the near future have adequate manpower to wash the toilets, work in the cafes, stack shelves, clear the rubbish, sweep the streets etc.
The German government knows that german citizens shun these jobs. also given that university is free and the fact that the government encourages us to learn skills such as carpentry, designing etc, it shows the government knows what its doing.
.
I'm German. Speak to any German in private and they will tell you that the reason why Merkel did what she did was so that Germany will in the near future have adequate manpower to wash the toilets, work in the cafes, stack shelves, clear the rubbish, sweep the streets etc.
The German government knows that german citizens shun these jobs. also given that university is free and the fact that the government encourages us to learn skills such as carpentry, designing etc, it shows the government knows what its doing.
.
lol germany needs 1 million cleaners, now thats what I call a clean country. Excellent strategy !
If you don't want to contribute to things such as these, then avoid paying taxes if possible (there are always loopholes). I don't want to fund a bunch of aliens moving and living over here or anywhere else in Europe.
[QUOTE=Josb;64814193
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-europe-migrants-germany-costs-idUSKCN0Y50DY
So, according to the states, the total cost will be in fact €141 billion till 2020 (30bn a year for four years plus 21bn this year).
The German taxpayer must be delighted...
I wonder how much Britain's share will be, I am sure ways will be found to make the whole of Europe's tax payers responsible for these economic migrants.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-europe-migrants-germany-costs-idUSKCN0Y50DY
So, according to the states, the total cost will be in fact €141 billion till 2020 (30bn a year for four years plus 21bn this year).
The German taxpayer must be delighted...
I wonder how much Britain's share will be, I am sure ways will be found to make the whole of Europe's tax payers responsible for these economic migrants.
Original post by Daniel9998
lol germany needs 1 million cleaners, now thats what I call a clean country. Excellent strategy !
From the huge numbers of migrants/refugees that entered Germany, the women won't work. Their husbands won't allow it. So even though these people have relocated geographically, their mindsets are still tuned to the primitive days. I wonder why? Anyways if Germany allows these migrants/refugees to claim benefits like what's happening in UK, then we're doomed cos there's bound to be abuse of the system.
I've watched shows like BBC Benefits Britain : Life on the Dole, Benefits Street and so many others. I do not wish for my countrymen to have such behaviour and attitude. To me its wrong for two adults to be layabouts, have 20++ children, live in a huge house, rely on benefits and then continue milking the system to pay for holidays to Barbados etc. This is unfair to the taxpayer. Our views on this issue may differ and I respect that totally.
Original post by Josb
Once you have a real job for the first time, perhaps you'll be entitled to mock someone's salary.
Insecure much?
Original post by Audrey18
@Josb @Erebor @Jebedee @Mathemagicien @Zas_21 @DanteTheDoorKnob @anosmianAcrimony @CarlTheCuck @AhmedMA99 @Dima-Blackburn @KimKallstrom @lolatmaths @slaven @Daniel9998 @betelgeuse
I'm German. Speak to any German in private and they will tell you that the reason why Merkel did what she did was so that Germany will in the near future have adequate manpower to wash the toilets, work in the cafes, stack shelves, clear the rubbish, sweep the streets etc.
The German government knows that german citizens shun these jobs. also given that university is free and the fact that the government encourages us to learn skills such as carpentry, designing etc, it shows the government knows what its doing.
However what Merkel and her colleagues did not envision was the huge numbers that came. Now that the dust has settled (the hundreds of rapes and molest in Cologne and several parts of Germany on New Year's Day), the government will now begin filtering all these migrants and assigning them jobs such as washing the toilets, working in the cafes, stacking shelves, clearing the rubbish, sweeping the streets etc.
I'm German. Speak to any German in private and they will tell you that the reason why Merkel did what she did was so that Germany will in the near future have adequate manpower to wash the toilets, work in the cafes, stack shelves, clear the rubbish, sweep the streets etc.
The German government knows that german citizens shun these jobs. also given that university is free and the fact that the government encourages us to learn skills such as carpentry, designing etc, it shows the government knows what its doing.
However what Merkel and her colleagues did not envision was the huge numbers that came. Now that the dust has settled (the hundreds of rapes and molest in Cologne and several parts of Germany on New Year's Day), the government will now begin filtering all these migrants and assigning them jobs such as washing the toilets, working in the cafes, stacking shelves, clearing the rubbish, sweeping the streets etc.
Why not encourage unemployed non-german EU citizens to come do these jobs in Germany then? There are 21 million unemployed in the EU. Or even other europeans from places like Ukraine or the Balkans? Even something like China would be much better. Why import millions from third world hell holes with cultures completely alien to Europe? Muslims have awful unemployment numbers across Europe, on top of the cultural baggage they bring along with them (aka enrichment).
Original post by Audrey18
X
Great post. What I would suggest though is that the fact Germans allowed this so easily in the first place means the average German is in less of a position to give an informed view on the situation.
This police chief is just a government stooge telling the public what he's been told to say.
It's a complete fantasy to think that Muslim migrants who have a demonstrably high unemployment rate are going to be slaves of the millennials. The Coudenhove-Kalergi plan seems more of a fitting explanation if you ask me.
We're like lambs to the slaughter. Our stupid stupid governments are betraying us and nobody does anything about it (believe me, there are many who want to).
Guess what happened to Rome when they gave Barbarians citizenship and enlisted them into the army.
Guess what happened when the Trojan horse was accepted in the City of Troy.
and now guess what happened when we let all refugees in undocumented?
Well... there will either be a civil war or what we know of Europe will fade away.
Guess what happened to Rome when they gave Barbarians citizenship and enlisted them into the army.
Guess what happened when the Trojan horse was accepted in the City of Troy.
and now guess what happened when we let all refugees in undocumented?
Well... there will either be a civil war or what we know of Europe will fade away.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Erebor
Why not encourage unemployed non-german EU citizens to come do these jobs in Germany then? There are 21 million unemployed in the EU. Or even other europeans from places like Ukraine or the Balkans? Even something like China would be much better. Why import millions from third world hell holes with cultures completely alien to Europe? Muslims have awful unemployment numbers across Europe, on top of the cultural baggage they bring along with them (aka enrichment).
I get what you mean but the other countries won't stay silent while Germany advertises openly for labourers or manpower from other countries to come and take up jobs in Germany. The governments of those countries will demand to be compensated. You need to understand that many of the governments in Europe are corrupt and they couldn't care less about doing good for their citizens.
These corrupt governments only care about lining up their pockets while their people suffer in poverty, lack of food, no sanitation etc. These governments will not take it lightly if their citizens relocate to other countries for work because as you know, people are not stupid. When they go to a new place and they see there's such a disparity between the new place and their country of origin, they will start thinking. Corrupt governments never want their people to think. They only want people to think what they want them to think.
The bigger picture is that these corrupt governments and their officials are the ones that kowtow to the EU because once they have reached the fullest capacity in terms of political rank and status in their countries, the next step is to march to the EU. In the EU, the amount of free money they get as wages etc and businesses they can do is tremendously huge.
Original post by Jebedee
Great post. What I would suggest though is that the fact Germans allowed this so easily in the first place means the average German is in less of a position to give an informed view on the situation.This police chief is just a government stooge telling the public what he's been told to say.It's a complete fantasy to think that Muslim migrants who have a demonstrably high unemployment rate are going to be slaves of the millennials. The Coudenhove-Kalergi plan seems more of a fitting explanation if you ask me.
No you're mistaken. The police chief did the brave thing by telling the truth on national tv when politicians and representatives from other enforcement agencies and sympathetic volunteer groups were sugarcoating the entire saga.It has also nothing to do with whether the muslims among these migrants will allow themselves to be slaves in Germany.
If the German government says that unlike the culture in UK, they will not get benefits and that they must do work to earn wages in order to continue enjoying a roof over their heads etc, eventually people will accept the instruction.
I don't want to get embroiled on the muslim question because given the demography of this forum, it can quickly get out of hand. All i will say is that Merkel needs to figure out how to convince these people to
•
respect the rule of law in Germany
•
allow women in their household to work
•
respect other women in Germany and that they can't just force themselves on a woman, rape or molest her and then walk away, pretending as though nothing has happened
•
learn to speak, read and write German
Spoiler
Original post by Audrey18
@Josb @Erebor @Jebedee @Mathemagicien @Zas_21 @DanteTheDoorKnob @anosmianAcrimony @CarlTheCuck @AhmedMA99 @Dima-Blackburn @KimKallstrom @lolatmaths @slaven @Daniel9998 @betelgeuse
I'm German. Speak to any German in private and they will tell you that the reason why Merkel did what she did was so that Germany will in the near future have adequate manpower to wash the toilets, work in the cafes, stack shelves, clear the rubbish, sweep the streets etc.
The German government knows that german citizens shun these jobs. also given that university is free and the fact that the government encourages us to learn skills such as carpentry, designing etc, it shows the government knows what its doing.
However what Merkel and her colleagues did not envision was the huge numbers that came. Now that the dust has settled (the hundreds of rapes and molest in Cologne and several parts of Germany on New Year's Day), the government will now begin filtering all these migrants and assigning them jobs such as washing the toilets, working in the cafes, stacking shelves, clearing the rubbish, sweeping the streets etc.
You only have to see what the German police commissioner said on national TV to understand the true extent of the migrant crisis. Mind you, the higher command in Germany gave him a piece of their mind following the telecast of this interview. Watch it to believe it.
[video="youtube;SOi8QJD8fiw"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SOi8QJD8fiw[/video]
Political correctness was what got many, many good, wonderful members on this forum banned for merely questioning the policy decisions linked to immigration/migration such as the one made by my Chancellor to allow all these migrants into my countrySomeone recently asked me why should people wanting to enter into another country, be checked for HIV/AIDS? This is because the government owes a duty to its citizens to protect them from people who may want to infect others with their communicable diseases. This is an extension of a 'social contract theory'. Read up on it if you have time. Educate yourself.
You may have read or heard, many of these migrants have turned my country upside down. I hope all of you reading my post, bears this in mind. A country's sovereignty, security and safety of its citizens is so so important. With Merkel's blunder, we have become a carbon copy of UK & the rest of EU and their set of problems.
Merkel has been in hiding for many months now. She's pushing 62 years of age. She won't throw in the towel just yet. If UK decides to remain in the EU, I am certain they will make EU into a united states of Europe and she would be the major contender for the post of PM of the USE. Tony Blair has quietened down way too much to be able to stake a claim for that coveted position.
Merkel studied physics and then chemistry. She has no knowledge and understanding about politics, law, finance and sociology. She tells the German public one thing and tells the EU another thing and then tells the world another thing. Sometime back she said that refugees must now return back to their countries of origin theyafter the wars back home have ended.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-eu...-idUSKCN0V80IH
With Turkey's inclusion into the EU imminent, there will be 77 million Turks who will get to make their debut appearance in any of the EU member states. They will not go to France because France has zero tolerance towards Muslims. They will either come to Germany or go to the UK.
Fun times ahead.
I'm German. Speak to any German in private and they will tell you that the reason why Merkel did what she did was so that Germany will in the near future have adequate manpower to wash the toilets, work in the cafes, stack shelves, clear the rubbish, sweep the streets etc.
The German government knows that german citizens shun these jobs. also given that university is free and the fact that the government encourages us to learn skills such as carpentry, designing etc, it shows the government knows what its doing.
However what Merkel and her colleagues did not envision was the huge numbers that came. Now that the dust has settled (the hundreds of rapes and molest in Cologne and several parts of Germany on New Year's Day), the government will now begin filtering all these migrants and assigning them jobs such as washing the toilets, working in the cafes, stacking shelves, clearing the rubbish, sweeping the streets etc.
You only have to see what the German police commissioner said on national TV to understand the true extent of the migrant crisis. Mind you, the higher command in Germany gave him a piece of their mind following the telecast of this interview. Watch it to believe it.
[video="youtube;SOi8QJD8fiw"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SOi8QJD8fiw[/video]
Political correctness was what got many, many good, wonderful members on this forum banned for merely questioning the policy decisions linked to immigration/migration such as the one made by my Chancellor to allow all these migrants into my country
•
without checking if they are holding genuine passports
•
without checking if they have links to terrorist groups
•
without checking if they have criminal records in their home countries
•
without checking if they have HIV/AIDS
You may have read or heard, many of these migrants have turned my country upside down. I hope all of you reading my post, bears this in mind. A country's sovereignty, security and safety of its citizens is so so important. With Merkel's blunder, we have become a carbon copy of UK & the rest of EU and their set of problems.
Merkel has been in hiding for many months now. She's pushing 62 years of age. She won't throw in the towel just yet. If UK decides to remain in the EU, I am certain they will make EU into a united states of Europe and she would be the major contender for the post of PM of the USE. Tony Blair has quietened down way too much to be able to stake a claim for that coveted position.
Merkel studied physics and then chemistry. She has no knowledge and understanding about politics, law, finance and sociology. She tells the German public one thing and tells the EU another thing and then tells the world another thing. Sometime back she said that refugees must now return back to their countries of origin theyafter the wars back home have ended.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-eu...-idUSKCN0V80IH
With Turkey's inclusion into the EU imminent, there will be 77 million Turks who will get to make their debut appearance in any of the EU member states. They will not go to France because France has zero tolerance towards Muslims. They will either come to Germany or go to the UK.
Fun times ahead.
Wait, you and the german government really believe the Sunni Arabs would work?
It is not the reason why they came to Germany in first place, it is that they are hoping for free welfare. Working low jobs in what they expected when coming to Germany. So, if yu force them to do so, you risk an islamic revolt in streets of Germany, the same like we have seen in Sweden.And from the various type of person on the Earth you have choose the most backward and not-integretable. You know have you wonder one other things.There is also a war in Ukraine. Ukrainians, unlike Sunni Arabs would indeed love to work in Germany. Yet, the german government and the EU refuse to allow ukrainians refugees to settle in to Europe. Have you ever wonder why is Merkel discriminating Ukrainians? Maybe it is because they are not diverse enough for your BRD taste?
And, yes I talked to some Germans about this topic. Hence I am logged on a german political forum and discuss it often. All of them said me they hate Merkel. One relative living in Germany told me the taxes are raised by 400 euros to accomodate the migrants. They would also wish to get rid of them but unforuntaly they are to scared to be called Nazis to do so. This is what I have been told by them.
And guess what, after thinking about this topic. I have to admit all the rapes, terrorists attacks, Rotherham, 7/7 Bombers, Köln.... You Brits and Germans desirved since you are political correct, and voted cultural relativist in power, promoted patriotism as something backward. You believed to much to the propaganda of the Lűgenprese. You desrived and let it be a lesson for you.
You are calling us backward for wanting to remain monocultural? Nah, it is you that are stupid, deluded and backward. We are on other are intelligent and seen this happened.
Oh, and since has the BRD the job to "protect its citizens". For the Lűgenpresse and the BRD elite you will always be Nazis, and if they wanted to protect you than they would never allow million of muslims to enter Germany. They knew exactly what would happen (they needed just to ask the Brits for advice). And you germans are doing nothing to stop it.
Would you want to know where exactly have you been lied? You Lűgrenpresse claimed all the million refugee are high skilled workers (Fachkräfte), and still to this days continue! It is also a lie that the german economy needs the and want to help them. There are Ukrainians and nobody is helping them.
So, to the people of Germans if you do not want to be hated for you government again like in 1944. Vote AfD and stop bulling other european countries into accepting muslim barbarians.
Oh, and you are complaining about rapes and criminality the migrants are doing. Wait in 10 years when there will be terrorist attacks. Germany is turning into a multikulti hellhole. Just look at places like Kreuzberg and Cottbuser Tor. They are multikulti slums.
(edited 7 years ago)
@slaven
Clearly you have wonderful general knowledge. But I don't want to get embroiled on the muslim question because given the demography of this forum, it can quickly get out of hand. Many good, wonderful members on this forum have been banned for speaking the truth. But they still got banned. So let's avoid the Muslim question altogether. It's better to be safe than sorry.
Clearly you have wonderful general knowledge. But I don't want to get embroiled on the muslim question because given the demography of this forum, it can quickly get out of hand. Many good, wonderful members on this forum have been banned for speaking the truth. But they still got banned. So let's avoid the Muslim question altogether. It's better to be safe than sorry.
Original post by Audrey18
@slaven
Clearly you have wonderful general knowledge. But I don't want to get embroiled on the muslim question because given the demography of this forum, it can quickly get out of hand. Many good, wonderful members on this forum have been banned for speaking the truth. But they still got banned. So let's avoid the Muslim question altogether. It's better to be safe than sorry.
Clearly you have wonderful general knowledge. But I don't want to get embroiled on the muslim question because given the demography of this forum, it can quickly get out of hand. Many good, wonderful members on this forum have been banned for speaking the truth. But they still got banned. So let's avoid the Muslim question altogether. It's better to be safe than sorry.
Well as you wish. I personally do not scared for speaking the truth and if some get offended. It telling the truth is offensive than it is not my problem.
I am reading a lot of BRD mainstrem press. They lost all the credibility. Even the talkshows when an AfD member participate in discussions, the moderators tend to be more biased against him.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by Mathemagicien
Not true; the Polish nationalist resistance fought the Nazis, but they knew that the alternative was Communist rule. The Finns fought off the Russians, but were forced to help the Nazis.
The Chinese didn't have a wealthy homeland, nor a system that they were content with (think of the revolutionary war after WWII)
The Chinese didn't have a wealthy homeland, nor a system that they were content with (think of the revolutionary war after WWII)
Apologies for the delay. Admittedly I don't know much about situations from WWII you've presented, so contrasting the two conflicts is not something I could do with any authority. However, I can give you some insight into my experiences with Syrians that may help explain it.
Firstly, many Syrians simply don't feel that any side of the conflict represents their interests whatsoever. I've spoken to many Syrians that were ideologically opposed to the government, may have even participated in demonstrations against it early on, but when the situation became militarised, they found the opposition becoming more sectarian, Islamist, and incompatible with their views and beliefs. I've also spoken to those on the other side, who were generally supportive of the government or opposed to revolution against it, who nonetheless did not feel it was a government worthy of fighting for. Many Syrians I know wanted reforms, but did not want violence or war. They feel that the conflict is simply over who will be in power, not what type of country Syria will be.
Beyond this, many Syrian men's families pressured them to leave, not wanting them to fight for the same reasons. They don't feel either side is worth their children dying for. In many cases the elderly, women, children, etc. stay behind because they are not threatened with fighting, but the men have to leave to avoid forcible conscription. Additionally, with the Syrian economy collapsing, many Syrian men went abroad to work to be able to support their families.
The conflict has become extreme in the ideologies of those fighting it, as well. Fighters on the pro-government side are convinced of an existential threat to Syrian sovereignty being supported by Gulf Arabs, Turkey, and the West. Opposition fighters largely believe that the Syrian government is determined to oppress the Sunnis with the help of Shiite Iran and Hezbollah. Many Syrians simply believe this is a false dichotomy, and they want nothing to do with it. As far as they're concerned, both sides are awful, and they're better off leaving until the issue is settled one way or another. Many are simply practical, and see that they're not likely to make any difference in the outcome. Ultimately, foreign powers will probably determine the future of Syria more than individual fighters on the battlefield.
As for the morality of evading a war-zone, or any situation in general wherein lack of action would result in more suffering, I don't think value-judgements in the form of accusations of cowardice are at all helpful. The sacrifices of those who volunteered to fight and die in WWII to defend their nations, and who continue to do so elsewhere, is highly commendable. But this doesn't necessarily entail that those who choose to opt-out are immoral cowards. It just means they're normal people who want to get on with their lives like the rest of us - hardly makes them deserving of all the scorn now, does it?
Original post by Dima-Blackburn
Apologies for the delay. Admittedly I don't know much about situations from WWII you've presented, so contrasting the two conflicts is not something I could do with any authority. However, I can give you some insight into my experiences with Syrians that may help explain it.
Firstly, many Syrians simply don't feel that any side of the conflict represents their interests whatsoever. I've spoken to many Syrians that were ideologically opposed to the government, may have even participated in demonstrations against it early on, but when the situation became militarised, they found the opposition becoming more sectarian, Islamist, and incompatible with their views and beliefs. I've also spoken to those on the other side, who were generally supportive of the government or opposed to revolution against it, who nonetheless did not feel it was a government worthy of fighting for. Many Syrians I know wanted reforms, but did not want violence or war. They feel that the conflict is simply over who will be in power, not what type of country Syria will be.
Beyond this, many Syrian men's families pressured them to leave, not wanting them to fight for the same reasons. They don't feel either side is worth their children dying for. In many cases the elderly, women, children, etc. stay behind because they are not threatened with fighting, but the men have to leave to avoid forcible conscription. Additionally, with the Syrian economy collapsing, many Syrian men went abroad to work to be able to support their families.
The conflict has become extreme in the ideologies of those fighting it, as well. Fighters on the pro-government side are convinced of an existential threat to Syrian sovereignty being supported by Gulf Arabs, Turkey, and the West. Opposition fighters largely believe that the Syrian government is determined to oppress the Sunnis with the help of Shiite Iran and Hezbollah. Many Syrians simply believe this is a false dichotomy, and they want nothing to do with it. As far as they're concerned, both sides are awful, and they're better off leaving until the issue is settled one way or another. Many are simply practical, and see that they're not likely to make any difference in the outcome. Ultimately, foreign powers will probably determine the future of Syria more than individual fighters on the battlefield.
As for the morality of evading a war-zone, or any situation in general wherein lack of action would result in more suffering, I don't think value-judgements in the form of accusations of cowardice are at all helpful. The sacrifices of those who volunteered to fight and die in WWII to defend their nations, and who continue to do so elsewhere, is highly commendable. But this doesn't necessarily entail that those who choose to opt-out are immoral cowards. It just means they're normal people who want to get on with their lives like the rest of us - hardly makes them deserving of all the scorn now, does it?
Firstly, many Syrians simply don't feel that any side of the conflict represents their interests whatsoever. I've spoken to many Syrians that were ideologically opposed to the government, may have even participated in demonstrations against it early on, but when the situation became militarised, they found the opposition becoming more sectarian, Islamist, and incompatible with their views and beliefs. I've also spoken to those on the other side, who were generally supportive of the government or opposed to revolution against it, who nonetheless did not feel it was a government worthy of fighting for. Many Syrians I know wanted reforms, but did not want violence or war. They feel that the conflict is simply over who will be in power, not what type of country Syria will be.
Beyond this, many Syrian men's families pressured them to leave, not wanting them to fight for the same reasons. They don't feel either side is worth their children dying for. In many cases the elderly, women, children, etc. stay behind because they are not threatened with fighting, but the men have to leave to avoid forcible conscription. Additionally, with the Syrian economy collapsing, many Syrian men went abroad to work to be able to support their families.
The conflict has become extreme in the ideologies of those fighting it, as well. Fighters on the pro-government side are convinced of an existential threat to Syrian sovereignty being supported by Gulf Arabs, Turkey, and the West. Opposition fighters largely believe that the Syrian government is determined to oppress the Sunnis with the help of Shiite Iran and Hezbollah. Many Syrians simply believe this is a false dichotomy, and they want nothing to do with it. As far as they're concerned, both sides are awful, and they're better off leaving until the issue is settled one way or another. Many are simply practical, and see that they're not likely to make any difference in the outcome. Ultimately, foreign powers will probably determine the future of Syria more than individual fighters on the battlefield.
As for the morality of evading a war-zone, or any situation in general wherein lack of action would result in more suffering, I don't think value-judgements in the form of accusations of cowardice are at all helpful. The sacrifices of those who volunteered to fight and die in WWII to defend their nations, and who continue to do so elsewhere, is highly commendable. But this doesn't necessarily entail that those who choose to opt-out are immoral cowards. It just means they're normal people who want to get on with their lives like the rest of us - hardly makes them deserving of all the scorn now, does it?
Yes, few Syrians have actually enlisted in a military force because Syrian nationalism/patriotism is weak outside of the Alawite community. Hence why the Free Syrian Army has rapidly vanished.
Few people put all the blame of the refugee crisis on the refugees themselves, albeit many think that leaving wives and children behind is not especially brave. If I were Syrian, I would have probably tried to go to the West too. The real responsible of this mess is Angela Merkel and the other apologetic Europeans who literally called them here.
As a result, Germany is going to spend a huge sum of money on a small proportion of the Syrian population, whilst with this money they could have paid for refugee camps close to Syria and entirely rebuilt the country several times. The efficiency of such a move is limited.
Western countries should not try to solve humanitarian crisis by importing displaced people on their soil. It's extremely expensive (as shown by the figures in the OP) and ineffective as it will take several generations to fully integrate these people.
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