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RAF obliterates former Saddam palace used by ISIS

ISIS decided to shack up in the lap of luxury in one of Saddam Hussein's former palaces in Mosul. They were not only living in it, but the whole complex with its outbuildings and secondary structures was being used as a bomb factory and training area for foreign fighters.

RAF Tornados went in and dropped multiple 2,000lb laser-guided Paveway IV bombs on the palace complex.

[video="youtube;W-jPxNOoX8Y"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-jPxNOoX8Y[/video]

The city of Mosul (est. 2 million population) and its hinterlands is really ISIS only major territory left in Iraq, and it is said that morale amongst the estimated 5,000 fighters is beginning to completely break down. Commanders are regularly being executed for refusing to fight.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3656100/ISIS-executes-four-commanders-Mosul.html

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Also, the Iraqi Army supported by US forces has captured the Qayyarah Air Base south of Mosul. It's a giant base that will be used as a staging point for the final attack on Mosul. The US has sent regular forces to that base now to help protect it and assist in the fight against ISIS, including heavy artillery and Apache helicopters.

If you want a sense of the turkey shoot it will be when the Apaches start operating, take a look at this video of what they did to a Taliban unit in Afghanistan. Don't watch is you have a weak stomach or sensitive disposition

[video="youtube;hWuP6dmYOE0"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWuP6dmYOE0[/video]
So. Much. Destruction.
For a bunch of guys who claim to be fearless, IS soldiers are extraordinarily cowardly. If the soldiers of the Red Army had been anything like them, the Wehrmacht would have overrun Moscow and been pushing into Ural by 1941.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by mercuryman
So. Much. Destruction.


Indeed, isn't it terrible how ISIS have caused so much death, destruction, oppression and misery in their deluded campaign to create a caliphate.

Though I, for one, do not mourn the death of fascists who have engaged in campaigns of mass executions, mass rapes, enslavements of whole ethnic groups, publicly broadcast beheadings and torture. Ending the existence of an ISIS member is a net benefit to the human race
Original post by Prince of Punani
For a bunch of guys who claim to be fearless, IS soldiers are extraordinarily cowardly. If the soldiers of the Red Army had been anything like them the Wehrmacht would have overrun Moscow by 1941.


They're scared because they're getting absolutely slaughtered by the withering rain of Western airpower in conjunction with better-trained and equipped Kurds and Iraqis.

When ISIS was going up against the lazy, mostly untrained and unmotivated Iraqi and Syrian Armies, their human wave attacks and use of suicide car bombs as a poor man's cruise missile worked well. But now that the Kurds and Iraqis have got their **** together and can rely on Western airpower, it just becomes a turkey shoot and the ISIS members who are futilely being ordered to run straight into enemy machine gun fire are getting mowed down.

Those that aren't are being watched by a drone silently orbiting above for 30+ hours and then when they all bunk down in the building they have chosen for their quarters for the night, the drone fires a Hellfire missile and blows it to smithereens. At this point the outcome of the campaign is clear; the only question is how much of a fight they will put up and how long the mopping up operations will take.
Original post by AlexanderHam
Indeed, isn't it terrible how ISIS have caused so much death, destruction, oppression and misery in their deluded campaign to create a caliphate.

Though I, for one, do not mourn the death of fascists who have engaged in campaigns of mass executions, mass rapes, enslavements of whole ethnic groups, publicly broadcast beheadings and torture. Ending the existence of an ISIS member is a net benefit to the human race


I really don't think this is the right way to wipe them out though. Dropping bombs like this tends to cause a lot of civilian casualties and generate more excuses for them to kill us in our homes. I'm no politician by any means but surely this can't be the only way to destroy ISIS? (no linda pun intended)
I wish I lived in a house like that before it got destroyed. Seems like a pretty chill place, I hope it had a good swimming pool.
Original post by mercuryman
I really don't think this is the right way to wipe them out though. Dropping bombs like this tends to cause a lot of civilian casualties and generate more excuses for them to kill us in our homes. I'm no politician by any means but surely this can't be the only way to destroy ISIS? (no linda pun intended)


As you've probably noticed from Afghan and Iraq, ground invasions cost even more lives, both among civilian and Allied military personnel.
You probably have no idea how much work goes under to ensure civilians aren't harmed in RAF air strikes. A pilot doesn't simply fly around & chose to drop his/her ordinance wherever they feel like.
Original post by Tempest II
As you've probably noticed from Afghan and Iraq, ground invasions cost even more lives, both among civilian and Allied military personnel.
You probably have no idea how much work goes under to ensure civilians aren't harmed in RAF air strikes. A pilot doesn't simply fly around & chose to drop his/her ordinance wherever they feel like.


I wasn't talking about RAF strikes in particular, I actually admire how the british take care of civilians in war zones.

I'm talking about Russian and US airstrikes. They just seem to target places like hospitals without second thoughts.
Original post by mercuryman
I really don't think this is the right way to wipe them out though. Dropping bombs like this tends to cause a lot of civilian casualties and generate more excuses for them to kill us in our homes. I'm no politician by any means but surely this can't be the only way to destroy ISIS? (no linda pun intended)


Yes it is the only way to destroy ISIS, or at least it's a vital component of it. ISIS cannot be defeated without some form of military action taking place. Stop air strikes and you'll just see ISIS move forces around with impunity and regain a lot of the territory they've lost.

Civilian casualties for the campaign so far have been quite low, and the two recent incidents near Manbij are the exception and not the rule.
Why can no people be seen in that video? If it is being used by ISIS surely some guards would be posted.
Original post by mercuryman
I really don't think this is the right way to wipe them out though. Dropping bombs like this tends to cause a lot of civilian casualties and generate more excuses for them to kill us in our homes. I'm no politician by any means but surely this can't be the only way to destroy ISIS? (no linda pun intended)


Aristrikes are probably a good way to get them to scatter, or at least be driven into various traps set by special forces are other factions who seek to take them out.
Original post by mercuryman
I wasn't talking about RAF strikes in particular, I actually admire how the british take care of civilians in war zones.

I'm talking about Russian and US airstrikes. They just seem to target places like hospitals without second thoughts.


I totally agree with you regarding the Russians. The Americans don't do as much as the RAF do to avoid civilian casualties but they're a heck of a lot better than the Russians who don't particularly care.
Original post by Prince of Punani
For a bunch of guys who claim to be fearless, IS soldiers are extraordinarily cowardly. If the soldiers of the Red Army had been anything like them, the Wehrmacht would have overrun Moscow and been pushing into Ural by 1941.


The Wehrmacht would have probably been in Vladivostok at that pace. At its weakest phase in history, after Stalin purged the officers, the Red Army would have been 10x more combat ready than ISIS could ever be.
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by RF_PineMarten
Yes it is the only way to destroy ISIS, or at least it's a vital component of it. ISIS cannot be defeated without some form of military action taking place. Stop air strikes and you'll just see ISIS move forces around with impunity and regain a lot of the territory they've lost.


Which, as anybody with a brain will tell you, would obviously lead to far far far more civilian deaths than has been caused by the air strikes. That's not even taking into account the freedom to sexually enslave thousands more women. But people like the Stop The War Campaign and their uneducated followers object to it anyway because they're dumb like that.*
Original post by dozyrosie
Why can no people be seen in that video? If it is being used by ISIS surely some guards would be posted.


The Western coalition has a media policy not to release any strike footage where you can see people being killed. The strike was probably at night anyway, to cause maximum shock and disruption
Original post by KimKallstrom
Which, as anybody with a brain will tell you, would obviously lead to far far far more civilian deaths than has been caused by the air strikes. That's not even taking into account the freedom to sexually enslave thousands more women. But people like the Stop The War Campaign and their uneducated followers object to it anyway because they're dumb like that.*


So true, well said.
Original post by mercuryman
I really don't think this is the right way to wipe them out though. Dropping bombs like this tends to cause a lot of civilian casualties and generate more excuses for them to kill us in our homes. I'm no politician by any means but surely this can't be the only way to destroy ISIS? (no linda pun intended)
This is an extremely long post but I think it's worth it to explain to you how the Western air campaign works.

The best figures we have are that about 1,000 civilians have been killed. By contrast, around 30,000 ISIS members have been killed in our airstrikes over the last 2 years of airstrikes. Imagine how many civilians would have been killed if those 30,000 ISIS members had been allowed to live; in fact, Baghdad was about to fall when we intervened. Imagine the utter horror of ISIS sweeping into Baghdad, a city of 7.5 million mostly Shi'a (who ISIS hate and murder whenever they encounter them).

The fact that we are killing 30 ISIS members for every civilian tells you just how careful we are being. It's not like world war 2 where they sent planes over the target and just dropped the bombs and hoped they would hit. These days using targeting pods, the fighter pilot is looking through an extremely high-tech scope that even from 20,000 feet in the sky and miles away, they can see the most extraordinary detail, even like what kind of clothes someone is wearing. Using that scope they lock onto the target and then shine an invisible laser beam at it; they then drop an "LGB" bomb which has little moving wings on it and an electronic eye in its nose. The LGB homes in on that spot that the laser is illuminating, and they are extremely accurate. Even from miles away and 30,000 feet in the air, they can hit within about 5 meters of the target. This video here is a good indication of the incredible accuracy of these weapons.

[video="youtube;lPPPybddQ0A"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPPPybddQ0A[/video]

See how they hit the truck, ruined it and killed the terrorist inside, and no civilians were harmed or even near it. You also have to keep in mind that they don't just fly up to a city or battle area and randomly look for targets. To decide to have destroyed that truck in the video I showed, they would have drones that circle that area overhead continuously, sometimes for up to 35 hours at a time, just silently watching and taking everything in. It's up so high, and it's so small, that people on the ground can't hear it or see it. If they see an ISIS man on the battlefield firing at our friends the Kurds, they can use the drone to just keep an eye on him and follow him. Say after the battle they follow him back to the house where he and his fellow terrorists are staying (and of course the drone's incredible electronic eye means it can see just as well at night as in the day). The drone will survey and log all the cars around that house, and how many men are in there. It will suck up all the radio signals and mobile phone signals coming from the house, which will be translated by analyst-translators at the CIA or Defense Intelligence Agency.

Maybe in one of the radio transmissions, run through a US intelligence supercomputer recognises the voice (using voice recognition) of a an important ISIS commander, and he says to the other person "Tomorrow at first light I will come to you". So the drone watches and waits, silent and steadfast as always. and the next day it sees that guy come out of the house and get into the truck. This information is fed to a US commander who gives the order to take him out; the drone, which also carries a laser-guided missile, follows the car until it is out of town (to minimise risk to civilians) then fires its Hellfire missile at it and obliterates it. Maybe at the same time a British Typhoon is is dropping a 2,000lb laser-guided Paveway bomb on the safehouse the drone had discovered. After the strike, the drone keeps orbiting over the area (or it is running low on fuel so another comes to take his place) watching the smoking car wreck and observing happens after the strike, watching what the ISIS men are saying over their radios, probing for weakness they can exploit.

That's just an example scenario, but it gives you a sense that the airstrikes are by no means random. They are extremely well-thought through. There are literally thousands (around 6,000) of British, America, Australian (and all the other countries in the coalition) etc intelligence analysts, translators, drone-video-feed experts, targeters, air warfare strategists, Arabic culture experts, psychological warfare operators, system analysts and so on who are assigned to the anti-ISIS air campaign and every day they are analysing the battlefield, analysing ISIS, listening to and translating radio and mobile phone signals (and maybe even some hacking), building up organisational maps of how ISIS works and how it is structured, generating profiles of its top leaders and then from all that intelligence and knowledge they build up, generating lists of targets to be hit in airstrikes (which will then be followed by post-strike analysis and so the cycle continues). This process is occurring continuously, and with every strike (there are about 30 a day but sometimes up to 80), they are preparing for it, assessing the target, striking, and then assessing and analysing the effect it had and what to do next.

The other major component of the air campaign is battlefield Close Air Support (CAS). That is, we drop bombs and fire missiles at ISIS troops are directly engaging and in battle with our Kurdish and Iraqi friends and allies. We have given the Kurds and Iraqis these little battlefield scopes, and trained them in their use, that allow them to generate their own laser beam to they can just point the scope at the ISIS position, and the jet above can drop the bomb and the LGB will home in on the target just as well as if the pilot has illuminated it from above. The Kurds and Iraqis have told us that the CAS we provide them has been absolutely vital, it has made all the difference and without it the war would probably be over by now (i.e. ISIS would have won). It is absolutely essential we continue to support our Kurdish and Iraqi friends and allies, to help them rid their country of these awful theocratic fascists.

This air support, and some limited special forces and training assistance, is the least we can do. We are not fighting their war for them, but we are providing the kind of technological support that only we have the capacity to do, something that costs us very little (total cost is around $7 billion for the last 2 years; consider that just a single year of the US defence budget is $500 billion), and it is in our own interests to do so because ISIS hates us too. If we allow them to create a safe haven for themselves, we will never be safe
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by mercuryman
I really don't think this is the right way to wipe them out though. Dropping bombs like this tends to cause a lot of civilian casualties and generate more excuses for them to kill us in our homes. I'm no politician by any means but surely this can't be the only way to destroy ISIS? (no linda pun intended)


Further to my previous post, I thought I'd copy you in on the most recent daily strike report put out by CJTF (Coalition Joint Task Force, the international coalition against ISIS basically). Each day they release a report of the previous day's strikes, and it gives you a good idea of what we're up to in Iraq and Syria.

This is the daily strike report for August 4th

Syria

- Near Dayr Az Zawr, one strike destroyed 14 ISIL oil tankers.

- Near Manbij, three strikes struck two separate ISIL tactical units and destroyed an ISIL fighting position and an ISIL command and control node.

Iraq

- Near Al Qaim, one strike struck an ISIL tactical unit and destroyed an ISIL fighting position.

- Near Hit, one strike destroyed an ISIL vehicle and an ISIL ammunition cache.

- Near Qayyarah, three strikes struck two separate ISIL tactical units and destroyed 12 ISIL oil tankers, an ISIL staging facility, and an ISIL vehicle.

- Near Ramadi, one strike struck an ISIL tactical unit and destroyed an ISIL fighting position.

- Near Sinjar, one strike suppressed an ISIL mortar system.

- Near Tal Afar, two strikes struck an ISIL headquarters and an ISIL vehicle borne improvised explosive device factory.

- Near Mosul, one strike struck an ISIL tactical unit and destroyed three ISIL vehicles, an ISIL mortar system, and an ISIL command and control node.

A strike, as defined in the CJTF releases, means one or more kinetic events that occur in roughly the same geographic location to produce a single, sometimes cumulative effect for that location. So having a single aircraft deliver a single weapon against a lone ISIL vehicle is one strike, but so is multiple aircraft delivering dozens of weapons against a group of buildings and vehicles and weapon systems in a compound


Keep in mind we are doing this day-in, day-out. Imagine the effect of that kind of firepower hitting ISIS every single day, 24/7/365 with no respite. That's what we're bringing to the fight, and the fact that only 1,000 civilians have, tragically, died is a testament to how careful we have been
(edited 7 years ago)
Original post by AlexanderHam
Further to my previous post, I thought I'd copy you in on the most recent daily strike report put out by CJTF (Coalition Joint Task Force, the international coalition against ISIS basically). Each day they release a report of the previous day's strikes, and it gives you a good idea of what we're up to in Iraq and Syria.

This is the daily strike report for August 4th



Keep in mind we are doing this day-in, day-out. Imagine the effect of that kind of firepower hitting ISIS every single day, 24/7/365 with no respite. That's what we're bringing to the fight, and the fact that only 1,000 civilians have, tragically, died is a testament to how careful we have been


Woah man, I knew western warfare against ISIS was intense but I did not imagine it to be this deadly. I'm glad that ISIS is slowly getting extinct. At this rate they'll be exterminated at least within 5 or so years, no?

It makes you wonder after all these losses how they still manage to carry their morale to fight on. True we westerners face a few casualties by them every now and then (Thank god Britain has been safe during all this mess), but when we look at it hollistically they're actually getting buttraped back home.

Thanks for the explanation by the way! Repped.

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