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Who else hates the unfairness between IB and A levels

Y___

xjodiewodiex

:O And Cambridge only ask for 40 pts!? That means you could get away with an average of 3 - 4 pts! Surely that's not right ?

No, cactus_c is talking about the French baccalaureate, totally different story than IB.

Oh, my bad!

Reply 21

cactus_c

1

Y__

Can't comment on whether that's true, but as far as I understand it, the French marking system is a bit "different". In GB, you're good if you get an A, in the IB, you're good if you get a 7 (out of 7), but for the French bac, nobody ever gets 20 out of 20, do they? So you're supposed to be absolutely clever if you get 18 (mention tres bien, non?), right?

You're right, you are indeed very clever if you get mention très bien (although it is >16, not 18)
Some extremely rare people get 20/20, but really a handful per year.

Reply 22

A Stranger in Moscow

12

stephinny

is it just me that is very pissed off at how much easier A levels is....
how 3 A's is equivalent to like what...34-36 or sumthing according to UCAS
but still were asked for scores like 38-40 for some of the top schools.
cambridge is asking me 40 and its like DO YOU GET HOW HARD THAT IS!? i get 3 As isnt super super easy, but it sure as hell isnt equivalent to a 40 and a bunch of requested 7s.
who out there understands? :mad:

I think Cambridge know that too - most people I know have got offers of 4 As (and someone I know has to get 4 As, a 1 in step 1+2, and at least 90 in C1-C4)
I would prefer the IB because I like doing more than 4 subjects lol.

Reply 23

Anatheme

18

cactus_c

Yes, and from what I've heard french grading system tends to be underestimated quite often and the offers are very high compared to other grading systems.

Agreed. I received 3 differents offers which are supposed to be the equivalent of a BBB offer ...

11/20 -> lowest one, quite easy to get
13/20 -> harder
14/20 -> far harder

And it is also really difficult to deal with at least 7 compulsory subjects + options you took (give points ^^), lol.

cactus_c

You're right, you are indeed very clever if you get mention très bien (although it is >16, not 18)
Some extremely rare people get 20/20, but really a handful per year.

There are subject you'll never ever get 20/20, i.e humanities subjects, like Literature, Philosophy, Languages, Arts.

And it depends and the section you chose, but it may be easier to get a "mention" in Scientific section (I didn't say it was easier than Literary section. They do have a lot of work and it is definitely not easy) than in Literary one (because we study only humanities subjects, so impossible for us to achieve 20/20, as it can't be perfect)

Reply 24

stephinny

OP

1

Rider

No its just some universities are too lazy to actually find out how IB is too underrated and how A-levels is overrated.

THANKYOU thats exactly what its like
and trust me, you dont need to do IB AND A levels to figure out which one is more challenging.
im not dissing A levels and in NO way am i saying people who do A levels are stupid..and i get some dont have options of IB
im saying the unis should recognize the difference for the IB kids

Reply 25

cactus_c

1

Anatheme

Agreed. I received 3 differents offers which are supposed to be the equivalent of a BBB offer ...

11/20 -> lowest one, quite easy to get
13/20 -> harder
14/20 -> far harder

And it is also really difficult to deal with at least 7 compulsory subjects + options you took (give points ^^), lol.

There are subject you'll never ever get 20/20, i.e humanities subjects, like Literature, Philosophy, Languages, Arts.

And it depends and the section you chose, but it may be easier to get a "mention" in Scientific section (I didn't say it was easier than Literary section. They do have a lot of work and it is definitely not easy) than in Literary one (because we study only humanities subjects, so impossible for us to achieve 20/20, as it can't be perfect)

this may be irrelevant, but i've had a few teachers who gave a 20 on a dissert in 1ere Oo although i doubt that they would've done the same if they were grading bac essays.

Reply 26

stephinny

OP

1

xjodiewodiex

It's their choice to take IB though, so if they aren't capable of handling a wide variety then it's a bit daft to take IB in the first place.

Unis may ask for more points with IB than A-Level because A-Level is the traditional route really, may be viewed as more academic?

:O And Cambridge only ask for 40 pts!? That means you could get away with an average of 3 - 4 pts! Surely that's not right :s-smilie:

?

thats 40 points...out of 42.
a 34 is equivalent to 3As. its like doing 5-6 A levels and getting all As

Reply 27

afua12

15

I think it's fair that Oxbridge ask for 40+ points... They ask for the maximum grades possible for A level, so why should they not ask for the maximum grade on IB? I think that those applying to Oxbridge with the IB should be greatful they're asked for 38+ and not 45. They're universities for the most academic students in the country (+ internationals) it only makes sense to ask for the best possible grades, imo.

edit: other universities should be nicer :smile:

Reply 28

Y__

13

stephinny

thats 40 points...out of 42.
a 34 is equivalent to 3As. its like doing 5-6 A levels and getting all As

Now you're stretching your point a bit too far. I'm pretty sure that you can't say an IB SL course is equivalent to a full A level.

Reply 29

Hypermodern

stephinny

is it just me that is very pissed off at how much easier A levels is....
how 3 A's is equivalent to like what...34-36 or sumthing according to UCAS
but still were asked for scores like 38-40 for some of the top schools.
cambridge is asking me 40 and its like DO YOU GET HOW HARD THAT IS!? i get 3 As isnt super super easy, but it sure as hell isnt equivalent to a 40 and a bunch of requested 7s.
who out there understands? :mad:

No I don't understand, 3 A(s) may be the ucas point equivalent of an IB score but difficulty wise the universities must feel 40 is closer to what you need. It wouldn't make sense for the top universities to cut out high scoring students for simply doing the IB. Also in the school in the UK where the IB was trialled the average point score was equivalent of 5/6 As per-student, I find it hard to believe that is the actual ratio.

Quotes from the school's (Sevenoaks) website:
# 7 pupils gained the maximum 45 points for the IB Diploma
# 9 pupils gained 44 points
# 100 pupils gained diplomas with 40 or more points
# 37 pupils gained places at Cambridge or Oxford

45 points is technically 8 more than 6 As at A-level plus a Distinction in an AEA. Plus 37 Students achieving Oxbridge places mean there can't be that much unfairness.

Reply 30

afua12

15

Y__

Now you're stretching your point a bit too far. I'm pretty sure that you can't say an IB SL course is equivalent to a full A level.

45 gets 768 ucas points - that's 6 As (and an E + 8 - just to specific :P)

Reply 31

trm90

12

Y__

Now you're stretching your point a bit too far. I'm pretty sure that you can't say an IB SL course is equivalent to a full A level.

It's been statistically shown that course content is heavier in A-levels and of generally the same difficulty.

But the difference between an IB student and a A-level student is that a student who is predicted AAA is very likely to get AAA because they excel in their subjects whereas an IB student who is predicted 40 points could EASILY get 35 instead because we have to take multiple subjects, even ones which we do not excel in.

That's why it's particularly unfair for some universities to demand such high requirements for IB students. Sure, a 38 offer means that they'd still accept them with 36 points, but it's just so much easier to mess up IB exams than it is to mess up A-levels.

Reply 32

stephinny

OP

1

its difficult to prove whats harder or whats not
if u look at ucas...what teh post above me says, a top top IB score of 45, is 6 As at A level. the fact is that UCAS is saying one thing, and then universites are asking another thing. UCAS sent out an official notice comparing the IB to A levels, im not making up the figures this is what they said in it.
So tahts why it is different to ask for 3 A's, adn to as for a 40...its different according to ucas and its different according to teh student that has to get 40 then the student that has to get 3 A's. I think some people are taking this personally as if im saying that my life is way harder and everyone doing A levels has it easier.. im not saying that at all. but IB is more challening, that is recongized (ask a teacher that teaches A levels and IB..theyll tell you).
IB u have 7 varied subjects... and a mini disseratation and a TOK essay.
and getting a 7 in IB is EXTREMELY hard its not the same as getting an A on A level...my schools a good school and...for example theres only been like two 7's in the IB higher Biology class in 4 years! its very difficult to get top marks in the IB..its possible. but hard.

the universities (especially such traditional ones like oxbridge) havent quite recognized the difference with IB, i think cuz england hasnt recognized it either. A level is still the standard system, and thats fine, and IB is becoming more and more popular in england (and even teh states) and not just in international schoools. i think eventually theyll realize that asking a 40 isnt the same..or A levels will become more challenging to bridge a gap.

its been in the news and stuff how people say that getting an a in a levels these days is much easier compared to 10 years ago.

and ps. the french baccalauriate (Sp?), man i heard that is HAARD. people i know who do that...props to them.

Reply 33

furryvision

12

could someone please explain what an IB is?!

Reply 34

stephinny

OP

1

trm90

It's been statistically shown that course content is heavier in A-levels and of generally the same difficulty.

But the difference between an IB student and a A-level student is that a student who is predicted AAA is very likely to get AAA because they excel in their subjects whereas an IB student who is predicted 40 points could EASILY get 35 instead because we have to take multiple subjects, even ones which we do not excel in.

That's why it's particularly unfair for some universities to demand such high requirements for IB students. Sure, a 38 offer means that they'd still accept them with 36 points, but it's just so much easier to mess up IB exams than it is to mess up A-levels.

that is a good pooint.... many many many kids i know are preidcted like 38 or sumthing and end up getting 34....cuz when it comes to the final exams its difficult to excel in so many areas

Reply 35

stephinny

OP

1

furryvision

could someone please explain what an IB is?!

IB is liike...school system thing (how to describe).. like A levels, its wat some international schools do. and u have 6 subjects, each one is graded out of 7. you also have to do something called an Extended essay (an extensive research paper) and a Theory of knowledge essay (an essay on a...philosophical...current events...kinda class u have totake..sorta) and these two essay CAN give up to extra 3 points.

its out of 45 ...45 is an amazing grade and very rare. most kids get between 33-37 kinda range. and it lasts two years too

Reply 36

billyboymccoy

1

Maybe its because most places that do the IB are private. Private is suppose to be a better quality of education, and so they may get a bit less leeway in terms of offers compared to the standard applicant.

Reply 37

ladylish

10

For all the people who are saying we can't compare A levels and IB...well, I know people who can. There are many people at my school who were doing the IB, found it too hard, so dropped it and took up a levels instead (my school runs both) and when asked they say A levels are MUCH easier.

You jsut have to look at our course content to get why - English higher for example. I've had to read about 16 books over the last 2 years, most of which I need to know like the back of my hand. My friends who do A levels seem to do about 6 books, tops. And they get open text exams - all of our exams are closed text, or oral exams.

Also there are a gazillion ways to fail - anything from not doing 150 CAS hours (which don't even contribute extra points), to getting less than a 4 in a higher subject. Oh, and if we fail one subject, we don't get ANY qualifications. At all. How's that for pressure?

Yes it is our choice to do IB, BUT it is still massively underrated. Cambridge asking 40-42 points is the most ridiculous thing in the world - I'm predicted 35 points on the IB, and have been told that had I done A levels I would have been guaranteed AAA. People who manage to get 40-42 points are whizz kids.

A levels are still demanding, but the nature of the IB makes it immediately more demanding:

- 6 subjects (including ones we may be weak in)
- 150 CAS hours (creativity, action, service)
- TK speech
- TK essay
- Extended Essay (mini dissertation essentially)
- Have to get over 24 points overall to pass
- Have to get above a 3 in all standard subjects
- Have to get above a 4 in all higher subjects

And then there is still a huge myriad of ways to fail anyway.

Reply 38

nimaland

2

Its not only between IB and A-Levels where the diference rises though? Different types of A-Levels have different standards. For example , I have friends who did the Cambridge International Examinations A-Levels and the Edexcel A-levels, and it is widely accepted that CIE A-Levels are harder.But we all still get the same offers