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American Civil War

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Reply 20

gee_shakedown

Fillette

Hi there

An absolute essential for this topic is this, which you could rent from a library,or purchase depending on your financial situation. It's the definitive documentary series detailing the events of the American Civil War; a compilation of rare archive footage, contemporary historical comments from professors at Princeton, etc. It is incredible, I first watched it 4 years ago and was totally and utterly absorbed, it's extremely detailed factually and just worderfully retold. I would seriously recommend that you give it a go :smile:

It says the link is invalid?

Reply 21

Fillette

gee_shakedown

It says the link is invalid?

Oh dear, it isn't when I do it...But It's called The American Civil War series, and is directed by Ken Burns. Google it and it's there :smile:

Reply 22

gee_shakedown

Hi again,
I have to admit that over the Summer this has drifted to the back of my mind, I'm back at VI form on Thursday, so I need to get my head down again.
I've ordered several more books from Amazon and should hopefully get them through within the next few days.
My teacher encouraged me to look at it from a Northern angle, so instead of why the South lost, I'm doing it from the perspective why the North won, though there's not too much difference between those.
I know it sounds cheeky, but I could do with a little help to get me started (I need 20 pages of notes) eep. I did choose some main topic areas, but can anyone think of some really good thorough reasons for why the North won?
+ rep for any help :smile:

(& my eternal thanks for all that's worth)

Reply 23

largebrandon

gee_shakedown

(& my eternal thanks for all that's worth)

Personally I find that simply discussing why the North won/why the South lost seems kinda. . . well boring. I've seen tons of books and dissertations on that subject. Unless you come up with a unique hypothesis, I'd find it boring to read, as it will probably just regurgitate everything else I've read.

Try going with an approach of discussing something quite specific of the civil war, like a specific person, battle, or element of the Civil War. You can discuss the differences between the North and South in like industry, technology, generals, navy, foreign help, or whatever. I'd find that much more interesting than something broad and boring :wink:

Reply 24

Agneisse

gee_shakedown

My teacher encouraged me to look at it from a Northern angle, so instead of why the South lost, I'm doing it from the perspective why the North won, though there's not too much difference between those.

James M. McPherson's Drawn with the Sword: Reflections on the American Civil War has an article about why the Confederacy lost that we read in History (you can pretty much flip the arguments to explain why the North won, I guess). It was quite a good article, so if McPherson's one of the authors you ordered you could take a look at it.

*dusty History knowledge warning*

I agree with largebrandon that you might want to look at more specific reasons rather than generalisations like "the North had better generals" or "the North had more people" because these can often be applied both ways and are not absolute, e.g. the North did have more people and more resources, but only 100 years ago in 1776 the Americans did gain independence from the British even though the latter was far superior in military power, so it does not necessarily follow that more people = win, and Lincoln did go through quite a number of generals before landing the gems that are Grant/Sherman, so he's not necessarily a better leader than Davis who had 4 secretaries of war in 5 years (or was it 5 secretaries in 4 years). Grant + Sherman were much better than Lee in that they knew it was more of a "total war" and focused on all fronts, as opposed to Lee who was mainly in Virginia and forgot about the western parts of the South.

It might be more interesting if you narrowed the topic down to particular aspects, so you can go deeper into the issue as to why the North won. I can only find my notes on the significant battlefield victories by the North (I'm sure there will be lots more aspects), so here goes:
- Antietam, Sept 1862. This victory allowed Lincoln to issue the Emancipation Proclamation and ensured that foreign countries (the example we were given was England :rolleyes:

) will not enter the war on the South's side.
- Gettysburg/Vicksburg (Mississippi), July 1863. Allows the North the control of the Mississippi river, and forces Lee to retreat back to Virginia (he had a pretty good streak marching North previously). Check me on this, but I'm quite sure this also cut the South into half geographically, which is never good in wars.
- Sherman's capture of Atlanta, Sept 1864. Victory gave Lincoln the popularity boost to be re-elected and the war to continue. There's an argument that if the 1864 election had happened in August (pre-Atlanta) rather than November, Lincoln would have lost to a candidate that supported separating from the South/readmit them and allowing slavery.

I've used the terms "North" and "South" very irresponsibly :>.<: - more appropriate way would be to call them the "Union" and the "Confederacy". Also bear in mind that I studied this in the American North so what's taught here might be different from the UK curriculum. And I typed this at 11pm at night so it's quite jumbled up, sorry 'bout that :puppyeyes:

Good luck

Reply 25

Shadow of a Dream

gee_shakedown

(& my eternal thanks for all that's worth)

Did you see this? :smile:

Shadow of a Dream

Hello

All of the above are good, and certainly key factors in the eventual Confederate defeat.

Maybe you could widen your "resources" section? - the Union, owed to their industrialisation, had general resources superior to those of the Confederacy (production of munitions, soldiers' boots etc - key factor both in terms of the practicality of their victory, and indeed of moral amongst their troops, esp compared to those of the Conf.). I'm sure you're probably familiar with this argument already, but the Union's far superior resources are often viewed as the reason for their victory - some historians (eg; Shelby Foote) would even go so far as to suggest that a Southern defeat was never anything other than inevitable!But when asssessing this, it's worth considering the fact that, if so severly dwarfed in terms of resources, why did the South manage to hold out for so long, and how then is it possible that there were even points in the war (esp in its early days) where Confederate victory seemed likely? Some historians have also suggested that the Southern people were not sufficiently behind the war and their cause to secure victory - the same (in my opinion) was true of the Union prior to the Emancipation Proc, which granted a cause, but it might be worth considering in your essay how far this new-found Northern cause actually contributed to victory?

Leadership is certainly another key factor, and your ideas certainly seem to be in the right direction :smile:

It's worth noting contemporary perceptions of Lincoln etc though (eg; Wendell Philips called him 'a first rate, second rate man'), and the fact that, prior to Grant, his military appointments (eg; McClellan) were little more than disasterous! Also, how far can Davis and his leadership really be blamed for ultimate Confederate defeat?

Military factors should be pretty straightforward from the ideas you have :smile:

Lack of foreign intervention should also be fairly straightforward - just consider how significant this lack of intervention was. Personally, I think that this factor is one of the most crucial in terms of Confederate defeat, with evidence to suggest that the South could indeed have won the war had she managed to secure the support of Britain and the might of her Empire. It might also be interesting to consider how far one can really blame the Confederacy for not securing such support - eg; Britain at this point notoriously unwilling to involve herself in others' crises (Palmerston's remarks - 'those who in foreign quarrels do impose, will often get a bloody nose' - not sure if correctly quoted!! :redface:

).

Hope this is helpful - I know you'll be working to a word limit, so sorry if some of this info is a bit much in light of that!! The points that you outlined seem fine, and I'm sure you'll produce a good essay :smile:

You've still got a while yet anyway - I'd probably focus on honing my argument at this point (most key factor(s) for defeat?), and then find historiography/primary evidence upon which to hang it.

I hope this is useful :smile:

- as I've said before, if I can be of any more help, just say, either through this thread or PM. Good luck :smile:

This should give you something to get on with, but, as I've said before, if you do need any more help/more specific info/ideas etc, then do let me know and I'll do my best :smile:

(preferably before Oct, however, as I'll be in a uni-shaped panic by then!! :p:

).

For a straightforward analysis of reasons for victory aimed at A-level students, try and track down this book - Alan Farmer's 'The American Civil War' - contains a brilliant chapter! :smile:

Hope this is helpful, and I'm sure your essay will be brilliant :hugs:

Reply 26

gee_shakedown

Thank you for all the help everyone. I got a couple more books through today, so at the moment I have
James McPherson - Battle Cry of Freedom
David Herbert Donald - Why the North Won the Civil War
Gabor S Boritt - Why the Confederacy Lost
The Collapse of the Confederacy (Can't recall the author's name)
Thomas J. DiLorenzo - The Real Lincoln: A New Look at Abraham Lincoln, His Agenda and an Unnecessary War

I think I might have to agree with what everyone's suggested, doing a more specific topic. My teacher had suggested just looking at why the Union won, and I'd been lazy and just agreed.
I don't think I'd like to look at it from a military perspective, I find that I get slightly bored reading about that too much, so I'll probably try to approach it from the role of an individual/leadership/politics/social..etc. (although I'm not sure what to look at in light of that)

Thank you though everyone, it's been very helpful :smile:

Reply 27

gee_shakedown

Shadow of a Dream

For a straightforward analysis of reasons for victory aimed at A-level students, try and track down this book - Alan Farmer's 'The American Civil War' - contains a brilliant chapter! :smile:

Hope this is helpful, and I'm sure your essay will be brilliant :hugs:

I just ordered that book along from Amazon, managed to get it for £3.99 :smile:

Thank you for your help, it's been hard finding resources..etc on this topic!

Reply 28

Bill Shakespeare

Only on this website could you find students discussing the American Civil War.....always impressive.
i was considering a dissertation, for Advance Higher History in Scotland, into Abraham Lincoln's involvement in the war. Incredible a war from so long ago still arouses so much interest.

Reply 29

Shadow of a Dream

gee_shakedown

I just ordered that book along from Amazon, managed to get it for £3.99 :smile:

Thank you for your help, it's been hard finding resources..etc on this topic!

That's ok

, it's nice to have something to distract me from my reading list :wink:

The book might seem a bit simplistic, but as such it's really clear & straightforward, so should give you a quick insight into the key topics/historiographies, without drowning you in them!! I found it a great starting point in terms of research for essays :smile:

Reply 30

DrGonzo

The American Civil War has always interested me, although, I admit not knowing very much about it :rolleyes:

I have a copy of 'Battle Cry of Freedom' by James McPherson, but haven't really got round to reading it properly yet.

Although its a while off, I'm already considering basing my A2 c/w around this topic. I'm starting my AS-Levels this monday though, so I won't jump the gun just yet.

Reply 31

gee_shakedown

I think I'm going to do
"Was the collapse of the Confederacy inevitable" and argue that at the start of the war at least, that it wasn't
> Possibility of foreign intervention
>Precedent in history where other countries had secured independence with even greater odds (inc. just 100 years ago the American War of Independence"
> They didn't need to win, simply persuade the North that they cost of pursuing the war was too great. It's easier to fight on the defensive.
> South did have many advantages, e.g. "King Cotton" diplomacy, natural fortifications of the terrain, military tradition,
> Blockade wasn't effective until 1863, had long coastline which was difficult to blockade.
> Managed to match the Union in terms of manpower until 1864
> Strong labor force
> Good generalship
> Interior lines, ability to move forces around

Any feedback?

Reply 32

joey11223

well don't worry yourself over it, you've still got quite a while to write this thing. It depends on your College though i suppose, for example one of my friends didn't have to hand in his until easter! But generally you'll be given until Christmas to do it so don't rush yourself and forget other ways to approach the question. I'm not saying put it out of your mind until two weeks before it's due in,lol, i just mean take your time with it. One of my mates who has now left Yr13 did ok but she wanted to do hers really quickly and finished the final copy way before the deadline, but after she handed it in she started thinking of things she could have added but she hadn't really looked at her essay for weeks before the deadline because she felt it was done, were as if she'd took her time on it those new ideas would have come along before it was too late.

Reply 33

Shadow of a Dream

gee_shakedown

Sounds good :smile:

I like the question a lot - very original/interesting. Argument sounds good - I agree with each point you make.

It might also be worth considering (although I know there's a word limit to consider too!) whether, even when Northern victory looked pretty unavoidable, the Confed's collapse was actually inevitable, or whether it could have possibly survived even following a defeat? This is probably too counter-factual to get too tied up in (sorry!), but your question just made me think about it!! :o:

Personally, I think that, considering Lincoln's strength of feeling for the idea of Union even before the war (Adam I.P. Smith has even likened this to 'religious mysticism'!), in any outcome other than Confederate victory (which, as you've pointed out, was a very real possibility for rather a time!), the Confed's collapse was indeed inevitable.
Sorry, I seem to have got quite carried away with this idea, which I'm not sure is sufficiently relevant to your essay!! :o:

But I think it is an interesting aside... :giggle:

I guess your question prompts analysis of a "turning point" (although you may disagree!), at which the Confed's collapse did indeed become inevitable. You probably have your own opinions regarding where this may lie, but points to consider/contrast may be the Emancipation Proclamation; Gettysburg/Vicksburg; Sherman's campaign etc etc.

Your point about not needing to win is a good one (kind of related to my earlier waffling!) - personally I see the failure (although not sure that this is the right word to use) of the Confederacy to secure foreign assistance (esp that of Britain) as key to tilting the balance here. The magnitude of the Emancipation Proclamation is, in my view, also crucial in this respect - I think that there's certainly enough evidence to argue that this alone (by giving the war a moral focus, a "model" for the world to watch and a crusade on the part of Lincoln) made a victory (regardless of which side's) neccessary. Thus a compromise/armistice between sides so morally opposed (right vs wrong idea attached to conflict by official flagging up issue of slavery - perhaps even idea of "divine judgement" through war, as seen in earlier centuries, where God would've been seen to have endorsed the eventual victor!) could no longer be accepted - from this point, I think the Confed's fate triumph or defeat (I belive the latter!) became inevitable.

Sorry for so long and waffly a post - I hope you can derive at least some sense from it!! Sorry for the delay in replying too.

I hope, once more, that this is helpful, and that you're getting on ok with your essay :smile: