Homosexuality: Innate or Learned?

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I think some gays are innately, but not all. Although I think it's a good thing that homosexuality is completely acceptable in society, I think it's got to the point where it's over-accepted. The media commonly have gay or effeminate presenters on the TV, there's constantly people acting as gays in TV programmes, and these Gay Pride parades are always being encouraged. There is no need for Pride parades. On the whole, homosexuals in this country are accepted like everyone else and there is little significant discrimination. I think Pride parades could potentially hurt their course more than anything. It has got to the point where some people are suggesting everyone has a "gay side", and it's in every human being. I think the exposure on the TV is causing some people to become homosexuals who genuinely aren't.

I think there are homosexuals who are innately homosexual and I feel these people should be free to live their life how they choose, and have relationships freely and be subject to no discrimination. I disagree with, however, the amount a lot of gays flaunt the fact - it doesn't increase tolerance, it just makes people more intolerant. Modern society has come a long way and most people no longer hold prejudice against homosexuals, I think if someone is innately homosexual, he will discover he is and come out, with no guilt. I don't think the media should be constantly encouraging people to, as it ends up encourging people who aren't actually gay, and that's what ultimately leads to confusion.

In short, if you're homosexual, good for you and I have absolutely no problem with that, but don't impose it on other people.

Reply 41

Jace Falco

saved9901

Innate, innate, for the love of God (or maybe not) INNATE!

God hates fags?

Reply 42

emilY?

burninginme

The media commonly have gay or effeminate presenters on the TV, there's constantly people acting as gays in TV programmes, and these Gay Pride parades are always being encouraged.

Heaven forbid...

Reply 43

Jace Falco

burninginme

The media commonly have gay or effeminate presenters on the TV, there's constantly people acting as gays in TV programmes, and these Gay Pride parades are always being encouraged.

I think there are some people who make a bit too much of being gay, or try to appear gay for publicity. Graham Norton, Julian Clary, Alan Carr, John Barrowman, for example. This is entertaining to an extent, for instance Barrowman's 'gay-off' with Simon Amstell on 'Never Mind the Buzzcocks,' but I do think too much is made of it.

Reply 44

burninginme

Jace Falco

Ok, I guess I over-empahsised it a bit, but it's undeniable that homosexuality is considered somewhat fashionable and trendy, and this could encourage people who aren't actually gay. The problem is, it's not viewed as just a sexual orientation, a whole culture and fashion has been made out of it, which I personally think it wrong.

Reply 45

Jace Falco

burninginme

Ok, I guess I over-empahsised it a bit, but it's undeniable that homosexuality is considered somewhat fashionable and trendy, and this could encourage people who aren't actually gay.

I know, I was agreeing :yep:

Reply 46

saved9901

Jace Falco

God hates fags?

If I was a supporter of the death penalty I'd have Fred and his manwhorish daughter Shirley strung up by the noose :biggrin:

Reply 47

burninginme

Jace Falco

I know, I was agreeing :yep:

Sorry, so many people are so quick to jump on you on this forum for anything that could be perceived as an insult against a minority I get a bit defensive.

Reply 48

caustic87

burninginme

Ok, I guess I over-empahsised it a bit, but it's undeniable that homosexuality is considered somewhat fashionable and trendy, and this could encourage people who aren't actually gay.

Being openly gay is still quite difficult in many areas of society - when did you last hear of a gay professional footballer, for example? Or a gay rapper? And I'm not quite sure how you can encourage someone to be gay - "hey mate, have sex with men. You'll suddenly become really cool, dress really well and be like all the gay people on tv". There are plenty of gay men and women who just fancy the same sex and don't take part in any of the "scene" stuff or follow stereotypes.

To answer the question, I think it's innate but if it is a product of environment then that doesn't mean it's a choice or that it's easily changed. The price of petrol is a social construct (it's not innate to petrol to cost £1.17 a litre) but that doesn't mean that I can go 'Do you know what? I fancy paying 35p a litre today.' We need to accept that however homosexuality is developed, it is not a choice and it is beyond personal control. We also need to accept that it is absoltuely natural behaviour - happens in the animal kingdom all the time - to be held on a par with heterosexual relationships.

Reply 49

burninginme

caustic87

Being openly gay is still quite difficult in many areas of society - when did you last hear of a gay professional footballer, for example? Or a gay rapper?

Well, admittedly, football clubs are still very macho instututions, but if a professional footballer was to come out, although of course you'd get the usual piss taking, etc, I very much doubt that would prevent him from getting contracts for teams, and overall I doubt he'd be shunned providing he kept his orientation to himself and didn't flaunt it. I don't think it's as big a problem in society as some people like to make out.

Reply 50

jennyng2000

caustic87

i like that...never though about that before

Reply 51

caustic87

burninginme

How can he come out and keep his orientation to himself? That makes no sense. And why should he have to keep it to himself? Why is it ok for a straight man to go "Wow, I had sex with a really fit girl last night, she was so good" and not for a gay man to say "Met this really hot guy in a bar and the sex was awesome"?

For your reference, this was the last professional footballer to come out, nearly 18 years ago: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justin_Fashanu .

Sorry to be off topic, but I think the point needed to be made.

Reply 52

when-words-are-not-enough

I think it's learnt in some people, and innate in others.

What's REALLY annoying is the gay people who play up to camp stereotypes to fit in - it completely blurs the true nature of gay people and makes it harder for us to understand what occurs naturally and what is fake.

I'm gay and I knew I was from a young age, so I believe that my sexual desires suddenly occurred to me from within. No one ever taught me to like what I like - it just simply is. I'm not that camp either. I think everyone's different, and there isn't a cut and dry answer to this whole debate.

So I think it's useless.

Reply 53

burninginme

caustic87

Well, I don't feel the need to constantly tell reinforce to everyone I'm straight. Also, if I kept telling straight guys how many fit girls I'd laid, etc, I'm sure they'd eventually get pissed off. I feel no need to tell everyone about my sexuality, and if gays are so similar to straights, why should they feel the need to do otherwise? I keep my sexuality to myself, howeve, if someone asks my orientation, I will tell them I'm straight and leave it at that. I don't see why a homosexual can't do the same. I wouldn't go telling homosexuals about my experienes with hot women as I'm sure most of them wouldn't be particularly interested to hear, and the same goes for straight men hearing about homosexual mens experiences. To be perfectly honest, shouting about how you had sex with fit men and women is pretty uncouthed behaviour on the part of both orientations.

And in reference to the footballer you posted, it sounds like his main problems were sexually assaulting 17 year old boys rather than being a homosexual...

Reply 54

caustic87

burninginme

I keep my sexuality to myself, howeve, if someone asks my orientation, I will tell them I'm straight and leave it at that. I don't see why a homosexual can't do the same.

And in reference to the footballer you posted, it sounds like his main problems were sexually assaulting 17 year old boys rather than being a homosexual...

Most homosexuals do that. But the way you said 'keep his oreintation to himself' made it sound like he shouldn't talk about his boyfriend, or mention his relationships at all unless he's directly asked. I agree that it's a bit vulgar to brag about sex lives so bad example, but would be be able to say 'I saw that film with my boyfriend, he really liked it but I didn't', or would that be going too far?

Actually, he was proven innocent. Although he seems to have been a tragic victim of another untrue assumption people often make about homosexuals - that they are more likely to be sex offenders. There was also a passage that stated he found it difficult to get a contract after coming out.

Reply 55

burninginme

caustic87

So just because you're proven innocent means you not guilty? The justice system isn't flawless. You seem to be suggesting that that because he's gay he's incapable of being a sexuall abusing someone, he could have found it too much living with the guilt of it. Also, I don't see a problem at all with saying you saw a film with your boyfriend, I didn't mean keep it to yourself constantly, I just meant not constantly bringing the fact up unnessesarily, but that goes for all orientations.

Reply 56

robbo3045

There have been so many discussions on the TSR about this. And they always prove that unfortunately there is no answer to the question just an assumption that we make. I truly believe that being gay is innate. Something that can not be learned. But in some families 'more encouraged' than in others. E.g. My father would never have let me play with Barbies etc But I dont think letting a kid play with dolls changes anything about them or their future sexuality. It is more a decision they make because they are born more feminine. If you look at some camp characters, you can tell by their bone structure that they were born with feminine characteristics. And that should be perfectly accepted. What I find annoying is the Camp for Show trend that sweeps accross gay scenes, where being gay and talking about everything to do with being gay becomes obsessive. Some of which I do not believe really have this campness inside of them, it is just an act. I am not sure why this happens.

Reply 57

bartal

I didn't mean for this thread to come to a conclusion, actually. I just want to hear people's opinions about this and have an actual discussion to see different peoples' points of view so I could see both sides of the argument clearly.

And when I said "learned", I didn't mean that you would actually LEARN it like you would maths or science... I guess that was my mistake, but I meant more that it would be something that the environment would have influenced you to - or in other words, that your sexual orientation wouldn't have been biological/genetic/innate. And it doesn't necessarily have to be directly related to how accepted homosexuality is in your general community.

I think this thread went kind of off-topic somewhere...