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Outline the reasons why peace between Israel and the Palestinians has been difficult

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PeeWeeDan

5. The moderator allocated each side of the discussion a time limit, it was just Erdogan's side had more members, so the time was divided between them, while the pro-Israel side had no-one but Peres himself.

what do u mean Erdogan's side??

there was the UN guy, the Turkish PM, the Arab representitive and the Israeli PM..

just becuz Israel attacked UN schools doesnt make them on Erdogan's side..

obviously everyone deserved equal amounts of time but it wasnt to be..

Reply 61

dave180

PeeWeeDan

Anti-Israeli ignorant assholes. Double alliterations and dime a dozen.

So just accept it, just take the rockets... like the US or UK would... right??

Also...

"Under cover of intense artillery fire, some Israeli forces reached the Litani River, which is some 20 to 30 kilometers inside Lebanon, Israeli military officials said Saturday evening.[5] Meanwhile- on August 11-12, Israeli troops engaged Hezbollah fighters on a hill in the Battle of Wadi Saluki."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Litani_offensive

Why would we want to go any further than Litani?

The UK would not retaliate in anything like the way Israel would. We learnt from the conflict in Northern Ireland that for every freedom fighter you kill, you will create more hatred towards you and therefore there will be more freedom fighters the next time. And now things seem to be going better. Notice there's no concrete wall around Northern Ireland, by the way.

Reply 62

Bateman

PeeWeeDan

Oh my god.

Can you people read? Good lord... Even Bateman agree's that the Palestinians broke the ceasefire, and those points are mostly ridiculous... and totally ignore the Palestinians negative actions... good lord I think I may have a stroke at the idiocy here...

Do i?

Israel breached the cease fire conditions.

Reply 63

PeeWeeDan

ibs137

You've just said it. Arab Representative, and Erdogan... they have their time equal to that of Pere's time, but between 2 people. I can't remember whether there were more on that side, but it explains the difference in time. And the UN later removed it's complaint that we attacked UN buildings which were not used a terrorist bases as false and apologized.

Reply 64

PeeWeeDan

Bateman

Do i?

Israel breached the cease fire conditions.

AFTER the Palestinians did... I thought you would know that. The Palestinians broke the ceasefire on June 24th, 6 days after the ceasefire started...

Reply 65

steed999

PeeWeeDan

Seriously man, what would you do, as Prime Minister of Israel.

-give the right to return-people with no link to that land are allowed to move to israel because they are jewish but the indeginous population cannot)
-abandon all illegal settlements

this is a start and there is plenty more to be done on the way

ps-if your reply with "the arabs/hamas want to drive us to the sea" then thats not true

Reply 66

Bateman

PeeWeeDan

Seriously man, what would you do, as Prime Minister of Israel.

I would

1. recognise Hamas
2. remove ALL settlers
3. lift the blockade whilst monitoring what goes in and out
4. Either send Israelie soldiers to the egypt/gaza border or call the UN to monitor what goes in.
5. Sit down and talk with Hamas and help them get rid of the extreme fractions
6. give carrots instead of sticks to palestinians
7. show them how diplomacy is the way forward and not rockets.
8. Send more spies into gaza, if anyone fires rockets, kill them using said spies instead of killing them + their women and children.
9. Talk with Iran

Reply 67

james303

steed999

http://www.fas.org/irp/world/para/docs/880818a.htm

'Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will

obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it.' (Preamble)

The Exclusive Moslem Nature of the Area:

----------------------------------------

'The land of Palestine is an Islamic Waqf [Holy Possession]

consecrated for future Moslem generations until Judgment Day. No one

can renounce it or any part, or abandon it or any part of it.'

(Article 11)

'Palestine is an Islamic land... Since this is the case, the

Liberation of Palestine is an individual duty for every Moslem

wherever he may be.'

So if you don't think Hamas want to destroy Israel, then you are extremely arrogant

Reply 68

PeeWeeDan

steed999

Settlements(under international law, since we occupied the West Bank after a defensive war, are legal, just not very nice) disbanding could happen, but is essentially expelling 300,000 people from their houses. Why not simply just incorporate them into Israel while compensating a future Palestinian state with other parts of Sovereign Israel? Your first point makes no sense, but I assume you mean remove the right of return law... You do realize this law is present in over 20 countries including France and Germany, but you exclusively want it removed in Israel and no where else... because it is a JEWISH right of return. Is that not anti-semitism?

Oh and I would advise you read the Hamas charter, Hamas DOES want to drive us into the sea. But of course you reserve your criticism for the Jews. Hamas is genocidal - just because they lack the capabilities does not mean they are more moral.

Reply 69

Bateman

PeeWeeDan

AFTER the Palestinians did... I thought you would know that. The Palestinians broke the ceasefire on June 24th, 6 days after the ceasefire started...

No, a fraction broke the ceasefire and Hamas clashed with the fraction too.

just look at the statistics, Hamas fired no rockets during the ceasefire and Israel admits it.

Reply 70

PeeWeeDan

Bateman

No, a fraction broke the ceasefire and Hamas clashed with the fraction too.

just look at the statistics, Hamas fired no rockets during the ceasefire and Israel admits it.

Hamas is responsible for the entire strip. If a reserve soldier fired a rocket at Israel, Hamas would hold Israel responsible. And I doubt none of the several hundred rockets were Hamas.

Reply 71

james303

Bateman

Quick point on number 8

The Children and Wife of the Terrorist are ordered or want to be him when he is killed.

There was a story of a daughter who escaped before her father's house was destroyed and lost her family. She told the media that the rest of her family wanted to die with her father as 'Martyrs'

Reply 72

Folderol

ibs137

just becuz Israel attacked UN schools doesnt make them on Erdogan's side..

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1061189.html

---

This is ridiculous, I feel sorry for the OP. Whoever keeps using CNN to justify that Israel broke the ceasefire is a big fat huge fail.

Reply 73

danielf90

Bateman

I would

1. recognise Hamas

err...I probably largely agree.

2. remove ALL settlers

Disagree if you're talking immediately. What if Hamas take over the WB and turn into Gaza. Then instead o 20% of israelis being under rocket fire, you would have 95% of israelis under rocket fire.

I support the disengagement from the settlements WHEN israel can be assured their security.

3. lift the blockade whilst monitoring what goes in and out

Agree but every time Israel does that, the border crossing are attacked. BUT israel should be less heavy handed.

4. Either send Israelie soldiers to the egypt/gaza border or call the UN to monitor what goes in.

As if Egypt would let that happen? + the UN are useless.

5. Sit down and talk with Hamas and help them get rid of the extreme fractions

Agreedm in principle.

6. give carrots instead of sticks to palestinians
7. show them how diplomacy is the way forward and not rockets.

Agreed. Agreed.

8. Send more spies into gaza, if anyone fires rockets, kill them using said spies instead of killing them + their women and children.

Already tried. The spies are killed by Hamas PLUS you don't get to the root cause of the problem.

9. Talk with Iran

Well yes, that would be great.

Reply 74

PeeWeeDan

Bateman

Recognize and negotiate with a terrorist group who's only goal is your destruction due to a religion. What's to discuss? The method of execution? And opening the borders=more advanced rockets, removing settlers=expelling 300,000 people, giving carrots=giving opportunities to fire rocekts, sending spies=new opportunity for people to criticize us, talk with Iran=brick wall.

Reply 75

mushroomloves

this whole 'debate' has effectively demonstrated quite possibly the biggest reason as to why achieving peace has been so difficult... :shot:

Reply 76

Bateman

danielf90

Disagree if you're talking immediately. What if Hamas take over the WB and turn into Gaza. Then instead o 20% of israelis being under rocket fire, you would have 95% of israelis under rocket fire

But didn't you say this?

Already tried. The spies are killed by Hamas PLUS you don't get to the root cause of the problem.

As if Egypt would let that happen? + the UN are useless.

Egypt is ran by a puppet, but tell them to either do a better job or you'll send the idf. But obviously what we really need is for the UN to go there. They may be useless but they can tell the difference between medical supplies, food, clothes etc. from rockets.

Already tried. The spies are killed by Hamas PLUS you don't get to the root cause of the problem.

Yes, but Israelies aren't going to be happy if Israel does nothing are they?
We can't stop the rocket fire over night, it's a long term solution and Israelies want to see something done too. This way, you're killing the people who are firing the rockets and not civillians.

Reply 77

Bateman

mushroomloves

this whole 'debate' has effectively demonstrated quite possibly the biggest reason as to why achieving peace has been so difficult... :shot:

Yep, if you look to the post above yours, you can see peeweedan, he is similar to 90% of israelies who are racist and want nothing but the destruction of palestinians.

If i were you i'd talk about that.

If not, talk about democracy, Israels democracy, and Gazas lack of.

Reply 78

mushroomloves

Bateman

haha thanks :biggrin:

Reply 79

Bateman

mushroomloves

haha thanks :biggrin:

Np, Hamas wants the desctruction of Israel, but the palestinians don't.
And Israelies want the destruction of Gaza, and because they have a democracy, they vote for the candidate who promises harsh retaliation.

Israelies are the most racist people in the world, you would have thought that after the holocaust, they wouldn't be, but the opposite has happend, in a way, they want revenge.