"Arts" Subjects and Medcine Poll

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Reply 40

Chocolatey Goodness

crazyhelicopter

No **** sherlock!?!

someone is having a bad day.

crazyhelicopter

Why do you think us medics spend so much time telling people that maths and physics aren't essential.

there is no need to speak like that. I am a medic too you know.

Reply 41

Comp_Genius

Maths and Physics are very important for medicine.

It is scary if a doctor can't use differential equations for pharmacodynamics, simple equations for membrane potentials and anisotropic wave propagation, and statistics for empirical medically-related research.

Reply 42

visesh

Comp_Genius

The last time I saw a practising medic having to do anything more complicated than simple arithmetic or read a dosing chart (which at times can be pretty tricky, when time is of the essence) was....never. I agree that being able to understand the fundamentals as a student is crucial, but after a certain point, the specifics become less important while the basic concepts do not. One thing doctors definitely do need, as you've pointed out, is the ability to understand and more importantly, interpret research data.

Reply 43

Philosoraptor

Chocolatey Goodness

someone is having a bad day.

:eek:

there is no need to speak like that. I am a medic too you know.

You are also a gimp. :biggrin:

Reply 44

Elles

Comp_Genius

It is scary if a doctor can't use differential equations for pharmacodynamics, simple equations for membrane potentials and anisotropic wave propagation, and statistics for empirical medically-related research.

I have no idea what a differential equation is. Better warn my medical school before August! Or perhaps the Foundation School induction course is actually going to be A level Maths in a week... :eek3:

I did (2003 matric):
AS: Physics
A2: Biology, Chemistry, History, English Literature & General Studies
AEA: Biology

Reply 45

Chocolatey Goodness

Philosoraptor

You are also a gimp. :biggrin:

Reply 46

Renal

Comp_Genius

Why would a clinician ever need to do any of that? Have you even been into a hospital?

Reply 47

bambii

You don't need A level maths to do differential equations, they're on my additional maths GCSE at the moment. While I can't say I've ever worked in a hospital (seeing as I have to admit I'm still doing GCSEs), I fail to see any use for differential equations in real life, so it seems unlikely you'd need to use them as a doctor...

Reply 48

Comp_Genius

visesh

Yes I agree, you reiterated my point more clearly than I have previous put it: whilst it is very important that a doctor at some point in his medical career knew all the fundamentals of basic medical physiology. Yes the point is the ability to analyse current findings, whether experimental or clinical, using first principles. The following paper illustrates the dangers of not questioning the underlying assumptions of membrane potential calculation, which no doubt, is one of the most important basic concepts in medicine:

everybody up till two years back, and all medical students up to today, have been taught to calculate membrane potentials using current summation, whilst empirically one can also do so from charge difference.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17129600?ordinalpos=1&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_DefaultReportPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

Elles

I did (2003 matric):
AS: Physics
A2: Biology, Chemistry, History, English Literature & General Studies
AEA: Biology

Sounds good! I think an Arts subject is very helpful for medicine, if you happen to be on a course with a strong emphasis on essays.

Renal

Why would a clinician ever need to do any of that? Have you even been into a hospital?

He does not need to do it per se, but one should expect he understands the underlying fundamental concepts and not merely follows guidelines slavishly without thinking.

Yes I have been in a hospital actually. Mind basic principles about wave propagation were important in procedures for curing cardiac arrhythmogenesis.

Reply 49

Renal

Comp_Genius

So if you're in an arrhythmia you want me, or someone like me, to watch it evolve over time and go "ah, that's a pretty waveform". Of would you prefer some DC?

Reply 50

username43584

Comp_Genius

If they are so important, they would be required by every single medical school. As it stands, they aren't.

Stats is the only thing that is taught in any depth on my medical course, which is a rather traditional one at that. Membrane potential and pharmacodynamics equations are touched on, but merely to present fundamental concepts in an alternative way (ie. some people understand an equation much better than a long explanantion) I don't see any advantage in learning complex equations if you have no interest in in-depth pure science research. Most doctor-researchers I've met have hired statisticians for their research, and have only a basic understanding of how to read a research paper, rather than an ability to generate the numbers themselves.

I have a very good grasp of most of the concepts that are taught, and have no maths qualifications beyond GCSE maths so I don't believe that knowledge of complex maths and physics are everything.

Reply 51

Fluffy

Renal

Of would you prefer some DC?

I don't think diet Coke is gonna do much in that situation...

(why do smilies not work for me anymore????)

Reply 52

Renal

Fluffy

I don't think diet Coke is gonna do much in that situation...

(why do smilies not work for me anymore????)

'Cos TSR is ****.

Diet Coke break might change your rhythm hon, but probably ain't going to slow you down. :p:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdrE1VMxzoE

Reply 53

Fluffy

lol!! It'll be bad! Apparently it contains 'lots' of adrenaline precursor... Or so the dozy GP Reg tried to tell my boyf when she refused to prescribe him the epipen A&E suggested... "I don't issue them, they;re dangerous (no ***** darlink), if you feel your airways closing, go and get yourself a can of diet coke" Scary. Very Scary.

Reply 54

lotusx

i voted...but on behalf of all the medical students i know in this country. so i'm not trying to be eager/an imposter/infernally stupid.

Reply 55

ThisLittlePiggy

I was a Scottish applicant and as such my situation is different from yours. However, out of my original 5 highers, two where arts subjects; Latin and English. The following year I took Classical studies as well as two sciences. So, three in total and all where needed to gain a place.

Reply 56

Becca-Sarah

I've covered membrane potentials this year and never heard of any equations that required anything more than shoving the numbers in. Certainly nothing requiring A Level maths, or even GCSE...

Reply 57

terpineol

Becca-Sarah

I've covered membrane potentials this year and never heard of any equations that required anything more than shoving the numbers in. Certainly nothing requiring A Level maths, or even GCSE...