[edanon]

I was just reading an article and came across this statistic:

"However, about 10,000 women die yearly from honour killings in Pakistan, according to statistics."

link

Thats ******* insane! What kind of ****** up country would allow that? Seriously, whether they allow it legally or allow it through poor law enforcement it's still pretty ******.

The thing is, i think this kind of culture reflects Islamic texts well. The one thing these extremists have going for them is that they actually interpret their religious texts correctly. They interpret them for what they actually are, they don't twist the words and they can see clearly that they are homophobic, racist, sexist so on and so forth, and they are fine with that. They are truly muslim but that is not a good thing.

On the other hand you have the majority of Christians twisting the words of the bible to all sorts of lengths. Rarely do you hear about Christian related killings. Most western Christians are a product of society abandoning faith. They are caught between trying to accept the logical ideas of modern times and trying to obey God. Something which cannot be done with ease... hence you have gay priests so on and so forth.

The same goes for the majority of western muslims. They are half way between accepting modern culture/logic and obeying their religion.

I don't think Muslims in this country are better Mulsims than the extremists in other countries. Extremists actually mirror the cruelty and ******** that is Islam. They are true Muslims but worse people. Muslims in this country are better people but worse Muslims.

So, religious people in western society are torn between logic. They are not reflecting what the Bible/Qur'an requires of them completely and instead are a mixture of modern ideas and old religion.

You should not try and mix the two. Either adhere to religion or don't. Religious texts are very clear in their hate and violence so you either practice it or you abandon it.

For this reason i'm against the introduction of Islam to the UK. Why would Muslims want to mix their strict Islamic laws/religion with Britains liberal understanding of the world? You just end up with a watered down nonsense. We should either have a completely extremist religious country or a non-religious one. Although i doubt the former would be easily accepted some how.

I'm all for new cultures being introduced to Britain, but not religion/laws.

You can flame me now.

[Earl Nuce]

Statistics from the 'Toronto Sun' - I wouldn't get too worked up about them.

[edanon]

Originally Posted by Earl Nuce

Statistics from the 'Toronto Sun' - I wouldn't get too worked up about them.

Regardless of how correct those statistics are its still bound to be in the thousands and is still outrageous. Imagine that happening in the UK.

[GodspeedGehenna]

Originally Posted by Link

However, about 10,000 women die yearly from honour killings in Pakistan, according to statistics.

It annoys me when newspapers cite "statistics" as their source. Why bother?

[Earl Nuce]

I agree honour-killing is wrong.
Religious texts can be dangerous figures of authority when interpreted in the wrong way.

[edanon]

Originally Posted by Earl Nuce

I agree honour-killing is wrong.
Religious texts can be dangerous figures of authority when interpreted in the wrong way.

No, as i said above, they can be dangerous figures of authority when interpreted in the right way.

[yusufu]

Honour killing is wrong. Taking a religion that doesn't allow it and claiming it does is also wrong.

[typiin]

Originally Posted by yusufu

Honour killing is wrong. Taking a religion that doesn't allow it and claiming it does is also wrong.

But the religion does allow it. Shameful how many people still accept islamic pigs.

[yusufu]

Originally Posted by typiin

But the religion does allow it. Shameful how many people still accept islamic pigs.

Except that it doesn't. The article itself has a quote saying "it's a cultural practice more than a religious practice".

[edanon]

Originally Posted by yusufu

Honour killing is wrong. Taking a religion that doesn't allow it and claiming it does is also wrong.

Are you sure? Or is that just your interpretation of the texts? Most religious texts are definetly on the side of violence and prejudice, if not murder for petty crimes.

[v-zero]

Less ridiculous and more interesting a question is:
Why do so many people think anything written within ancient scripture is valid today? Why are science, economy and morality redefined with the turning of the centuries, yet Religion is allowed to hold fast to its outmoded ways?

[edanon]

And then people come along and go "oh no thats just a metaphor for something else, it doesn't really mean we should kill gay people."

How about the whole bloody book is one big metaphor for bullcrap?

[JMonkey]

Originally Posted by edanon

Are you sure? Or is that just your interpretation of the texts? Most religious texts are definetly on the side of violence and prejudice, if not murder for petty crimes.

Islam doesn't encourage honour killing anywhere in the texts, any more than Jesus thought it was a great idea to kill people and invade their lands for not being Christian. Religions are all pretty much corrupted way beyond what they are, but in this case its just ****** up backward stone age culture, being implemented by idiots for idiots.

[edanon]

Originally Posted by v-zero

Less ridiculous and more interesting a question is:
Why do so many people think anything written within ancient scripture is valid today? Why are science, economy and morality redefined with the turning of the centuries, yet Religion is allowed to hold fast to its outmoded ways?

Strict indoctrination from father to son from birth to death.

That is the reason Christianity is so wishy-washy in modern times... because all those fat American Baptists are too tempted by modern luxuries to really adhere to the Bible.

The Islamic faith however has brainwashing down to more of a tee. Their family is often completely structured around it... hard to escape from.. and so the religion continues through centuries hardly changing, accept for when it encounters western life, as you can see in Britain.

[yusufu]

Originally Posted by edanon

Are you sure? Or is that just your interpretation of the texts? Most religious texts are definetly on the side of violence and prejudice, if not murder for petty crimes.

Regardless of what I think, the fact that you don't actually know that what you claim in your first post is or is not true leads me to disbelieve it.

[edanon]

Originally Posted by JMonkey

Islam doesn't encourage honour killing anywhere in the texts, any more than Jesus thought it was a great idea to kill people and invade their lands for not being Christian. Religions are all pretty much corrupted way beyond what they are, but in this case its just ****** up backward stone age culture, being implemented by idiots for idiots.

I suppose i don't know enough about the Qur'an to really know for sure... but if it doesn't directly tell people to commit honour killings, it obviously incites hatred and violence, as does the Bible.

Trying to live a liberal British life while following religion is impossible without bending the words and notions portrayed by religious texts.

[edanon]

Originally Posted by yusufu

Regardless of what I think, the fact that you don't actually know that what you claim in your first post is or is not true leads me to disbelieve it.

I know that extremists interpret the Qur'an as telling them to commit extremist activities or at the very least urging them to. From my general understanding of the Bible and the Qur'an it seems that they have come away with a better understanding of it than the liberal Muslims you find in Britain.

If you are going to try and interpret the Qur'an (or bible) then it is pretty obvious that you would come away with a lot of violent/hateful ideas as opposed to peace and freedom.

[yusufu]

Originally Posted by edanon

I know that extremists interpret the Qur'an as telling them to commit extremist activities or at the very least urging them to. From my general understanding of the Bible and the Qur'an it seems that they have come away with a better understanding of it than the liberal Muslims you find in Britain.

If you are going to try and interpret the Qur'an (or bible) then it is pretty obvious that you would come away with a lot of violent/hateful ideas as opposed to peace and freedom.

I suggest you post your thoughts/questions in the D&D Theology forum.

[ToastyCoke]

BAH...religion.

[aster100]

If it's so deeply entrenched within the culture, why are the more moderate Muslims, or those who follow the Islamic texts accurately and virtuously, so quiet about such heinous acts? I'm very sure that it is not anywhere stated within the Qur'an, however surely these statistics and growing recognition of these crimes must act as an impetus for good Muslims to do something about it. If whole countries adopt this kind of culture, then those countries which claim to be "Islamic states" are not really Islamic at all, simply barbaric.