[tyt93]

Hi everyone.

Ive got offers from Nottingham and Bristol to do LLB but I would need some advice!

I understand that the difference between these 2 universities is almost negligible. However, taking into consideration the 2 factors stated below, which do you think would be a better choice?

1) International standing of the uni (as I'm an international student and would be looking to developing my career outside UK) From league tables, it seems that Bristol has an edge over Nottingham.
2) Degree classification. I want to get a 2.1 at the bare minimum. But Nottingham only awards 5% 1st class honours and 56% 2nd class honours and Bristol awards 5% 1st class honours and 72% 2nd class honours. The statistics in both uni are pretty worrying, but it seems that Bristol is better, relatively at least.

I am in need of advice desperately so please help! Many thanks!

[viix]

(Original post by tyt93)
Hi everyone.

Ive got offers from Nottingham and Bristol to do LLB but I would need some advice!

I understand that the difference between these 2 universities is almost negligible. However, taking into consideration the 2 factors stated below, which do you think would be a better choice?

1) International standing of the uni (as I'm an international student and would be looking to developing my career outside UK) From league tables, it seems that Bristol has an edge over Nottingham.
2) Degree classification. I want to get a 2.1 at the bare minimum. But Nottingham only awards 5% 1st class honours and 56% 2nd class honours and Bristol awards 5% 1st class honours and 72% 2nd class honours. The statistics in both uni are pretty worrying, but it seems that Bristol is better, relatively at least.

I am in need of advice desperately so please help! Many thanks!

Why are the statistics worrying? Surely it shows that both universities are not subject to grade inflation, a road that many unis seem to be taking to improve their league table rankings... You shouldn't base your decision on that.

Oxbridge have such a high number of firsts because the students are simply of that calibre. Some of the other top law uni's that have an equal (sometimes exceeding) percentage of firsts are a little questionable...

I firmed Nottingham and someone asked a similar question at the law open day and it seemed pretty clear they marked according to achievement and not in order to boost their percentage of firsts. Which, for me, was appealing as I guess it's more of an achievement.

Both are pretty much the same. Ultimately it's your decision, surely you should be able to make it yourself? People on here seem to really need the reassurance.

[Tsunami2011]

(Original post by viix)
Why are the statistics worrying? Surely it shows that both universities are not subject to grade inflation, a road that many unis seem to be taking to improve their league table rankings... You shouldn't base your decision on that.

Oxbridge have such a high number of firsts because the students are simply of that calibre. Some of the other top law uni's that have an equal (sometimes exceeding) percentage of firsts are a little questionable...

I firmed Nottingham and someone asked a similar question at the law open day and it seemed pretty clear they marked according to achievement and not in order to boost their percentage of firsts. Which, for me, was appealing as I guess it's more of an achievement.

Both are pretty much the same. Ultimately it's your decision, surely you should be able to make it yourself? People on here seem to really need the reassurance.

Sounds like you've been suckered in. Something is clearly amiss, You can't surely believe that the majority of people with firsts from LSE, UCL, King's,etc gain this grade because of 'grade inflation' (around 12% of students get firsts). etc and would be incapable of getting firsts at Nottingham where the standards are supposedly 'tougher'. The next step will be to say that Nottingham has the hardest law course in the country. Grade inflation might play a part, but so will many other factors. It is natural to be concerned about the low amount of firsts/2:1 handed out, for many going to law school is just a means to an end.

[michael321]

(Original post by Tsunami2011)
Sounds like you've been suckered in. Something is clearly amiss, You can't surely believe that the majority of people with firsts from LSE, UCL, King's,etc gain this grade because of 'grade inflation' (around 12% of students get firsts). etc and would be incapable of getting firsts at Nottingham where the standards are supposedly 'tougher'. The next step will be to say that Nottingham has the hardest law course in the country. Grade inflation might play a part, but so will many other factors. It is natural to be concerned about the low amount of firsts/2:1 handed out, for many going to law school is just a means to an end.

Hmm I know we have disagreed on this before, but I would be inclined to be sceptical of the figures. For such a respected law school to be giving out double the 2.2s of everywhere else good seems rather odd. I suppose degree classification statistics are more likely to be accurate, but certainly Unistats' "employability" section gives some hilarious results.

I'd be interested to see some stats for this year's outgoing students, and those in former years, to see if this is some kind of error or anomaly. If it is the case then it does suggest something wrong with the teaching.

[viix]

(Original post by Tsunami2011)
Sounds like you've been suckered in. Something is clearly amiss, You can't surely believe that the majority of people with firsts from LSE, UCL, King's,etc gain this grade because of 'grade inflation' (around 12% of students get firsts). etc and would be incapable of getting firsts at Nottingham where the standards are supposedly 'tougher'. The next step will be to say that Nottingham has the hardest law course in the country. Grade inflation might play a part, but so will many other factors. It is natural to be concerned about the low amount of firsts/2:1 handed out, for many going to law school is just a means to an end.

Calm down.

Grade inflation plays a part, you'd be a fool to suggest otherwise. Nottingham's notoriously stingy with firsts, always has been and probably always will be. My point was that the percentage of firsts shouldn't deter you from choosing a university, people should have confidence in their own ability. If the teaching in Nottingham was so poor it wouldn't be rated so highly.

honestly, I don't understand the "keyboard warriors" on this site. Your opinion isn't law, and neither is mine. The difference is for some reason, judging by your previous posts, you seem to think yours is.

I could have bet my right arm that you would have something to say about my post and I honestly don't care. Pride comes before a fall. I was offering advice because I'd visited Nottingham and someone had asked a similar question.

I didn't post to be attacked.

[Tsunami2011]

(Original post by viix)
Calm down.

Grade inflation plays a part, you'd be a fool to suggest otherwise. Nottingham's notoriously stingy with firsts, always has been and probably always will be. My point was that the percentage of firsts shouldn't deter you from choosing a university, people should have confidence in their own ability. If the teaching in Nottingham was so poor it wouldn't be rated so highly.

honestly, I don't understand the "keyboard warriors" on this site. Your opinion isn't law, and neither is mine. The difference is for some reason, judging by your previous posts, you seem to think yours is.

I could have bet my right arm that you would have something to say about my post and I honestly don't care. Pride comes before a fall. I was offering advice because I'd visited Nottingham and someone had asked a similar question.

I didn't post to be attacked.

How on earth did I attack you? I disagreed with what you said so expressed it. You should probably get used to being challenged, I'm not sure why on TSR the thought of someone disagreeing with you is such a big deal. The poster is entitled to worry about the numbers of firsts handed out.

Grade inflation plays a part, you'd be a fool to suggest otherwise.

Your opinion isn't law, and neither is mine. The difference is for some reason, judging by your previous posts, you seem to think yours is.

Pot calling the kettle black ring a bell?

[viix]

(Original post by Tsunami2011)
How on earth did I attack you? I disagreed with what you said so expressed it. You should probably get used to being challenged, I'm not sure why on TSR the thought of someone disagreeing with you is such a big deal. The poster is entitled to worry about the numbers of firsts handed out.





Pot calling the kettle black ring a bell?

Yep, of course you're completely right.

[Tsunami2011]

(Original post by viix)
Yep, of course you're completely right.

Thanks, that means the world to me.

[student1337]

Anyone have access to the Times Good University Guide 2013 law league tables?

[thelawstudent]

(Original post by student1337)
Anyone have access to the Times Good University Guide 2013 law league tables?

all rankings are bull especially for law. in last year's league table (forgot which one) manchester and leeds came 40th whereas sussex came about 14th - yeah (all great unis ofc!).. so i'll just go firm sussex and insure manchester, that ok?

[nulli tertius]

(Original post by thelawstudent)
all rankings are bull especially for law. in last year's league table (forgot which one) manchester and leeds came 40th whereas sussex came about 14th - yeah (all great unis ofc!).. so i'll just go firm sussex and insure manchester, that ok?

Of course it is OK providing you are not wanting to work in Africa or Asia where the Manchester brand is much more highly regarded. If you go to Sussex, the statistics show that you are much more likely to be happy with your course.

[supelly]

so how about uni of lancaster??Is lancaster good for law ? To compared with Leicester or Manchester ,which one is the best??someone answer me please

[roh]

(Original post by supelly)
so how about uni of lancaster??Is lancaster good for law ? To compared with Leicester or Manchester ,which one is the best??someone answer me please

Not sure, not many people apply to Lancaster and it's not known for Law (compared to say Business) but it's a decent Law School. Leicester and definitely Manchester likely better known, but doesn't necessarily mean they are better. Go visit them and see what you think, a campus based collegiate uni like Lancaster is going to be vastly different to Manchester.

[Harry.K]

Does sussex uni have a good reputation overall and for law? I understand it wont be on a level with unis like warwick, ucl, etc, but is it pretty good?

[volante]

KCL or Bristol for law?
Both in terms of league-tables and non-league tables pls!

[khary]

can someone please help me?

I have a AAA offer from Warwick for law but I achieved A*AA (one mark off another A* -.-) and thus was thinking of reapplying and trying for oxbridge and nottingham.

Is this a risk worth taking and would I be able to put warwick down again or would I be asking for a guaranteed rejection?

Thanks.

[sarahcav]

(Original post by supelly)
so how about uni of lancaster??Is lancaster good for law ? To compared with Leicester or Manchester ,which one is the best??someone answer me please

Hey. I'm just about to enter my 2nd year of Law at Lancaster and I thoroughly recommend it. Although, it entirely depends on what it is you're looking for. I'm not sure about Leicester, but Manchester is not a campus (I don't think) whereas Lancaster is. With city universities, you're right in the depths of everything so you'll have that great city vibe and all the amenities that come with living in a city, but with campus universities you'll experience a comparably higher sense of community.

Most people I have spoken to have commented on how Lancaster feels like its own little town and I have to agree with them. It is a wonderful place to experience your first year; a great transition from home to moving away.

Another note, (this is down to personal preference) if you like to watch the league tables, Lancaster is rated higher than both Manchester and Leicester for Law in the Guardian. But never base your decision entirely on the position of a university on a league table - always go and see if for yourself and take a look around the departments of each school.

Good luck!

[truthwonders]

(Original post by Reefboy)
A degree in law coupled with the LPC was an almost certain route to a satisfying job as a solicitor or barrister. That is no longer the case. Employers don’t necessarily rank universities in the current order espoused by the Guardian or the Times. They tend to remember what was respected when they entered the profession and stick to that ranking hence, Oxbridge Durham LSE etc will always look attractive. However, the university only sparks an interest amongst the many CVs employers have to deal with. The more important factors are class of degree, and believe it or not A level results. Next comes assessment over the net, a telephone interview and with luck an interview. It is possible to get a job if you graduate from an “ex poly” but it is becoming more difficult.
Copied partly form The Law Societies Web site is the following.
Undergraduates and graduates in law
In 2009, 29,211 people applied to study law at undergraduate level in England and Wales. Out of these 19,882 (68.1 per cent) were accepted onto courses. Women made up 62.3 per cent of students accepted onto university law degree courses. Overseas students made up 16.2 per cent of those accepted. Students from minority ethnic groups accounted for 32.7 per cent of those starting a first degree law course in 2009.
Student enrolments with the Law Society
Prior to embarking on the Legal Practice Course, or entering into a training contract, students must enrol with the SRA as student members. In the year up to 31 July 2010, 8,098 students enrolled with the SRA. Of these students, 5,008 were women, making up 61.5 per cent of the intake. 2,507 were drawn from minority ethnic groups, making up 31 per cent.
The Legal Practice Course
The Legal Practice Course is the next stage towards qualification as a solicitor. In 2009-10, there were 11,370 full time and 3,140 part time places available on the Legal Practice Course with 7,064 students enrolling in total.
Training contracts
The training contract is the final hurdle in becoming a solicitor. It is a work based training period, generally undertaken over two years, with a firm of solicitors. In the year ending 31 July 2010, 4,874 new traineeships were registered with the SRA. 61.7 per cent of these trainees were female. We have ethnicity data for 93.1 per cent of these trainees. Trainees from minority ethnic groups represented 19.9 per cent of those with known ethnicity.
Admission to the Roll
Once the qualifying law degree, the Legal Practice Course and the training period have been completed successfully, application can be made to the Roll of solicitors of England and Wales, which entitles the applicant to practise as a solicitor.

8,480 individuals were admitted to the Roll in the year that ended 31 July 2010. 60.1 per cent of these were women.
1,708 solicitors admitted were from minority ethnic groups. 60.1 per cent of those admitted from minority ethnic groups were female.
The average age of those entered onto the Roll in 2009-10 was 29.9 years. The average age of males was slightly higher than that of females.
Source: Law Society's annual statistical report, 2010. For all annual reports, statistics and analysis see Research and trends.
What does this mean?
Of the 29,000 who want to study law just over 4,874 will eventually get a training contract and a smaller number than that will get a job as a solicitor.
I suspect the current figures are even worse.
Realistically unless you have a 2:1 or upwards you will waste your money on the LPC.
It is even worse at the bar. Only 400 pupillage's per year and most chambers require a first from a good university i.e. a non former Poly.
This post is not to discourage but to help with the economic realities of undertaking a law degree.

Would you give an example of other unis they are likely to recognise (other than ones in london and oxbridge)? and also examples of poly unis as I don't think I'm familiar with many. Thanks

[roh]

(Original post by triumphanttri)
Would you give an example of other unis they are likely to recognise (other than ones in london and oxbridge)? and also examples of poly unis as I don't think I'm familiar with many. Thanks

Pretty much all the universities on here: http://graduates.hoganlovells.com/ap...campus_alumni/

[truthwonders]

(Original post by roh)
Pretty much all the universities on here: http://graduates.hoganlovells.com/ap...campus_alumni/

Thanks does anyone know whether any of these unis do 2nd year transfers?