The EU Constitution is Undemocratic Garbage
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I agree; Constitutions should be short and concise. What I can't understand is how the EU can ask people to vote on something they don't really understand. It's ridiculous.(Original post by zaf1986)
A handful of people if that. Its far too long - why does it need to be? -
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Didn't the constitution aim to make the EU more democratic? Because a the moment it's just being run by unelected commissioners. I haven't read the constitution nor have I any intention of doing so but I was hoping that the EU Parliament would become more powerful.
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EU Member States ratify international agreements (the Constitution is just that-an international agreement) according to their national constitutional practices. Several Member States require referendums, while other ratify via their Parliaments.(Original post by Colly)
I agree; Constitutions should be short and concise. What I can't understand is how the EU can ask people to vote on something they don't really understand. It's ridiculous.
The referendum in France was optional- basically, President Chirac chose to have it because he thought it would reinforce his Government. He was wrong -
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I'm glad I don't live in a country where the constitution was ratified by Parliament only. You can't make big constitutional decisions like that without asking the people. And it would have been scandalous had Blair done so considering his questionable mandate.
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Yes it was an error on my part to say that the EU makes people vote on the constitution and other treaties, however when it was being drawn up, the powers-that-be would have known it would face a referendum in numerous countries. With that in mind, surely they could have made it shorter and more comprehensible.(Original post by giordano)
EU Member States ratify international agreements (the Constitution is just that-an international agreement) according to their national constitutional practices. Several Member States require referendums, while other ratify via their Parliaments.
The referendum in France was optional- basically, President Chirac chose to have it because he thought it would reinforce his Government. He was wrong -
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Unless they make all the countries vote again and again untill they reach the correct democratic decision..(Original post by technik)
its of little consequence anyway. the french said non, the dutch will say nee, and if it ever gets to a british vote it'll get a big harsh no.
considering all the states need to ratify it for it to be implemented, its looking bleak. -
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Because if they wrote up a small bulleted list of laws, they would misinterpretted and nobody would take them seriously. With regard to laws and constitutions, the original intentions should be as clear as possible.(Original post by zaf1986)
A handful of people if that. Its far too long - why does it need to be? -
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Why is it that every member state has to ratify it? I mean that just seems to be like a recipe for vetos and discord. Surely an 75 or 80% majority of member states would suffice? I realise that all European agreements and treaties are subject to this, and always have been, but it doesn't make much sense to me.
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The American constitution is relatively short, and the Supreme Court interpretes it if there is confusion, why couldn't a similar system work in Europe?(Original post by beekeeper_)
Because if they wrote up a small bulleted list of laws, they would misinterpretted and nobody would take them seriously. With regard to laws and constitutions, the original intentions should be as clear as possible. -
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A constitution is no place for arbitrary legislation. A constitution ratifies and limits the power of government. zaf is correct in pointing out that the Constitution is far too long because it goes beyond defining the delegation of power and attempts to legislate.(Original post by beekeeper_)
Because if they wrote up a small bulleted list of laws, they would misinterpretted and nobody would take them seriously. With regard to laws and constitutions, the original intentions should be as clear as possible. -
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Because the US Constitution starts..."We the people..."(Original post by Colly)
The American constitution is relatively short, and the Supreme Court interpretes it if there is confusion, why couldn't a similar system work in Europe?
the EU Constitution starts "We the state, know better than the people.." -
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Agreed. As I mentioned before, a constitution is supposed to show how laws should be created, not what those laws should be.(Original post by Vienna)
A constitution is no place for arbitrary legislation. A constitution ratifies and limits the power of government. zaf is correct in pointing out that the Constitution is far too long because it goes beyond defining the delegation of power and attempts to legislate.
Can you expect anything better from a French socialist?(Original post by Vienna)
Because the US Constitution starts..."We the people..."
the EU Constitution starts "We the state, know better than the people.."
