NY Times writer refuses to hire superbly qualified babysitter, because he's male

Oh my something has rattled your cage this evening.

At my place of work, the toilets are in the changing rooms, and the female cleaner cleans the male and female changing rooms/toilets. If the male cleaner is on duty, he will clean both changing rooms too.

Now please chill out and enjoy your flight.

What did the people confronting him say??

Just general "We don't feel happy with you taking pictures near our children - stop it" crap. He just told them that no law would prevent him from taking pictures of a few trees just because they happened to be near their kids, and he'd go when he was done. Apparently they glared at him the entire time and watched him leave.

However, they had absolutely no problem that I might be taking pictures of their kids - no one said anything to me as I stood in the exact same place and took pictures of the exact same trees.

Who cares if it's 'sexism'. I wouldn't want a male looking after my daughter; as she said, the babysitter might have to see her naked (nappys, or if she has an accident or whatever), I wouldn't want any man to see that. Seriously, get over it.

I bet if I wanted to be a mechanic, it would be harder for me to be hired as a woman, then for a guy. People like you need to get rid of those ridiculously annoying chips off your shoulder. It's called life.

Oh dear :/ Society today has still got the paedo-paranoia from the late 90's early 00's.

Firstly, you're ignoring the point I was making - which is you can legally discriminate between cleaners - a gym can decide not to hire a female cleaner on the basis of her gender. You come along and try back the guy trying to undermine this point based on the fact you think it's a regular occurrence for the opposite gender to clean while people are naked. This is the sole reason I mention this - it's the sole point I'm trying to make - because it's a case, like the OP, where you can legally discriminate. There are many others.

Please STFU and read that I was talking about exceptions and this is the case here under both US and UK law.

Toilets aren't changing rooms dummy. In the UK, it is unheard of for the opposite gender to be cleaning while people are changing.



Please don't quote me again - I'm about to get on a flight in two hours - I don't want to have to look at such an inane reply again.

Secondly, I'm talking specifically about changing rooms where people will be exposed.

Thirdly, no - out of 10s of thousands of changing rooms in the UK, I would be shocked if one had no separate male/female cleaning staff - which is what the guy who you were in effect was supporting was saying. I would be less shocked if it happened in an exceptional case from time to time in a tiny minority of places - but not on a regular basis. It's not against the law for it to happen - but it would - and has in the past - generated complaints and member resignations. 'I know a fair few places where males clean the female changing rooms and vice versa' - as a matter of policy, that sentence is complete rubbish.

Fourthly, you're wrong - you don't need a crb check to work as a cleaner in gym/health clubs etc. even though kids might be present which is why I make the point.

Who needs a CRB check?

If there is ever a child protection problem in your organisation and the people working with children and young people have not been adequately checked, your organisation could be held legally liable. Often insurance payouts are significantly reduced or even invalidated.

To prevent this possibility SAFEchild advises CRB checks are conducted on all volunteers and staff involved with your organisation that have direct access to, or work directly with, children and young people, e.g. staff, instructors, teachers, coaches and activity leaders, to name a few.

Do we have to check our staff?

Under the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act 1974 an organisation must request CRBs if it is a "child care organisation" under the Children Act 1989:

* A "Child Care" organisation is defined under the Children Act 1989 as providing activities outside the home for more than 2 hours at least 6 times per year. In which case Ofsted has to be notified in writing and National Day Care Standards also apply.

and/or:

* If you employ paid or unpaid staff that have unsupervised access i.e. work directly with children, young people.

There are exceptions to this and these are listed in Exceptions Order of the Act. The two main exceptions relate to roles that involve regular contact with children or vulnerable adults. If a person wants to apply for a position that involves working or volunteering with children or vulnerable adults they are required to reveal all convictions, both spent and unspent.

That's not how your first post made it out.

Originally Posted by Rancorous
if you want a cleaner for female changing rooms, and the best cleaner is a man should you hire him?

if you want a waiter for an italian restaurant should you hire the chinese guy even though he's the best waiter?

there are cases when you can discriminate

You stress the "fact" that cleaners do not clean changing rooms of the opposite genders whilst people are using them. I know that to be untrue, due to personal experience and having worked in places where men have cleaned womens and vice versa.

You're saying that people don't get exposed in their hostel rooms after having a shower? It's pretty much the same situation.

It's not rubbish and I never said it was a policy, you numpty. As long as customers are warned in advance then there is no problem. Just because you've not experienced it doesn't mean it's not true.

Not everywhere can hire women, not everywhere can hire men. They have to make do with who applies. That they try to make it balanced is neither here nor there, not everywhere can.

Since you're so keen on this being an actual exemption in the law, I would like to see some evidence. I'm not calling you a liar, but I've never heard of anything like that.

If kids are involved, they do need a CRB check. Everyone who works around children needs one.

Source.

Source.

Now, stop acting all twattish just cause you're stressed. No one gives a **** and it's no reason not to be civil, at least.