Libya No Fly Zone- I can no longer support the &quot;savings&quot;.

Awful idea. How much is it going to cost? I bet they could pay EMA for another year with the money they're spending on this stupid measure.

Reply 22

Original post by tufc

Awful idea. How much is it going to cost? I bet they could pay EMA for another year with the money they're spending on this stupid measure.

I believe giving a country its freedom is worth far more than giving a few teenagers free money.

And this is from an ex EMA student

Reply 23

Original post by The_Male_Melons

I always maintained that the coalition government were doing a great job and that savings were needed. Of course we need to make further savings to reduce and sort out the mess of the Labour government.

I always agree with what Cameron is doing and his reforms and ideas for the UK is good. He is leading the way.

After today, the UK will be intervening in another country. The UK should not get involved. Iraq was a disaster and Afghanistan is unwinnable. Libya isn't Cameron's Balkans or Falklands. The "no fly zone" or any other military action has no support from the British people or even from the Arab people themselves.

The idea of going into Libya based on ethical and moral reasons is laughable. What about Bahrain, Egypt, or even Zimbabwe?

There is a huge inaccuracy in your statement, you say the military action (no fly zone) has no support from the Arab countries, this is wrong, evidence: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-12723554

This really is the key to the issue, in order for there to be military action the keys lessons learnt from wars like Iraq and Afghanistan is that you must have the support of the neighbouring countries, in the case of Libya not only do they support the action but they are actually going to be involved in it too.

The other countries you mention firstly Bahrain and Eygpt are not at the same point of a revolution as Libya, yes people have died but I think you have to concede at this point the troubles in Libya are far more serious. Also we clearly have no support from the neighbouring countries in the case of Bahrain as Saudi Arabia has sent troops to actually help Bahrain.

With the case of Zimbabwe it is a simple fact that there is no support at all for foreign intervention from the neighbouring countries and this really makes stepping in there an impossibility.

You talk about saving money and deep cuts, do you really value these cuts over the human rights of other people in the world? Have you read anything about the massacre and genocide of people including women and children in Srebrenica ? Can you turn away from this and value your countries economy (which compared to many countries in the world is not in THAT bad a shape, we are all far above the world poverty line) above these peoples rights?

I hope not.

(edited 13 years ago)

Reply 24

Original post by tufc

Awful idea. How much is it going to cost? I bet they could pay EMA for another year with the money they're spending on this stupid measure.

You think your EMA is more important than the human rights of other people?

Grow up, get in the real world and go to school because you want to not because you are paid to.

Reply 25

Rant

Original post by The_Male_Melons

Wow. Putting a price on human suffering? Selfish, selfish little man.

Reply 26

Golly-Gosh

America, Britain and the West should just back off and let Libya get on with it. anything America has foot in it, always ends being a disaster.

Reply 27

2ndClass

The Libyan airforce isn't that formidable to warrant the expense you're trying to allude to.

Reply 28

Ewan

Dude, the fact they aren't intervening in other countries is no reason not to intervene here. It's a bit of a mute point really, take each situation individually.

Reply 29

Original post by nescafe236

You think your EMA is more important than the human rights of other people?

Grow up, get in the real world and go to school because you want to not because you are paid to.

Why should I pay for the £13 a week it costs me to get to college and back? A Levels are supposed to be free.

Why is it our responsibility to liberate Libya? If the rebels want to do it, why should they expect support from other countries. It's pure and simple: regime change. Something that's supposed to be illegal in the UK

Reply 30

Original post by The_Male_Melons

The Arab League - is it really the voice of the arab people considering the Arab world have dictators in power?

No, the Arab people do not support intervention from the west. They will view it with suspicion.

Bahrain and Egypt- no a lot of people died, tell that to greiving mothers, sisters, fathers, brothers and sons, tell that to their family?

Yet the Zimbabwean people are suffering- why should we turn a blind eye? For decades, they cried out for help. It is a shame, no oil is there. Same with the Ivory Coat (it's own government using weapons against it's own people who are protesting)

How can the government, Cameron (the man I voted for) propose savings which will be painful yet wants intervention in Libya?
I supported this government, it's savings and reforms etc... How can I justify them knowing that even a single British troop entering Libya costs money?

How will this play out to the Libyan people? The very people Gadaffi buys weapons from are concerned with the well being of the Libyan people. It doesn't make sense. They only need look at Iraq and Afghanistan. Let the Libyan deal Gadaffi by themselves.

Libya is going through a revolution. Name me one revolution that hasn't seen blood spilt.

The UK should not intervene. Sometimes, it better to do nothing than to do something.

The Arab league plus the resistance fighters and civilians of Libya. I am pretty sure that constitutes support, what else do you require?

You say Arab people will view it with suspicion, evidence of this please??! I dont think you have any, this is your opinion.

You make a point about grieving mothers, sisters, fathers, brothers and sons? Is this not contrary to your opinion? This is the same in Libya but you are not supporting action there to help these victims.

No troops are entering Libya, so the money spent is on air patrols and this has already (in words only) had the effect nessacary by forcing Libya to announce a ceasefire so it looks to have a bare minimum cost to us. Also if it does I reiterate my question, do you really value these cuts over the human rights of other people in the world?

The Libyan people can’t deal with it themselves which is why they have been forced back across there country towards Benghazi. They need help or they will be eradicated by a dictator using his army against his people. Is this right? Can you stand by and watch this just because you take these freedoms to democracy for granted?

Why don’t you stop making statements backed up by only your opinion and put yourself in the Libayan peoples position, what would you want if you were being oppressed by your own government for wanted only a democracy?

Reply 31

Original post by Aj12

I believe giving a country its freedom is worth far more than giving a few teenagers free money.

And this is from an ex EMA student

Egypt managed to oust Mubarrak on its own, why shouldn't Libya?
Why should British taxpayers' money go towards maintenance of freedom across the world, when there are economic problems at home. Why is it Britain's responsibility to free Libya?

Reply 32

Original post by tufc

Because in Egypt the army refused to brutally attack protesters. The Egyptian air force did not bomb its own people and soldiers who refused to shoot people were not burnt to death.

Reply 33

Original post by Aj12

Because in Egypt the army refused to brutally attack protesters. The Egyptian air force did not bomb its own people and soldiers who refused to shoot people were not burnt to death.

After we invaded Iraq, the mission aim quickly changed to bringing a new era to Iraq of liberty, and freedom. Sounds eerily similar.

And look what a bloody mess that turned into.

Reply 34

Original post by tufc

So I should pay it for you through taxes? haha. Er, no.

Don't pay it then, don't go to college.

I paid for my transport to school without government hand outs and so did everyone before EMA.

It is our responsibility as human beings to try and avoid suffering and oppression around the world at the hands of tyrannous leaders. People are fearing for these life at the hands of their own army and you are worried about a £13 bus fare to college, lets get some perspective!!

Reply 35

Original post by tufc

After we invaded Iraq, the mission aim quickly changed to bringing a new era to Iraq of liberty, and freedom. Sounds eerily similar.

And look what a bloody mess that turned into.

Hardly. What part of no boots on the ground do you find so hard to understand?

Reply 36

Original post by tufc

After we invaded Iraq, the mission aim quickly changed to bringing a new era to Iraq of liberty, and freedom. Sounds eerily similar.

And look what a bloody mess that turned into.

WE ARE NOT INVADING LIBYA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It is no where near similar.

Can people get there facts right!!

Reply 37

Original post by Aj12

Hardly. What part of no boots on the ground do you find so hard to understand?

Let's wait and see how long it is before we have ground troops in Libya.

Reply 38

Original post by tufc

Let's wait and see how long it is before we have ground troops in Libya.

Well seeing as it would be illegal and more importantly there is no stomach for a ground invasion I doubt it will happen.

Reply 39