Working as a paralegal as a way into the Bar???

I was actually quite particular in stating GOOD candidates, and I even capitalised it and emboldened it to be sure that what I was saying was clear.

Fortunately you included the link with your above 'quote', which actually does not state what you have said it does, because it goes on to quantify the statement, indicating pretty much what I said in my previous post re overseas and previous BVC students continuing to apply. The ratio 400:1 is very specifically referred to as in "some of the better known chambers" and also states "although these are of course multiple applications – many apply to several chambers".

No one is denying that pupillage is difficult to obtain, but there's no point in trying to make it seem far worse than it is.

Arguably, it can be done, yes but there are a lot of people who will argue that an LLM doesn't "make up" for a first degree, it just may give you a slight edge over other similar students from lower ranked unis. Certainly the case for solicitors, I'm not sure how the bar perceives additional qualifications but I would have thought it's similar, the exception being something like Oxford's BCL. The fact is the bar is still based on academics far more than most professions. It is competitive. Any advantage you can have, you should take and for most people that is going to the best university possible and working to get the 2:2/1st.

Of course, there are students from lower ranked universities who succeed at the Bar (one of the barristers I know is ex-Southampton Institute, what is now Solent) but they're in the minority.

Things like LLMs, paralegalling experience are all well and good and if you have that experience then you need to do your best to work it to your advantage. Realistically, I don't think they do all that much to set you apart from every other qualified applicant out there and they often aren't worthwhile enough to make up for flaws such as below average academics.

ShinyToy: Clearly you can do the calculations you have done and present them, but you are, unfortunately, not in a position to expect anyone to take them seriously when they are based on false premises.

my point was not to prove an exact percentage, but to prove that there is not a, as you stated, a 1 in 4 chance of getting a pupillage. the stats when calculated properly will be much lower due to, as i already said, multiple applciations, and people re-applying each year. are you on pupillage yourself? or are you still a student in the land of D-R-E-A-M??

how about you post back on here after you finish school and finish BVC and then come telling everyone oh how easy it is for any good applicant to get a pupillage, and how securing a place on the BVC is not much harder than passing a driving test in brentwood (1 in 4 = 25% vs 28% pass rate in Brentwood)

*rolls eyes at the wannabe wonder kiddo*

get real and grow up

This thread made me laugh, I'm worried about getting a pupillage and I'm going to UCL, let alone a frigging poly.

You're showing your own immaturity by a) making assumptions and b) being rude. Neither is becoming of someone who must be at least 25 years old, given your previous posts.
Your premises remain incorrect.

re-read my post u quoted then tell me which part is incorrect. All you have done is insist the chances of pupillage are 1 in 4 with no reason why that is. I have clearly explained why it is certain to be much lower but maybe your law textbook doesnt have a mathematical reasoning chapter. And im certain you are not in the middle of pupillage nor have the offer of one cos otherwise yould have the maturity to be realistic. there is no way you would be saying it is easy to obtain one. If the odds were 1:4, with 4 choices on olpas almost everyone would get an offer fisrt time round. Hun you might like to argue but you also need a brain to become a lawyer

...

A couple of things here. The numbers you're using are flawed for 2 reasons:

- first, they don't (and can't) take account of the fact that candidates have differing levels of abilities and qualifications. That was the point Sevenstars was making - to assess chances of success in securing a pupillage it makes sense to only look at those are realistically in with a chance. To do that, you need to strip out a percentage of applicants. Unfortunately, it appears that there are surprisingly large numbers of students on that course who are never destined to achieve pupillage. Include them in the stats if you wish, but it gives a flawed pciture. Likewise, one needs to realise that not all sets are the same - some are obviously far more picky than others and, more importantly, many will specialise in areas of the law which are not attractive to certain applicants. You can't easily model this factor but it's important to realise that, for many applicants, not all chambers are "in the game" as far as they're concerned.

Chalks, you have far more patience than I.

Though if truth be told, nostalgia for the old days makes me think I might rather enjoy being back in the playground again, albeit momentarily.

i highly doubt a substantial proportion of BVC graduates have 2:2s or 3rds. You would be kidding yourself to think otherwise. My friend has completed BVC at College of Law and NO-ONE had below a 2:1

Ah. Thought I recognised the name. Well not I regret wasting time on my essay length post...

I would be very VERY sceptical of that.


There are a number of pupillages out there and a number of good candidates to fill them. Yes, some good candidates will be left disappointed at their first attempt but it's not quite so awful that nobody should bother.

so really, to say the odds of getting a pupillage are comparable to 1 in 4 would be far from the truth?