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Islamification is a good thing

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Absolutely not. Islam is alien to British culture. It is an anti-western religion which encompasses political ideology as well.

Whilst I agree that Western culture has become quite decadent - sex and promiscuity is everywhere, people worship trash culture, this sort of decadence is itself a blight on Western civilisation. It is partly because we are demoralised and the dominant cultural identity is being dissolved, because Britain is suffering from cultural schizophrenia, that our society is so atomised and corrupted. Mass immigration, multiculturalism, and Islamisation are part of the problem - third-world culture continues to pollute that of Britain, leaving its indigenous people confused and alienated, and driven towards nihilistic attitudes and behaviours.

I urge you not to convert to Islam. You will be just as much a traitor to your culture as the typical binge-drinking clubber or celebrity-worshipping philistine. We mustn't sell out to anything which promises some sort of spiritual fix, let alone a religion which has such deep conflicts with Western values. Islam is NOT the answer to Britain's miseries. Islamic countries have their own set of problems, some of which are the direct result of Islam.
A solution needs to be found from within, and without betraying Britain to a belief system which does not belong.
(edited 13 years ago)
Original post by Tesphena

Srsly though I'd rather get stoned than be stoned. :biggrin:


Society would be better for it :biggrin:
Reply 22
Original post by TheArabian
I do understand it very well and we both know that when 'god' says something then you don't have the right to argue about it, and if you don't follow, you'll be punished. In democracy there is no such 'god' who puts the rules. people decide what rules are best.

Its up to you to think which way of life is better.


Yeah, but the point is that you can vote whether or not to have the Sharia Law. It isn't a necessity. So if a majority want the Sharia Law and vote it in then obviously they must follow the Sharia rules, just as if you voted in Liberals or Labour or Conservatives you would have to follow their respective decisions. When the elections come round people are at liberty to vote in or out the Sharia Law.
Any religion will preach all these things, Islam's nothing special.
Islam will, and already is, go the same way as Christianity and relax on these stances. No-one will admit it, the same as no-one would when it started with Christianity, but the Islam community is generally already becoming more lax. Islamification isn't going to happen, quite the converse.

Also, lol at bringing up the DailyMail as a credible source for anything. As though they won't spin a bias into the story at all.
Reply 24
Original post by Democracy
Regressing to 7th century philosophies? That is never a good thing.

I don't care what religion it is, it should be personal and shouldn't affect society.

Also if you think our culture is really that "degenerate", you know where the door is...god knows how many asylum seekers fleeing despots would kill to have your place in our society...


Good post.
Original post by Evil Monkey
Any religion will preach all these things, Islam's nothing special.
Islam will, and already is, go the same way as Christianity and relax on these stances.


And this doesn't make it right. Let people decide for themselves.
Original post by Tesphena
Yeah, I thought this thread would be controversial enough without throwing something else out there. :tongue:

Srsly though I'd rather get stoned than be stoned. :biggrin:


Good thinking.:top2:
Reply 27
Original post by Liquidus Zeromus
Absolutely not. Islam is alien to British culture. It is an anti-western religion which encompasses political ideology as well.

Whilst I agree that Western culture has become quite decadent - sex and promiscuity is everywhere, people worship trash culture, this sort of decadence is itself a blight on Western civilisation. It is partly because we are demoralised and the dominant cultural identity is being dissolved, because Britain is suffering from cultural schizophrenia, that our society is so atomised and corrupted. Mass immigration, multiculturalism, and Islamisation are part of the problem - third-world culture continues to pollute that of Britain, leaving its indigenous people confused and alienated, and driven towards nihilistic attitudes and behaviours.

I urge you not to convert to Islam. You will be just as much a traitor to your culture as the typical clubber or celebrity-worshipping philistine. We mustn't sell out to anything which promises some sort of spiritual fix, let alone a religion which has such deep conflicts with Western values. Islam is NOT the answer to Britain's problems. Islamic countries have their own set of problems, some of which are the direct result of Islam.
A solution needs to be found from within, and without betraying Britain to a belief system which does not belong.


I believe that the intrinsic fault with your post is that you believe the traditional British culture to be the superior one. For example, I could say that by following British culture, you are a traitor to the traditional Japanese culture, which adds nothing and is just a null reason.
Original post by Selkarn
This is a huge generalisation, but I believe that the White lifestyle/culture in this country is, to put it bluntly, highly degenerate, being orientated around materialism, consumerism, alcohol, drugs, casual sex, highly dependent on the government to provide, and also suffers (in my view) from a lack of religious insight.


If you were to only use the reasons you gave as the problems for this country, why not another religion such as Buddhism , which is also against materialism, but excludes much of the backwards thinking of Islam
Reply 29
Original post by Evil Monkey
Any religion will preach all these things, Islam's nothing special.
Islam will, and already is, go the same way as Christianity and relax on these stances. No-one will admit it, the same as no-one would when it started with Christianity, but the Islam community is generally already becoming more lax. Islamification isn't going to happen, quite the converse.


I don't think so.. do you have any proof to back this up?

Original post by Evil Monkey
Also, lol at bringing up the DailyMail as a credible source for anything. As though they won't spin a bias into the story at all.


Shut up with your bleating about the "Daily Mail sux, hurr durr", it's just getting boring - it's a story about how a woman converted to Islam, it's not like they are going to simply lie.
Reply 30
Original post by G8D
Sharia law will never gain a majority acceptance in the UK, not even close.


Earlier post says that, and also agrees that it shouldn't.
(edited 13 years ago)
Reply 31
Original post by G8D
Sharia law will never gain a majority acceptance in the UK, not even close.


It will if the stories about "Muslims becoming the majority within a generation" are true. Indeed, I do see the point - I virtually never see "traditional White British" families with more than 1 or 2 children, but it's a common sight to see Asian Muslim families with 6 or 7 running around..
Reply 32
Religion frustrates me. I dont know why but I just feel it is for the weak-minded and I feel embarrased that anyone could be so easily manipulated by it. I understand the want to believe in something, I really do, what I dont understand is why you need a cult imposing rules and sanctions on your life. And yes I know I used the word cult and it may not be appropiate but I cant think of anything else to describe an organisation where men wear silly hats and dresses and women are treated like objects, of couse that is picking on islam alone but I believe the same is true for all religions.

Of course its up to you what you do behind closed doors but you should not force it on other people, you should not force it on society and you should not rag on the other cults because you believe yours is the 'solution' to the current 'problems' with society.

While I'm on the topic of current society, you cant be against drugs, alchohol or sex, why would 'Allah' or 'God' or whatever put them here in the first place if they are such a bad thing? Yes drugs and alchohol can lead to all sorts of problems but in moderation (like everything) can have a positive effect. And if this so called 'higher power' was against sex why would he make it so fun?

Consumerism and materialism are an example of two things that make us human. They give everyone a certain amount of independence and that is a good thing. Placing value on something is not a bad thing. You value your 'holy' book? You value your family? Why cant you value a car. We are not made to be all the same. We have been given very capable brains and opposable thumbs making us the dominant species of this planet, why waste the opportunity to enjoy life. Why not eat at a fancy restaurant? Why not watch the latest blockbuster movie?

tl:dr You are very misguided if you think religion is the answer. In fact your misguided if you think there is a problem.
Reply 33
my message to the internet:

Why is everyone talking about becoming a Muslim because western lifestyle sucks, whats wrong with becoming a Buddhist? I have never heard of a Buddhist terrorist group?
Reply 34
Original post by Selkarn
tens, if not hundreds of thousands of White people to formally embrace Islam.


I will never embrace Islam. Or any other religion, for that matter.

Where does this put me in your little scheme? :cool:
Reply 35
Original post by Selkarn
I'm White, and not someone you'd expect to be Muslim. However, I have a rising interest in Islam, and so too do many other White people in this country and other Western nations. There is growing dissatisfaction with the "typical" Western lifestyle. This is a huge generalisation, but I believe that the White lifestyle/culture in this country is, to put it bluntly, highly degenerate, being orientated around materialism, consumerism, alcohol, drugs, casual sex, highly dependent on the government to provide, and also suffers (in my view) from a lack of religious insight. I believe Islam could provide the solution to these, and I may very well soon be one of the many tens, if not hundreds of thousands of White people to formally embrace Islam.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1343954/100-000-Islam-converts-living-UK-White-women-keen-embrace-Muslim-faith.html


For starters, Western culture is not exclusive to white people - so you can stop spouting racist claptrap. Nor does Western culture only consist of the activities you list. See this and enlighten yourself.

And, the "degenerate" activities you list are not exclusive to Western culture either. You will most certainly find many of them in Islamic countries. Indeed, there is nothing wrong with alcohol, consumerism, sex (and so on) in healthy moderation.

It could be argued that the acts of theists are also degenerate and self-indulgent.

If a moral void exists in Western culture (which it doesn't, in my view) then it will not be filled with a, as Democracy stated, a 7th century ideology.
(edited 13 years ago)
Original post by Selkarn
I believe that the intrinsic fault with your post is that you believe the traditional British culture to be the superior one. For example, I could say that by following British culture, you are a traitor to the traditional Japanese culture, which adds nothing and is just a null reason.


All cultures evolve over time, adopt new values, and so on. From a mixture of cultural exchanges with other countries, and change from within. British culture in 1800 is not the same as British culture in 1900. But Islam is too different and too incompatible to be adopted without betraying your British cultural heritage. If someone wants to go to another country and become completely assimiliated into that culture, fine - they can abandon their culture and adopt another. But when a British person adopts Islam, they usually change their name to an Islamic one, follow Sharia law, make massive changes to their lifestyle, and they're totally out of place. There is no way you can become a White British Muslim without turning your back on Britain - and possibly your family, too.
(edited 13 years ago)
Reply 37
Original post by Selkarn
I don't really know what you're trying to say..


The point is that it's exactly our institutions which allow you to state such ideas. Most Islamic societies and a strict understanding of the Qur'an wouldn't allow you to do so.

If you're scared of nihilism and want there to be some point in life, well that's your own choice but it's rather cowardly. Doesn't mean that the current way of living your life to the full without interference from others is any less valid.

Any reversion to religion is a reversion to a post scientific world, which is why it puzzles me why so much of the Islamic World is turning more and more religious, even Turkey.
Reply 38
Original post by ajp100688
The point is that it's exactly our institutions which allow you to state such ideas. Most Islamic societies and a strict understanding of the Qur'an wouldn't allow you to do so.

If you're scared of nihilism and want there to be some point in life, well that's your own choice but it's rather cowardly. Doesn't mean that the current way of living your life to the full without interference from others is any less valid.

Any reversion to religion is a reversion to a post scientific world, which is why it puzzles me why so much of the Islamic World is turning more and more religious, even Turkey.


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/how-islamic-inventors-changed-the-world-469452.html

Religion and science, in my opinion, do not collide.
Reply 39
Original post by Deema
Yeah, but the point is that you can vote whether or not to have the Sharia Law. It isn't a necessity. So if a majority want the Sharia Law and vote it in then obviously they must follow the Sharia rules, just as if you voted in Liberals or Labour or Conservatives you would have to follow their respective decisions. When the elections come round people are at liberty to vote in or out the Sharia Law.


It's not so simplistic that if the majority vote in Sharia it will be enforced. There are a lot of cases where human rights trump the tyranny of the majority.

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