Two arrested in Paris for Burqa protests, as well as dozens of others

Why are people moaning about this being banned it is a huge safety risk having people wearing burqas because you dont know what theyre hiding plus it allows criminals to disguise themselves as in the case of one of the 21s july failed bombers. Plus its only a small fine people in muslim nations are killed for practising non muslim religions which is much worse.

Reply 41

rivda

2

Well, if foreigners are forced to cover up completely when they go to Muslim countries such as Saudi Arabia, I dont see why France can't impose similar laws regarding attire.

Also, I don't think the French government is banning burqas because people who wear them are terrorists. You'll notice the punishment is much harsher for those who FORCE women to wear burqas, as such people (extremist clerics,etc) tend to be more radical, and thus inclined towards terrorism.

Reply 42

MrsCrackFox

Whatever happened to human rights?

Reply 43

username129099

15

Original post by pHneutral

Number should not matter. 2000 0r 20 people. Ban is talking their 'freedom' away and is suppressing them as they are noteven able to dress up how they want!
That is doing unjustice to the monority.
In history the monority has always suffered. :rolleyes:

It does matter, it always has and always will. Laws will never suit everybody, and bearing that in mind it makes sense they suit the majority.

It hardly a large freedom being taken away, and its pathetic it got to a state where they had to take it away rather than the people have decency to adhere to national customs.

Reply 44

Lewis :D

3

Original post by hatemylife

I thought France was still Catholic and England/Britain Protestant, both Christians, really.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Map_of_state_religions.svg

Reply 45

CombineHarvester

16

Original post by In2deep

It was initiated due to idealogical reasoning, one that fundamentally goes against everything that France stands for. It's sad to see the morals of a country go down a drain due to some irrational fear.

You cannot tell me what to wear in public, the burqah is already banned in places in which the security of the general public is at stake, banning it everywhere is ludicrous and I hope the protests goes on and even more women (and men), whether Muslim or not wear it to oppose the dangerous right-wing path in which Europe is being taken towards again.

Actually the real reason appears to be more sinister. The Front National party has been doing very well in polls and is worse than the BNP in the UK when it comes to racism and xenophobia, particularly with regards to minority groups. Sarkozy domestically isn't very popular and is trying to fix this by taking some votes from the far right. Note he's already right wing, he's trying to get votes from the extreme right.

Reply 46

A Mysterious Lord

20

Original post by hatemylife

Shouldn't be allowed at the expense of security and peace of mind. It's terrifying walking down a street with a load of faceless creatures.

I wouldn't have put it like that, although it should be banned while driving on safety grounds, there's no way a woman wearing a burka can have full all round vision.

Reply 47

pHneutral

Original post by Mad Cat Lady

Sorry to pick up on this but, fundamental flaw here.... just because there is less crime in those countries and they wear burkas there, does not mean theres a causal connection between the two. Perhaps it is that in those countries people wear burkas because of their religion, but people (often not muslims) actually do wear them in non muslim countries to commit crime, to make it harder for them to be caught... how can anyone tell the difference between an ordinary woman and a criminal when they are both entirely covered by a veil? The only way you can identify a criminal is by seeing them do it, and if you cannot see them, criminals can't be identified.

In the same way one cannot make a causal connection that wearing the burka reduces scurity of people and might increase crime rate.
Well if othe people (non-muslims) wear the burka in the non-muslims countires to commit crime, thats their proplem, why should people who have nothing to do with it have to suffer. Crimes have been commited in the past by people breaking into banks etc covering their faces for a long time now-not a new story , it was dealt before and so can be done now.

You asked about how can you tell the difference between an ordinary woman and a criminal when they are both entirely covered by a veil, well the answer is, those that want to commit a crime -are breaking the law anyway by comminting the crime and so dont care and will cover their face anyway. Ban on Burka wont help at all since the criminals (who do not care about one law) will also break another law and carry out the crime while wearing the burka.

However, if someone is caught doing the crime all you have to do is quiet simply ask them to show their face- and you identify them. Simple- muslim women according to their religious veiws are completely allowed to their their faces for identification. IT really is possible if one intended to do justice.

From personal experience, I have seen veiled women simply being asked by police to show their faces and they would happily do it. Whats interesting for me is that according to islamic law, inside courts and other places where identity and testomony matters, they are not even allowed to wear the burka. For instance in Saudia abrabia, when women are called inside the witness box, they show their faces.

Criminals are identified by many things today using DNA, fingerprints, etc...
Your argument in bold isnt valid because usually criminals are not caught doing the crime anyway! Its afterwards that the evidence points out towards them. And if someone is seen commiting a crime in a burka-well then the police is informed and they can deal with her by un veiling her!

I really do respect peoples' concern for safety, but I really feel this is just restriction on peoples freedom.> it wont end here. Sikh's turbans will be next, it will go on and on.

These days now you cannot even wear a hoody in the Uk in some places like Bluewater! Thats too restrictive.

I Hope didnt cause any offence.

Reply 48

mandds

Original post by A Mysterious Lord

I wouldn't have put it like that, although it should be banned while driving on safety grounds, there's no way a woman wearing a burka can have full all round vision.

Well thank you, that someone is finally sharing my view of driving with a burqa :smile:

Reply 49

tehFrance

17

Original post by lukejoshjedi

Two arrested in Paris for Burqa protests, as well as dozens of others

Good, I don't want to feel threatened whenever I see someone with their face covered as you never know if it is a man or a woman.

I am glad that France is bringing in this law, regaining our country from the immigrants, Britain could take a page from our book :smile:

Reply 50

Aramiss18

14

Well done France! Muslims always talk about respect for their religion, well how about respect for our/French society and way of life? I notice while they preach hate about westerners they have no problems dipping their hands in the benefit pot.

And all the "sharia4UK" and "sharia for France" demands just infuriate me. Sod off or accept that things here are different to your way of life. Islam means nothing here- it doesnt dictate laws, society or politics and they need to get over it.

(edited 13 years ago)

Reply 51

Aramiss18

14

Original post by tehFrance

Good, I don't want to feel threatened whenever I see someone with their face covered as you never know if it is a man or a woman.

I am glad that France is bringing in this law, regaining our country from the immigrants, Britain could take a page from our book :smile:

France is becoming a bastion of common sense.

Reply 52

hatemylife

13

Original post by Lewis :D

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Map_of_state_religions.svg

Wikipedia

Anyway, 9/10 Spaniards are Catholic yet according to that they don't have an official religion, and Spain has an illustrious history of Catholics and Muslims. Their presence in Spain didn't go down too well.

Reply 53

username358506

20

The burqa has nothing to do with Islam, ergo religion doesn't even come into the affair. It's a security measure and will also stop drunks from trying to drink women who wear it (let's face it, they look like bottles of Guinness when they wear it).

Reply 54

CombineHarvester

16

Original post by Mad Cat Lady

Sorry to pick up on this but, fundamental flaw here.... just because there is less crime in those countries and they wear burkas there, does not mean theres a causal connection between the two. Perhaps it is that in those countries people wear burkas because of their religion, but people (often not muslims) actually do wear them in non muslim countries to commit crime, to make it harder for them to be caught... how can anyone tell the difference between an ordinary woman and a criminal when they are both entirely covered by a veil? The only way you can identify a criminal is by seeing them do it, and if you cannot see them, criminals can't be identified.

The obvious difference between a balaclava and a niqab/burqa which covers the entire body is that it's easy to pull off a balaclava whereas someone who wears a burqa/niqab will stick out like a sore thumb for a long time. It's hardly an easily disposable disguise, robbing a bank dressed as a clown would be easier.

Reply 55

pHneutral

Original post by doggyfizzel

It does matter, it always has and always will. Laws will never suit everybody, and bearing that in mind it makes sense they suit the majority.

It hardly a large freedom being taken away, and its pathetic it got to a state where they had to take it away rather than the people have decency to adhere to national customs.

Monority has a right too. Equal to that of majority.
Jews in the past have suffered being a monority, Gays all over the world , and other monoritys till today that are so small -but their opinions are now being heard. No matter how small the number, peoples freedom matters.

You are saying its hardly a large freedom being taken away. For some people it is a big deal. It matters to them a lot.

Either French should claim that its against national customs or that they do not believe in full-freedom of expression. Both can't happen at the same time. Thats a contradiction in their policy.
If national customs matter alot to them, thats fine they need to take their claim back that they believe in Freedom. This is not freedom.

Reply 56

pHneutral

Original post by A Mysterious Lord

I wouldn't have put it like that, although it should be banned while driving on safety grounds, there's no way a woman wearing a burka can have full all round vision.

Do you have personal experience?
What is your claim based on?

I know many women who are wonderful drivers in the UK -they have not only passed their tests first time round but have clean records too.

Such big claims cannot be made just like that.

Reply 57

mandds

Original post by pHneutral

Do you have personal experience?
What is your claim based on?

I know many women who are wonderful drivers in the UK -they have not only passed their tests first time round but have clean records too.

Such big claims cannot be made just like that.

Why don't you try it out yourself. Put jacket or t-shirt around your head like burqa and you'll see that your vision is not the same as without the burqa. Most driving accidents happen because people didn't look good or didn't see something!

Reply 58

Prime500

13

Original post by Mad Cat Lady

I'm not condoning the ban but I think in theory, it's only fair. People aren't allowed to run around with balaclavas on simply because if they committed a crime it would be almost impossible to catch them, endangering innocent civilians. Yet when religion is brought into it, people shy away from saying anything in case the racist card is pulled on them. The fact is that burqas arent a compulsory part of the religion, and women can gladly wear them in non-public places or in other countries, but I admire the French for attempting to protect their people despite all the stick they knew they would get for it, thats true leadership.