The Pukhtoon Society

95% of all Pashtuns stated in '47 that they wanted to be part of Pakistan!

Pakistan Zindabad!

Lemme hit you with some facts homeboy.

1. The muslims league and the Indian congress decided beforehand that NWFP would go to Pakistan, this was even before the "referendum" took place.

2. Bacha khan and other Pashtun nationalists boycotted the referendum due to the facts that NWFP had already been promised to Pakistan.

3. The option to join Afghanistan, or to create a seperate Pakhtunistan, was not on the referendum.

3. Voting was restricted and only certain people were allowed to cast their vote.

4. Most tribal Pashtuns were not allowed to vote , out of 3.5 million only 0.6 million were able to cast their votes.

5. Six tribal agencies were barred from voting.

6. The states of Swat, Dir, Chitral and Amb(which consists of present day Mansehra and Haripur District), were NOT allowed to vote as they were independant, yet they were incorperated into Pakistan 2 decades later :hmmmm2:

.

And in the end, after all this effort by the muslims league, how many people voted for pakistan?

50.1%!

They went to all that trouble and in the end only suceeded by a margin.

Now this bring up and interesting question, had bacha khan and the other pashtun nationalists not boycotted, had ALL Pashtuns been able to cast their votes, had Afghanistan or Pashtunistan been an option on the referendum, would Pakhtunkhwa be apart of Pakistan today? Me thinks not. :biggrin:

I'll put a few quotes at the bottom and let you have a think about the referendum :smile:

"For all that, on the polling day they resorted to such rigging that it is hard to find a parallel. Ballot boxes were freely stuffed and even the votes of Khudai Khidmatgar leaders were cast. Let me cite two instances, one told to me by Sikandar Mirza himself who was former deputy commissioner in Hazara. Touring the polling booths he reached the one at the gullies. The staff proudly told him: “This is mountainous area. We have just 200 voters on the list here. But, Sir, we have already polled 210.”"

"Another instance is even more interesting. When several years later as a result of the 1970 election the National Awami Party formed the government in NWFP and several Muslim Leaguers came and joined us, one of the Muslim League ladies told me that she had herself cast 51 votes in the referendum"

(edited 12 years ago)

Reply 141

Yousafzai!

2

Original post by Zoya Khan

It's mind boggling but my guess... it could be Israel...

Yousafzai which belonged to the Abdali confederation of tribes in Kandahar decended from Hepthalites

The whole "israeli" thing is bs.

Reply 142

ak137

3

Original post by Yousafzai!

"Pull out your sword and slay any one, that says Pashtun and Afghan are not one! Arabs know this and so do Romans: Afghans are Pashtuns, Pashtuns are Afghans." - Khushal Khan Khattak

All Pashtuns are "Ethnically" Afghan

I disagree. Pashtuns do not recognise the durrand line that was created by the british.

Reply 143

Yousafzai!

2

Original post by ak137

I disagree. Pashtuns do not recognise the durrand line that was created by the british.

What exactly are you disagreeing with?

Reply 144

ak137

3

Original post by Yousafzai!

What exactly are you disagreeing with?

I thought it was pretty clear what i was disagreeing with?

Reply 145

Yousafzai!

2

Original post by ak137

I thought it was pretty clear what i was disagreeing with?

I dont get how Pashtuns not accepting the Durand line goes against my statement of all Pashtuns being Afghan

Reply 146

Inzamam99

16

Original post by Yousafzai!

Lemme hit you with some facts homeboy.

1. The muslims league and the Indian congress decided beforehand that NWFP would go to Pakistan, this was even before the "referendum" took place.

2. Bacha khan and other Pashtun nationalists boycotted the referendum due to the facts that NWFP had already been promised to Pakistan.

3. The option to join Afghanistan, or to create a seperate Pakhtunistan, was not on the referendum.

3. Voting was restricted and only certain people were allowed to cast their vote.

4. Most tribal Pashtuns were not allowed to vote , out of 3.5 million only 0.6 million were able to cast their votes.

5. Six tribal agencies were barred from voting.

6. The states of Swat, Dir, Chitral and Amb(which consists of present day Mansehra and Haripur District), were NOT allowed to vote as they were independant, yet they were incorperated into Pakistan 2 decades later :hmmmm2:

.

And in the end, after all this effort by the muslims league, how many people voted for pakistan?

50.1%!

They went to all that trouble and in the end only suceeded by a margin.

Now this bring up and interesting question, had bacha khan and the other pashtun nationalists not boycotted, had ALL Pashtuns been able to cast their votes, had Afghanistan or Pashtunistan been an option on the referendum, would Pakhtunkhwa be apart of Pakistan today? Me thinks not. :biggrin:

I'll put a few quotes at the bottom and let you have a think about the referendum :smile:

"For all that, on the polling day they resorted to such rigging that it is hard to find a parallel. Ballot boxes were freely stuffed and even the votes of Khudai Khidmatgar leaders were cast. Let me cite two instances, one told to me by Sikandar Mirza himself who was former deputy commissioner in Hazara. Touring the polling booths he reached the one at the gullies. The staff proudly told him: “This is mountainous area. We have just 200 voters on the list here. But, Sir, we have already polled 210.”"

"Another instance is even more interesting. When several years later as a result of the 1970 election the National Awami Party formed the government in NWFP and several Muslim Leaguers came and joined us, one of the Muslim League ladies told me that she had herself cast 51 votes in the referendum"

Instead of crying about the past, why don't we look at the present. If a vote was conducted now, a majority of Pashtuns in the North West of Pakistan (or rather all around the country- why discriminate based on geographical location right?) will vote to stay part of Pakistan. The Pashtuns in the tribal areas who yearn to be part of Afghanistan? Well I support holding a referendum but that's obviously not gonna happen in the near future. If you look at the Pakistani military, political infrastructure, economy etc., you realise that Pasthuns are over-represented not under-represented. Pashtun Nationalism in the North West of Pakistan was a strong force in 1947 sure but it eroded away in the 1950s and 60s particularly under the tenure of Ayub Khan.

On the subject of discrimination, I realise that the government of Pakistan has treated the tribes on the border like **** for a long time and this needs to change. And yet at the same time some of the blame also lies with the tribes themselves and their stubborn, backward attitude not only to change but to everything. Elders and religious leaders threaten punishment against tribes whose women register as voters and the population is openly hostile to health programmes such as Polio vaccinations. Just in 2007, a Pakistani doctor attempting to help the people of the region was blown up in his car. Add to that the fact that miners, builders, NGO's have often suffered violent attacks from militants in the region. Moreover the discrimination is not based on their Pashtun race- that much is pretty obvious- if Pakistan hated Pashtuns, why would it allow them to serve as Chief of Army Staff, President whatever. The coin is very much two-sided and it's time people like you got that into your head.

Lets assume for a second that Afghanistan and Khyber Pakhtunkhwa merge, would you be willing to give Hazara nationalists their own country, what if for some reason 50 years on the Tajik regions of the North want to be part of Tajikistan? Whatever your answer, let me just say all kinds of Nationalism is bad, be that Punjabi, Pashtun or Pakistani. All it does is fester hatred- it was Pashtun nationalism (to an extent at least), which led to the brutal persecution of the Hazaras throughout Afghan history. The genocide under King Abdur Rahman Khan in which as much as 60% of Hazaras were wiped out (according to UNHCR they were once the largest Afghan ethnic group constituting nearly 67% of the total population of the state before the 19th century.), the massacres under the Taliban in Hazarajat and other places- inspired by many factors but with ethnic nationalism and bigotry laying the foundation. Similarly Pakistani Nationalism and bias against the Bengal population played a large role in encouraging the onset of Operation Searchlight in which hundreds of thousands were killed and my country divided.

You see, I have no qualms in admitting the horrible mistakes Pakistan is making now or has made in the past and it's high time that some of the overproud Pasthuns saw sense as well. Afghanistan is as much a land of the Pashtuns as Pakistan if of the Punjabis. Sure they both may be the dominant ethnic group but doesn't mean to say other groups don't exist and shouldn't be accommodated. I absolutely despise people who think they're above others JUST BECAUSE they are Pasthuns (or whatever other group)- make your own lives and be proud of those not just because you happen to have been born into a so called warrior tribe.

(edited 12 years ago)

Reply 147

Scarface-Don

17

Pakistan is a relatively young country. Before its formation, the tribal region was part of Afghanistan and the rest was India. Basically the whole tribal region was Afghan and after Pakistan's formation, the Pashtuns in the tribal region had a choice; either join the rest of the Pashtuns in Afghanistan or stay in Pakistan. Those that remained in Pakistan regard themselves as Pakistani now. However in reality their Afghan. There is no such thing as a non-Pashtun Afghan.

Reply 148

Scarface-Don

17

Original post by ak137

Are you a Pastun? :smile:

Pastuns don't consider themselves Afghan or Pakistanis.

That's the most rubbish I've heard in a long time.

Reply 149

Inzamam99

16

Original post by Scarface-Don

Pakistan is a relatively young country. Before its formation, the tribal region was part of Afghanistan and the rest was India. Basically the whole tribal region was Afghan and after Pakistan's formation, the Pashtuns in the tribal region had a choice; either join the rest of the Pashtuns in Afghanistan or stay in Pakistan. Those that remained in Pakistan regard themselves as Pakistani now. However in reality their Afghan. There is no such thing as a non-Pashtun Afghan.

No, in reality they consider themselves Pakistani and so are Pakistani.

Reply 150

Scarface-Don

17

Original post by Inzamam99

No, in reality they consider themselves Pakistani and so are Pakistani.

So if I consider myself Jamaican, do I become Jamaican?

Reply 151

Inzamam99

16

Original post by Scarface-Don

So if I consider myself Jamaican, do I become Jamaican?

If you have Jamaican nationality and consider yourself Jamaican then yes. Same with Pukhtoons. Why should those who have Pakistani nationality and consider themselves Pakistani have another unwanted identity thrust upon them. It depends on opinion I suppose: if a kid in Britain whose parents and grandparents were born in this country but who originates from Pakistan considers himself British then that should be OK no?

Sorry probably made no sense, I've just come back from work but hope you understand what I'm trying to say.

Reply 152

kayjay

Original post by Yousafzai!

Why would one be "pro" to a country that currently enforces a British made border seperating brother from brother?

Because my family has lived there for as long as can be remembered, and still live there. I have therefore travelled to the country and thus overall have a higher affinity for the country. The geopolitics really don't come in to my day to day life or thinking living in the uk.

On the other hand I have a country I have never visited and have no connection to.