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How can people think homosexuality is a choice?

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Reply 340

Tahooper

Original post by DYKWIA

I'd still not support it, no.

What would you do if everywhere in the world legalised gay marriage?

Reply 341

DYKWIA

Original post by Tahooper

What would you do if everywhere in the world legalised gay marriage?

I hope PA never legalizes it. If they do I'll move to Texas or the south pole.

In all honesty I'd be deeply annoyed if it is legalized.

Reply 342

zubz91

IT IS A CHOICE you nutters

Reply 343

Emaemmaemily

Original post by zubz91

IT IS A CHOICE you nutters

No, it's not.

Reply 344

Gales

He's a troll, as are most of the users with red on their bars. :tongue:

Reply 345

SoberFox

Original post by adamrules247

Well it's the official teaching of the Roman Catholic CHurch that makes up over half of all of Christianity and also the teaching of the Eastern Orthodox Churches which make up the next largest group. On those figures alone my point is proved correct. My point would better be put as a minority of Christians believe that homosexual urges are a choice but my point still stands.

So to sum up:

1. The Catholic Church and the Orthodox Church do not teach that homosexuality is a choice.
2. Catholics and Orthodox Christians make the majority of Christians.
3. 100% of the Catholics and Orthodox Christians believe whatever their Churches teach.
Therefore the majority of Christians do not believe that homosexuality is a choice.
Therefore only a minority of Christians believe that homosexuality is a choice.

I deny that point 3 is correct. In fact, the majority of Catholics do not really believe in the official teachings of the Church. They do not, for example, regard homosexual acts as sinful. 56% of American Catholics belive that homosexual relations are not sinful. Is that the "official teaching" of the Church?

(edited 12 years ago)

Reply 346

Gales

Original post by DYKWIA

I hope PA never legalizes it. If they do I'll move to Texas or the south pole.

In all honesty I'd be deeply annoyed if it is legalized.

I'm happy to hear that, it means you'll never live in the UK. Happy days! :biggrin:

Reply 347

Wickersham

The First Amendment to the United States Constitution states that, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof".

Therefore, DYKWIA, since the US government is secular and as are most Western governments, the government has no business creating laws which dictate who can or who cannot get married as marriage is a religious institution.

Reply 348

Wickersham

Original post by DYKWIA

I hope PA never legalizes it. If they do I'll move to Texas or the south pole.

In all honesty I'd be deeply annoyed if it is legalized.

Honestly, I don't get why anyone would have any reason to be "deeply annoyed" by legalizing same-sex marriage.

Also, ironically enough, my favourite gay series is set in Pittsburgh. :smile:

Go figure!

Reply 349

Newky

God says homosexuality is bad therefore it is a sinful choice.

End of argument.

That's the extent of the opposing argument so take no notice of such nonsense.

Reply 350

Wickersham

There is no such thing as objective naturality. It's a vague, undefinable human concept with no basis at all in scientific fact. Humans are the products of nature, therefore everything we do must also be natural by proxy. And besides, "unnatural" does not equate to being wrong.

Reply 351

Holby_fanatic

You have implied that humans have a "gay gene". That is untrue. We have genes that determine our height, hair colour, skin tone etc, but we do not have a "gay or straight gene". That is like saying that there is a gene that determines whether you are obese or not. Such a gene does not exist, it is what you put into your system and how much exercise you do that determines whether you are obese. Sure, there is an increased chance of being obese if your parents are, but that is due to the fact that you grow and develop with their eating habits.
The same sort of principle applies here.

Reply 352

Gales

Original post by Holby_fanatic

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/2946473.stm
...?

Reply 353

Holby_fanatic

Original post by Mill

I don't think you understand genetics. When a species reproduces it tries to follow the model given to it in its DNA but mistakes occur in the process. These mutations cause people to be tall, black, have big feet, or even to be gay! To be gay is as much a choice as it is to be tall.

You are actually completely incorrect! Homosexuality is prevalent in animals at about the same rate that it is in humans and is actually very well documented and researched.

We do not have a "gay gene". As said before, that is like saying we have an "obese gene" that determines whether we are obese or not. It is all down to environmental factors, i.e. the sexual preferences people have are down to how they are brought up = CHOICE!

Reply 354

Gales

Original post by Holby_fanatic

Wrong, wrong, wrong.

If environmental factors do play a part, please explain how the child has a choice with regards their sexuality?

Reply 355

Wickersham

Original post by Holby_fanatic

Actually ...

Genes play a very dominant role in who we are as individuals. They even play a very important role in determining our personality, as well as environmental factors as well of course.

Also, my parents are both straight. My two brothers and sister are also straight. All my friends are straight. In fact, I have never met a single gay person in my entire life, so how do you explain the fact that I'm gay? Actually, I didn't even know there was such a thing as being gay until I was 13, and I first found out I was liked boys when I was about 9 or 10.

At any rate though, Holby, unless you're a geneticist or somebody who's even remotely qualified in the field, you can't go about making claims about this and that not being genetic.

Reply 356

Aust1n

Pathetic to see all the anti gays negging all the decent posts. Disgusting.

Reply 357

Holby_fanatic

Yes, but what I was trying to imply was that there was a definate gene that makes you obese. There is not. Obviously, there are always going to be some other biological factors that determine your weight, but generally it is down to what you eat.

You don't know me, therefore do not assume that I am uneducated. Ever heard the phrase, "Don't judge a book by its cover"?

Reply 358

binkey

Original post by bad8oy

the real world is the fact that "gays" will never be accepted among society as a whole while religion is still around. This is a true fact and if you argue against that then you are just ignorant in thinking that battys will be accepted in society.

I'm not saying i agree with homosexuality but i dont care whether you want to be gay either. I'm just trying to get across the fact that homosexuality will never be accepted by society as a whole.

It probably seems like that, but it's not true. The majority of the public are ok with it. If you look at the numbers for people who say that gay couples should not only have Civil Partnerships, but full marriage equality, you're up at about 61% now (two surveys, years apart). Similar with adoption, that's a majority think it's ok. Even amongst religious folk the majority of UK and US Catholics and Anglicans support equal rights and protections for people who are gay. That's just a fact.

The hate comes, and is orchestrated by some bishops and priests, and lobbying groups - particularly some Evangelical Christians.

But many churches are now requesting to accept and welcome people who are gay in to a full place within the church. Many churches are moving towards blessing same-sex relationships, or wanting to carry out marriages for gay couples. You won't know this unless you follow everything that's going on in some detail.

Let's just take this, from the US, where Republicans are going around the country trying to amend every state's constitution, where they can, to defined marriage between one man and one women. You'd think all churches were behind that, but it's just not so.

[video="youtube;KHWV_H-bOVE"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=KHWV_H-bOVE[/video]

I give that example because it's just today, and I see those quite often. There were 120 clergy in London who have asked Rowan Williams for a debate to allow them to carry out Civil Partnerships, then a Bishop also saying he was in favour of UK equal marriage rights.

I think what you think is what a lot of people think, perhaps most people, but it's not true. We don't need to decimate Christianity, we just need the anti-gay priests / bishops to take notice of what their followers are saying. Followers don't always follow - in the Catholic church most UK Catholics believe in contraception and abortion rights - quite contrary to what the Vatican teaches. That's a fact.

Reply 359

Wickersham

Holby, of course your weight is determined by what you eat, but your appetite and metabolism are determined by your genes among other things, so weight and genes are therefore linked, albeit indirectly.