Is it immoral to be fat?
I ask this as someone who has travelled the world and met many poor and starving people. Is it fair that we have people who are starving in the world, yet many are obese too?
How can someone be selfish enough to become obese when there are many dying of hunger?
According to the UN one billion people on this earth don't have enough food to be healthy. Yet there are millions who are obese in the west.
How can someone justify being obese? Do they have the right to a gluttonous lifestyle?
A picture for your thoughts:
How can someone be selfish enough to become obese when there are many dying of hunger?
According to the UN one billion people on this earth don't have enough food to be healthy. Yet there are millions who are obese in the west.
How can someone justify being obese? Do they have the right to a gluttonous lifestyle?
A picture for your thoughts:
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You could say the same about any other thing we consume a lot of in the west. All the resources that went into the stuff we consume in the west could potentially have gone into producing food for africans. Unless you spend all your money on helping these people you can't really talk because you are just as bad as fat people but spending your money on stuff other than food.
People dont have to justify themselves to you 
Considering other problems out there like drugs, tax avoidance, rape, burglary, and so on, i think you should find more important things to worry about.
Yeah you may say that they could donate the money to charity to help starving children, but so could someone that buys a sports car. Taste is just another sense that gives you enjoyment, just as someone gets visual enjoyment by how their sports car looks. Difference is you have to eat, you don't have to drive (when you're fat it is a lot harder to stop eating...coming from someone that used to be obese).
Considering other problems out there like drugs, tax avoidance, rape, burglary, and so on, i think you should find more important things to worry about.
Yeah you may say that they could donate the money to charity to help starving children, but so could someone that buys a sports car. Taste is just another sense that gives you enjoyment, just as someone gets visual enjoyment by how their sports car looks. Difference is you have to eat, you don't have to drive (when you're fat it is a lot harder to stop eating...coming from someone that used to be obese).
US companies have patents on GM foods and deny africa the use of them, in conjunction with a society that has been taught that unhealthy food is more readily available and cheaper than the natural alternative.
Consumers are quite clearly not the immorale ones.
Consumers are quite clearly not the immorale ones.
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by canyouhelpme
How can someone justify being obese? Do they have the right to a gluttonous lifestyle?
A picture for your thoughts:
How can someone justify being obese? Do they have the right to a gluttonous lifestyle?
A picture for your thoughts:
Sometimes, countries like New Zealand sell stuff that wouldn't sell in their country to countries like Tonga, where the food is far cheaper than making things yourself, and hence the population becomes fat - not by eating too much, but by eating calorie dense food
Even if everyone in the West was a healthy weight, the food saved still wouldn't make it to Africa. Corporations sell where they can make the most money, so if we all decided to stop eating as much and obesity was wiped out, they wouldn't just switch to marketing in Africa. Or if they did try to develop the market there, people in developing countries would still be unable to afford the same amount that we can. Cutting down on the products we consume (not just food) is a good thing, because the planet cannot continue to support our current level of consumption. However, to suggest that African people are starving because Westerners are overweight is wrong. We can't control the distribution of resources and it's going to take more than cutting back on food to change that.
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by canyouhelpme
I ask this as someone who has travelled the world and met many poor and starving people. Is it fair that we have people who are starving in the world, yet many are obese too?
How can someone be selfish enough to become obese when there are many dying of hunger?
According to the UN one billion people on this earth don't have enough food to be healthy. Yet there are millions who are obese in the west.
How can someone justify being obese? Do they have the right to a gluttonous lifestyle?
A picture for your thoughts:
How can someone be selfish enough to become obese when there are many dying of hunger?
According to the UN one billion people on this earth don't have enough food to be healthy. Yet there are millions who are obese in the west.
How can someone justify being obese? Do they have the right to a gluttonous lifestyle?
A picture for your thoughts:
This is a nonsense argument. Starvation and famine is not caused by a lack of food in the World, but by a lack of access to food. There isn't a famine in Africa because there is not enough food, but because the food is inaccessible and their governments (and various other militias) restrict their access for whatever reasons.
However much a person in the West eats makes zero difference to the amount of food available for others, there is 100x surplus food in the World to feed the planet. Examples? http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/4316726/EU-butter-mountain-to-return.html
If there is any questions of the morality of obesity, it is not on the basis that they are eating food that otherwise would have been used elsewhere, it's not a dichotomy between amount of food consumed in the West and starvation in Africa.
If there is a question of morality, it would be a sort of negative externality argument, regarding the NHS, certainly not a "it's not moral because of starving babies in Africa" one.
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by Bubbles*de*Milo
This is a nonsense argument. Starvation and famine is not caused by a lack of food in the World, but by a lack of access to food. There is no famine in Africa because there is not enough food, but because the food is inaccessible and their governments (and various other militias) restrict their access for whatever reasons.
However much a person in the West eats makes zero difference to the amount of food available for others, there is 100x surplus food in the World to feed the planet. Examples? http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/4316726/EU-butter-mountain-to-return.html
If there is any questions of the morality of obesity, it is not on the basis that they are eating food that otherwise would have been used elsewhere, it's not a dichotomy between amount of food consumed in the West and starvation in Africa.
If there is a question of morality, it would be a sort of negative externality argument, regarding the NHS, certainly not a "it's not moral because of starving babies in Africa" one.
However much a person in the West eats makes zero difference to the amount of food available for others, there is 100x surplus food in the World to feed the planet. Examples? http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/4316726/EU-butter-mountain-to-return.html
If there is any questions of the morality of obesity, it is not on the basis that they are eating food that otherwise would have been used elsewhere, it's not a dichotomy between amount of food consumed in the West and starvation in Africa.
If there is a question of morality, it would be a sort of negative externality argument, regarding the NHS, certainly not a "it's not moral because of starving babies in Africa" one.
I don't think its entirley fair to state that there is ample food in say... Africa. The country lies in an unfortunate geographical location in terms of its ability to produce food. Droughts are common, pests such as locust cause frquent food shortages and the climate is certainly not conducive to agriculture.
If not a question of morality then certainly one of empathy and ethics. Perhaps we could all stand to gain by allowing the missfortunes of others to affect our own lives. e.i. On principal not eating such vast quantities because of the famine elswhere.
Original post by chefdave
If starving Africans are hungry why don't they just grow more food? 
That would seem like the logical answer. Do they not have access to farming equipment in the 3rd world?
Edit: Yes.....neg away. You know I love it.
That would seem like the logical answer. Do they not have access to farming equipment in the 3rd world?
Edit: Yes.....neg away. You know I love it.
Because it's that easy?
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Original post by paperclip
People dont have to justify themselves to you
Considering other problems out there like drugs, tax avoidance, rape, burglary, and so on, i think you should find more important things to worry about.
Considering other problems out there like drugs, tax avoidance, rape, burglary, and so on, i think you should find more important things to worry about.
So the lives of another human being are worth less than the things you listed?
Original post by Bubbles*de*Milo
This is a nonsense argument. Starvation and famine is not caused by a lack of food in the World, but by a lack of access to food. There is no famine in Africa because there is not enough food, but because the food is inaccessible and their governments (and various other militias) restrict their access for whatever reasons.
However much a person in the West eats makes zero difference to the amount of food available for others, there is 100x surplus food in the World to feed the planet. Examples? http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/4316726/EU-butter-mountain-to-return.html
If there is any questions of the morality of obesity, it is not on the basis that they are eating food that otherwise would have been used elsewhere, it's not a dichotomy between amount of food consumed in the West and starvation in Africa.
If there is a question of morality, it would be a sort of negative externality argument, regarding the NHS, certainly not a "it's not moral because of starving babies in Africa" one.
However much a person in the West eats makes zero difference to the amount of food available for others, there is 100x surplus food in the World to feed the planet. Examples? http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/4316726/EU-butter-mountain-to-return.html
If there is any questions of the morality of obesity, it is not on the basis that they are eating food that otherwise would have been used elsewhere, it's not a dichotomy between amount of food consumed in the West and starvation in Africa.
If there is a question of morality, it would be a sort of negative externality argument, regarding the NHS, certainly not a "it's not moral because of starving babies in Africa" one.
there is not a 100x surplus of food to feed the world, that is lies. There simply isn't enough to go around yet us westerners ignore the cries of the hungry and stuff ourselves
I think this is an interesting question: If all obese people suddenly cut down on their food consumption, how much of an impact would it have on global food demand? Even if it made a difference, would that mean there was more food available for those in poverty?
I think it wouldn't make a difference, even if there was a drop in demand, excess food wouldn't just get donated to those who needed it, food producers aren't just simply going to give away their stuff for free. If they couldn't sell what they had, they'd switch to producing cash crops instead.
I think it wouldn't make a difference, even if there was a drop in demand, excess food wouldn't just get donated to those who needed it, food producers aren't just simply going to give away their stuff for free. If they couldn't sell what they had, they'd switch to producing cash crops instead.
It's immoral if fat people use the NHS for ailments caused by their fatness. Especially gastric bands 
Original post by ArtGoblin
Even if everyone in the West was a healthy weight, the food shared still wouldn't make it to Africa. Corporations sell where they can make the most money, so if we all decided to stop eating as much and obesity was wiped out, they wouldn't just switch to marketing in Africa. Or if they did try to develop the market there, people in developing countries would still be unable to afford the same amount that we can. Cutting down on the products we consume (not just food) is a good thing, because the planet cannot continue to support our current level of consumption. However, to suggest that African people are starving because Westerners are overweight is wrong. We can't control the distribution of resources and it's going to take more than cutting back on food to change that.
This is crazy logic. The food supply isn't controlled by large corporations to the degree you imagine, there is no evil conspiracy to deny the Africans basic resources. They're just incredible inept when it comes to the business of growing food, something us Westerners are are pretty good at. If you want to eat you have to first labour: it's that simple! If you're not prepared to till the soil don't blame your (productive) neighbour when come dinner time there's nothing on your plate.
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by canyouhelpme
I ask this as someone who has travelled the world and met many poor and starving people. Is it fair that we have people who are starving in the world, yet many are obese too?
How can someone be selfish enough to become obese when there are many dying of hunger?
According to the UN one billion people on this earth don't have enough food to be healthy. Yet there are millions who are obese in the west.
How can someone justify being obese? Do they have the right to a gluttonous lifestyle?
A picture for your thoughts:
How can someone be selfish enough to become obese when there are many dying of hunger?
According to the UN one billion people on this earth don't have enough food to be healthy. Yet there are millions who are obese in the west.
How can someone justify being obese? Do they have the right to a gluttonous lifestyle?
A picture for your thoughts:
It is immoral, just as how vegetarians who choose not to eat meat for ethical reasons are immoral...and that is not mentioning the poor moral choices it takes to become fat eg. lack of self control etc.
I wouldn't say its necessarily 'immoral' - certainly there are some who cannot help being fat for certain deficient inherited problems such as glandular ones, but from what I've heard that tends to be a minority of people who are actually like that in reality.
The ones who are fat and claim it's society's fault and attempt to promote fat acceptance/fat pride, I would call immoral or perhaps just lazy. They are blaming others for their own lack of self control.
The ones who are fat and try to change themselves I praise for their efforts and determination. But this leaves us at an impasse: how do we deter the 'immoral' fat people from the moral ones?
In circumstances as the above I'd conclude saying that it's unfair to call fat immoral off the mark unless you take into acount what type of person they are; if they're lazy, selfish and greedy then yes I would but if they're content with who they are but appreciate they are overweight and perhaps wish to change themselves I wouldn't call them immoral.
The ones who are fat and claim it's society's fault and attempt to promote fat acceptance/fat pride, I would call immoral or perhaps just lazy. They are blaming others for their own lack of self control.
The ones who are fat and try to change themselves I praise for their efforts and determination. But this leaves us at an impasse: how do we deter the 'immoral' fat people from the moral ones?
In circumstances as the above I'd conclude saying that it's unfair to call fat immoral off the mark unless you take into acount what type of person they are; if they're lazy, selfish and greedy then yes I would but if they're content with who they are but appreciate they are overweight and perhaps wish to change themselves I wouldn't call them immoral.
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