An Independent London? ( maybe with Home Counties?)
Poll
Should London ever try to be independent?
I have read this of some website
We want London to be an independent state within the commonwealth. We are tired of giving all of our money to peoples living outside the M25.
20% of UK GDP is made in London, yet we only have just have over 10% of the population. Where is the fairness in that?
A few of the policies in London would be:
· No tax on petrol (gasoline)
· 15% VAT
· No congestion charge
30% fare cuts on TfL services
and efficiency savings to TfL
. Lower utility bills
So I ask you, people of the UK and of the World.
Should London should be an independent state?
Also from Facebook:
London's economy subsidises the rest of the UK by about £18 Billion per year. Worse, the economy of London, and all the hard work we do, also subsidises lazy scrounging French farmers through the Common Agricultural Policy. Our economy in London is growing at 3.8% per annum, far outstripping the rest of the UK, and funding the health services of fat, heavy drinking smokers in Wales, Northern Ireland, Scotland and Upnorth.
Not only that, as well as paying more income and corporate tax than the rest of the UK, because our incomes are higher, we're also paying more council tax, because hardly any of our tax is spent on local services and local councils. Instead, our taxes are used to subsidise failing economies in the rest of the UK and around Europe. London Councils and Local Authorities lose out because they're viewed as "rich", and therefore have to tax their already over-taxed populous to deliver public services.
Such is the underinvestment in London that Great Ormond Street Hospital, the flagship sick children's hospital in the UK, has recently had to launch an advertising campaign for donations, because it is facing millions of pounds of underfunding. This along with the underfunding of our schools, transport system and police forces - as well as the disgraceful and broken border controls of the UK which disproportionally affect London - is a totally unacceptable situation for one of the world's economic and social centres. We could have the best city in the world, a shining light of civilisation, a beacon for other nations - if it weren't for the fact that we have to donate tens of billions a year to people who cannot or will not do productive work, and produce things people actually want to buy.
Imagine what we could do with an extra £18 Billion a year, and without having billions extra stolen from us by lazy foreign farmers, who can't be bothered to make an honest living? £18B would fund 6 new crossrail projects a year. £18B would fund over 150 more Great Ormond Street hospitals. £18B would fund brand new schools across London - with the best teachers, the most modern teaching facilities, the newest and most up to date books. £18B would fund a new, tougher, quicker immigration system - to make sure that the people we let in are genuinely needed in our economy - and we turn around those that aren't. £18B a year would mean an end to our council housing crisis - and would allow us to work with developers to build tens of thousands of new affordable homes for people with low incomes.
That's why we need to become independent from the UK. London and the Home Counties have suffered too long under rulers that take and take and take, and never give anything back. We are the engine room of the UK economy, but we have the money and taxes we produce stolen from us and given to others elsewhere. Then those people, in Northern Ireland, Scotland, Wales and Cornwall have the sheer cheek to turn around and ask for independence from us, when we make their pitiful lives possible through our hard work!! So before they assert their independence, we should assert ours, and see how they like it. London has the best workers in the world from within the M25 and outside in the Home Counties. London and the Home Counties boast 4 out of the top 5 universities in the UK. London has 5 major international airports. We in London and the Home Counties have all we need to set up our own successful state.
When we do this, we will live in one of the richest and most successful countries in the world. It will have education and health systems to rival the best in Europe. We'll be able to take control of our borders, and make sure those that come in aren't bomb-makers, and are genuinely useful to the economy.
Furthermore, we'll be able to modernise our transport system without raising prices to unacceptable levels. Housing will be cheaper for those at the lower end of the market. Moreover, we'll be able to pay less taxes for this, rather than having to pay more to bail out Africa. We'll have a high standard of living, but with a low tax economy.
But that's not all. We'll also be able to renegotiate our treaties with Europe. Of course, we're all for free trade with our neighbours, and for celebrating commerce and economic activity. That's what the EU was meant to be about - it was meant to be a free trade zone of economic and social cooperation. What it's turned into is an excuse to leak money to French farmers, and Spanish fishermen. If we became independent, we could keep the free trade, but ditch the subsidies to lazy unproductive industries. We could benefit from the economic good points of Europe like the Scandinavian Countries and Switzerland do, without getting dragged down by its outdated "socialistic" bad points.
Therefore I urge you to join in our campaign for independence for London and the Home Counties - and fight to start enjoying the benefits and fruits of our labour. - Don't blame me if the statements contradict each other.
We want London to be an independent state within the commonwealth. We are tired of giving all of our money to peoples living outside the M25.
20% of UK GDP is made in London, yet we only have just have over 10% of the population. Where is the fairness in that?
A few of the policies in London would be:
· No tax on petrol (gasoline)
· 15% VAT
· No congestion charge
30% fare cuts on TfL services
and efficiency savings to TfL
. Lower utility bills
So I ask you, people of the UK and of the World.
Should London should be an independent state?
Also from Facebook:
London's economy subsidises the rest of the UK by about £18 Billion per year. Worse, the economy of London, and all the hard work we do, also subsidises lazy scrounging French farmers through the Common Agricultural Policy. Our economy in London is growing at 3.8% per annum, far outstripping the rest of the UK, and funding the health services of fat, heavy drinking smokers in Wales, Northern Ireland, Scotland and Upnorth.
Not only that, as well as paying more income and corporate tax than the rest of the UK, because our incomes are higher, we're also paying more council tax, because hardly any of our tax is spent on local services and local councils. Instead, our taxes are used to subsidise failing economies in the rest of the UK and around Europe. London Councils and Local Authorities lose out because they're viewed as "rich", and therefore have to tax their already over-taxed populous to deliver public services.
Such is the underinvestment in London that Great Ormond Street Hospital, the flagship sick children's hospital in the UK, has recently had to launch an advertising campaign for donations, because it is facing millions of pounds of underfunding. This along with the underfunding of our schools, transport system and police forces - as well as the disgraceful and broken border controls of the UK which disproportionally affect London - is a totally unacceptable situation for one of the world's economic and social centres. We could have the best city in the world, a shining light of civilisation, a beacon for other nations - if it weren't for the fact that we have to donate tens of billions a year to people who cannot or will not do productive work, and produce things people actually want to buy.
Imagine what we could do with an extra £18 Billion a year, and without having billions extra stolen from us by lazy foreign farmers, who can't be bothered to make an honest living? £18B would fund 6 new crossrail projects a year. £18B would fund over 150 more Great Ormond Street hospitals. £18B would fund brand new schools across London - with the best teachers, the most modern teaching facilities, the newest and most up to date books. £18B would fund a new, tougher, quicker immigration system - to make sure that the people we let in are genuinely needed in our economy - and we turn around those that aren't. £18B a year would mean an end to our council housing crisis - and would allow us to work with developers to build tens of thousands of new affordable homes for people with low incomes.
That's why we need to become independent from the UK. London and the Home Counties have suffered too long under rulers that take and take and take, and never give anything back. We are the engine room of the UK economy, but we have the money and taxes we produce stolen from us and given to others elsewhere. Then those people, in Northern Ireland, Scotland, Wales and Cornwall have the sheer cheek to turn around and ask for independence from us, when we make their pitiful lives possible through our hard work!! So before they assert their independence, we should assert ours, and see how they like it. London has the best workers in the world from within the M25 and outside in the Home Counties. London and the Home Counties boast 4 out of the top 5 universities in the UK. London has 5 major international airports. We in London and the Home Counties have all we need to set up our own successful state.
When we do this, we will live in one of the richest and most successful countries in the world. It will have education and health systems to rival the best in Europe. We'll be able to take control of our borders, and make sure those that come in aren't bomb-makers, and are genuinely useful to the economy.
Furthermore, we'll be able to modernise our transport system without raising prices to unacceptable levels. Housing will be cheaper for those at the lower end of the market. Moreover, we'll be able to pay less taxes for this, rather than having to pay more to bail out Africa. We'll have a high standard of living, but with a low tax economy.
But that's not all. We'll also be able to renegotiate our treaties with Europe. Of course, we're all for free trade with our neighbours, and for celebrating commerce and economic activity. That's what the EU was meant to be about - it was meant to be a free trade zone of economic and social cooperation. What it's turned into is an excuse to leak money to French farmers, and Spanish fishermen. If we became independent, we could keep the free trade, but ditch the subsidies to lazy unproductive industries. We could benefit from the economic good points of Europe like the Scandinavian Countries and Switzerland do, without getting dragged down by its outdated "socialistic" bad points.
Therefore I urge you to join in our campaign for independence for London and the Home Counties - and fight to start enjoying the benefits and fruits of our labour. - Don't blame me if the statements contradict each other.
(edited 11 years ago)
Scroll to see replies
Original post by Lumos
whoever dreamt that up must be absolutely insane. I live in greater london, but no way.
Why not- it's be much more likely to be a success than an independent Scotland!
Seems a bit strange- youve got a HUGE number of benefit claimants in London because inner-city schools are renowned for being crap.
Hackney/peckham/seven sisters/brixton arent exactly full of amazingly-qualified people.
Hackney/peckham/seven sisters/brixton arent exactly full of amazingly-qualified people.
Original post by billydisco
Seems a bit strange- youve got a HUGE number of benefit claimants in London because inner-city schools are renowned for being crap.
Hackney/peckham/seven sisters/brixton aren't exactly full of amazingly-qualified people.
Hackney/peckham/seven sisters/brixton aren't exactly full of amazingly-qualified people.
£20 billion of tax cuts and transport fare cuts would soon revive those areas!
Anyhow high property prices are partly to blame
Plus London has less benefit claminats than over parts of the Uk
What precisely would these londoners eat, without support from 'lazy foreign farmers', if, for some reason, the rest of the UK decided not to trade... ?
Original post by bellatrixb
What precisely would these londoners eat, without support from 'lazy foreign farmers', if, for some reason, the rest of the UK decided not to trade... ?
The home counties has lots of valuable agricultural land - anyway we could import food around the world like we do now anyway!
So UK taxpayers money is spent on building up London, then it goes independent? Good luck importing all food with nothing to export but what goes in the City of London, which will be presumably outside of this new state. It's a stupid idea, and the home counties have no space to use for agriculture.
It's going to be a ****hole importing everything and we'll tax anything which comes through England to get to this hypothetical London.
Can't believe how some Londoners can be so up their own arses. We'd literally build up another area. The only reason London exists because we concentrated a lot of investment there. UK companies will move away from London. New centres will appear and London will be a Crysis 3-esque ****hole. A whole lot of nothing.
It's going to be a ****hole importing everything and we'll tax anything which comes through England to get to this hypothetical London.
Can't believe how some Londoners can be so up their own arses. We'd literally build up another area. The only reason London exists because we concentrated a lot of investment there. UK companies will move away from London. New centres will appear and London will be a Crysis 3-esque ****hole. A whole lot of nothing.
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by Snagprophet
So UK taxpayers money is spent on building up London, then it goes independent? Good luck importing all food with nothing to export but what goes in the City of London, which will be presumably outside of this new state. It's a stupid idea, and the home counties have no space to use for agriculture.
It's going to be a ****hole importing everything and we'll tax anything which comes through England to get to this hypothetical London.
Can't believe how some Londoners can be so up their own arses. We'd literally build up another area. The only reason London exists because we concentrated a lot of investment there. UK companies will move away from London. New centres will appear and London will be a Crysis 3-esque ****hole. A whole lot of nothing.
It's going to be a ****hole importing everything and we'll tax anything which comes through England to get to this hypothetical London.
Can't believe how some Londoners can be so up their own arses. We'd literally build up another area. The only reason London exists because we concentrated a lot of investment there. UK companies will move away from London. New centres will appear and London will be a Crysis 3-esque ****hole. A whole lot of nothing.
Countries like Luxembourg have to import food and are very wealthy and anyway London would have an extra £20 billion to spend so we could more than afford any taxes. Anyhow it would be illegal under international law to do that to a land locked country .
Anyhow we could just ship things in through the Port of London via the thames
Original post by redferry
Haha what *****. I bet they are members of the taxpayers alliance too.
What's wrong with TA?
Original post by a729
What's wrong with TA?
What isn't wrong with the TA I think is more the question you should be asking
Original post by redferry
What isn't wrong with the TA I think is more the question you should be asking
Elaborate please-answering my question is going to end up like we are on a circle line debate lol!
Original post by a729
I have read this of some website
We want London to be an independent state within the commonwealth. We are tired of giving all of our money to peoples living outside the M25.
20% of UK GDP is made in London, yet we only have just have over 10% of the population. Where is the fairness in that?
A few of the policies in London would be:
· No tax on petrol (gasoline)
· No VAT
· No congestion charge
· 30% fare cuts on TfL services
· No electricity bills (like Libya had with Gaddafi)
So I ask you, people of the UK and of the World.
Should London should be an independent state?
We want London to be an independent state within the commonwealth. We are tired of giving all of our money to peoples living outside the M25.
20% of UK GDP is made in London, yet we only have just have over 10% of the population. Where is the fairness in that?
A few of the policies in London would be:
· No tax on petrol (gasoline)
· No VAT
· No congestion charge
· 30% fare cuts on TfL services
· No electricity bills (like Libya had with Gaddafi)
So I ask you, people of the UK and of the World.
Should London should be an independent state?
I'm quite sympathetic to the idea of an independent London, and to smaller states in general - but we should do it because smaller countries are better governed and because city-states like Singapore are really successful, not so that we can enact a bunch of really, really, really terrible public policies.
Every single idea on this list is awful.
Original post by a729
Elaborate please-answering my question is going to end up like we are on a circle line debate lol!
Well they are a very nutty, an organisation that doesn't believe in paying taxes masquerading as standing up for people who pay taxes.
Plus Matt Ridley.
Original post by Dapperatchik
I'm quite sympathetic to the idea of an independent London, and to smaller states in general - but we should do it because smaller countries are better governed and because city-states like Singapore are really successful, not so that we can enact a bunch of really, really, really terrible public policies.
Every single idea on this list is awful.
Every single idea on this list is awful.
Many people struggle to pay some of the highest transport costs in Europe- how is that policy awful?
Original post by a729
Many people struggle to pay some of the highest transport costs in Europe- how is that policy awful?
Higher subsidies for suburban commuters are hardly going to push transport costs down - they just shift the burden onto taxpayers rather than the people who use the services (who are not exactly poor).
What we need is smarter service provision - more driverless trains, for example, and driving harder bargains when we contract services out.
Original post by Dapperatchik
Higher subsidies for suburban commuters are hardly going to push transport costs down - they just shift the burden onto taxpayers rather than the people who use the services (who are not exactly poor).
What we need is smarter service provision - more driverless trains, for example, and driving harder bargains when we contract services out.
What we need is smarter service provision - more driverless trains, for example, and driving harder bargains when we contract services out.
Say what??? Most poor people in London could never afford cars so have to use public transport!!
I think TfL wastes a lot of money on things like the New bus for London
and heads should roll for the major overspend in the Olympics not even property price rises can account for a nearly 300% overspend!
And don't forget the unions will fight to the death to oppose driverless trains.. they already got a deal for 52k for tube drivers..
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