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What social class do you consider yourself to be?

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Original post by Kibalchich
What do you think a Marxist approach to class means?


Well primarily the division into the Bourgeoisie and the Proletariat. Marx himself didn't even address a middle class! Most people on this thread have defined themselves as that. How can it be the best way to define class in modern Britain?
I would probably describe myself as 'middle class'. My dad much runs his own hedge fund so we're talking about a seven figure salary or more. My mum comes from a well to do family, but does nothing productive and is a lady of leisure. Was a city lawyer in the past. Maybe I could be described as upper middle class, but I was not sure.

I go to probably one of the best private schools in the country, holiday abroad are reasonably frequent . I don''t think class is a big issue at all, the main issue is that people from similar backgrounds usually have more in common. One of my closet friends is working class, but the sort who won't be forever.
(edited 11 years ago)
Reply 242
Lowest, as my mum has a mental illness I grew up on benefits, she doesn't have a basic education. I went to local state school.
Original post by Cornelius
£100,000+ per person puts you in the top 1% of the income distribution in the UK (also, women earn less, sometimes far less, than men so to find a woman who earns £100,000+ is even more rare). So upper-middle doesn't sound quite right, does it.

You know that unless you are royalty, you can go no higher than upper-middle right? I'd agree with you if the royalty did not exist but they do so you have to take into account that upper-middle is basically the same as America's upper class.
Original post by tehFrance
You know that unless you are royalty, you can go no higher than upper-middle right? I'd agree with you if the royalty did not exist but they do so you have to take into account that upper-middle is basically the same as America's upper class.


No, I did not know that. To be honest, I am not so sure this is a valid distinction anymore (it used to be when wealth and power were concentrated in that class). As far as I am concerned, a billionaire in the UK is not "upper-middle class" simply because he has no royal titles (and there are plenty of them).
Original post by tehFrance
You know that unless you are royalty, you can go no higher than upper-middle right? I'd agree with you if the royalty did not exist but they do so you have to take into account that upper-middle is basically the same as America's upper class.


That really isn't true. Royalty? No. What about all the thousands and thousands of lesser titled people? And their relatives. Not to mention very wealthy landowners and business people who are not titled.

I've read a few of your other posts like this and you seem to be quite unclear about both the British and US class system from what I can see.
Original post by Cornelius
No, I did not know that. To be honest, I am not so sure this is a valid distinction anymore (it used to be when wealth and power were concentrated in that class). As far as I am concerned, a billionaire in the UK is not "upper-middle class" simply because he has no royal titles (and there are plenty of them).

That is up to you to decide but while people with titles are still at the top (regardless of wealth), the max they can go into is upper-middle although it is a complete bumout really... owning class would most likely be more adept name for them.
Original post by Fullofsurprises
That really isn't true. Royalty? No. What about all the thousands and thousands of lesser titled people? And their relatives. Not to mention very wealthy landowners and business people who are not titled.

I've read a few of your other posts like this and you seem to be quite unclear about both the British and US class system from what I can see.

I have been told by a fair few British people that they are not considered upper class due to lack of title, the US class system is mostly based on wealth. I am not unclear.
Original post by tehFrance


I have been told by a fair few British people that they are not considered upper class due to lack of title, the US class system is mostly based on wealth. I am not unclear.


You said "royalty", not "titled" - huge difference. Anyway, they were confused too. The issue is what constitutes 'middle class'. Middle class people are essentially the professional orders - teachers, doctors, lawyers, etc - plus some people who earn well through their jobs and so on. They are most emphatically NOT the people who make money off money, or who own and control very substantial businesses, property - or who live off property or investments. (A few very successful middle class people have some of the latter, but it is not the basis of their success or wealth)

The inheriting, landed or substantially propertied classes are above the middle class. By 'propertied', I mean more than just owning a large house that you live in.
I think behaviour is what matters. You can have a low paid job, live in a terrace, have no garden - you will always appear civilised I'll identify with you. There's the stereotypical chav type lower class who doesn't respect other people.

I guess people take money into account as well, but I'd rather know people who are nicer than have more money.

Yes there can be larger jumps in the 'wealth gap' which clearly some people are a hell of a lot more well off than me and it can be clear, but generally it's not like that. Maybe we are all working class unless we have a substantially large house with more than three bedrooms in.

But yeah, I'm not really that sort of person who can easily identify their class simply because I don't think about it.
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by tehFrance
That is up to you to decide but while people with titles are still at the top (regardless of wealth), the max they can go into is upper-middle although it is a complete bumout really... owning class would most likely be more adept name for them.


Utterly unconvinced. It's highly likely that everything we associate with the upper class - education, etiquette, etc - is going to be available to the sons and daughters of billionaires (foreign billionaires even). That they have no royal titles is irrelevant. They are powerful, well connected and extremely wealthy. To call them middle class (even upper-middle class) as if all they have is wealth (like the early medieval merchants) when they actually run the country, is misleading.

The nobility used to be the upper class both because it was the wealthiest class (and it was) and because it wielded all the political power. That is no longer true.
Reply 250
Original post by Fullofsurprises
Well, how do you classify yourself? I think immigrants have a class from their own background in their parent country, plus an 'adopted' class identity in the country they migrate to, which can be, as you say, partly set by the way that society defines them as migrants.


Back in the parent country, they would be considered upper class, due to familial ties etc. However, I just consider myself middle class. I have middle class values (I think), a middle class upbringing, and have generally been around middle class people. I think class is determined by association to some extent. But like I say, it is hugely complicated.

It is a shame that we are a little obsessed with class in the UK, but it is deep in our national identity, even if it is considered non-PC to actually talk about it.
Original post by Cornelius
Utterly unconvinced. It's highly likely that everything we associate with the upper class - education, etiquette, etc - is going to be available to the sons and daughters of billionaires (foreign billionaires even). That they have no royal titles is irrelevant. They are powerful, well connected and extremely wealthy. To call them middle class (even upper-middle class) as if all they have is wealth (like the early medieval merchants) when they actually run the country, is misleading.

The nobility used to be the upper class both because it was the wealthiest class (and it was) and because it wielded all the political power. That is no longer true.


Quite so. Good examples of non-titled upper class people are the Bransons - their son has just married a member of the traditional upper classes - Isabella Anstruther-Gough Calthorpe - and they are close friends with the young Royals and with the Curzons, the Westminsters and other top families.
(edited 11 years ago)
Reply 252
Original post by LoseSmallWinBig
I would probably describe myself as 'middle class'. My dad much runs his own hedge fund so we're talking about a seven figure salary or more. My mum comes from a well to do family, but does nothing productive and is a lady of leisure. Was a city lawyer in the past. Maybe I could be described as upper middle class, but I was not sure.

I go to probably one of the best private schools in the country, holiday abroad are reasonably frequent . I don''t think class is a big issue at all, the main issue is that people from similar backgrounds usually have more in common. One of my closet friends is working class, but the sort who won't be forever.


Think you can pretty safely say with that income and going to somewhere which I'm guessing is along the lines of St Paul's you're upper-middle! If you aren't who would be?! :tongue:
Original post by LoseSmallWinBig
I would probably describe myself as 'middle class'. My dad much runs his own hedge fund so we're talking about a seven figure salary or more. My mum comes from a well to do family, but does nothing productive and is a lady of leisure. Was a city lawyer in the past. Maybe I could be described as upper middle class, but I was not sure.

I go to probably one of the best private schools in the country, holiday abroad are reasonably frequent . I don''t think class is a big issue at all, the main issue is that people from similar backgrounds usually have more in common. One of my closet friends is working class, but the sort who won't be forever.


Do you mix a lot with upper class people? I would propose that you are heading towards being upper class given your parents and your situations.
Reply 254
Upper middle class. Why? 3 out of my 4 grandparents went to public school and university (I'd argue that education is a fairly big class indicator), as did my parents. I went to a leading private school and university. People make jokes in Latin at family dos and other people understand them and laugh. My family is well off but not particularly rich but is full of professionals - professors, lawyers, generals etc with a smattering of earned titles but nothing hereditary.
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by Data
Upper middle class. Why? 3 out of my 4 grandparents went to public school and university (I'd argue that education is a fairly big class indicator), as did my parents. I went to a leading private school and university. People make jokes in Latin at family dos and other people understand them and laugh. My family is well off but not particularly rich and full of professionals - professors, lawyers, generals etc with a smattering of earned titles but nothing hereditary.


Senior principes bellatorum in familia et tibi communis iocos Latine? Etiam, puto nos scriberet vos sicut superiorem media materia!
Upbringing/Family: Average Working
Culturally (just myself) : Lower Middle.
Reply 257
Lower middle. Only my Mum has a degree. Dad works with his hands. Live in a terrace house.
Reply 258
I think my background is middle class, but some would say my current situation is more upper working class. My family all have very respectable careers and went to university (psychologist, barrister, graphic designer, teacher etc), but my mum was the "naughty posh girl" and decided to party and not go to university. She raised me as a single parent and I live with her in my gran's house which is fairly big and in a typical middle class area. She's a nurse so earns an adequate income, not a high one. All my family, including my mum, are very cultured and enjoy the arts and literature.

I think many people these days are 'nouveau riche'. A lot of people I know live in very nice areas in very nice houses and had private education, but this is only because their parents have just acquired money through business and other such things. Their parents' parent, however, are from places not so middle class and have jobs of the lower class field.

In my opinion, social status is rather shallow and I find social climbers to be particularly irritating. Their desire to be at the top of the social ladder is completely counteracted by their lack of (natural) intelligence and contrived beliefs and activities.
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by louise9
I think my background is middle class, but some would say my current situation is more upper working class. My family all have very respectable careers and went to university (psychologist, barrister, graphic designer, teacher etc), but my mum was the "naughty posh girl" and decided to party and not go to university. She raised me as a single parent and I live with her in my gran's house which is fairly big and in a typical middle class area. She's a nurse so earns an adequate income, not a high one. All my family, including my mum, are very cultured and enjoy the arts and literature.

I think many people these days are 'nouveau riche'. A lot of people I know live in very nice areas in very nice houses and had private education, but this is only because their parents have just acquired money through business and other such things. Their parents' parent, however, are from places not so middle class and have jobs of the lower class field.

In my opinion, social status is rather shallow and I find social climbers to be particularly irritating. Their desire to be at the top of the social ladder is completely counteracted by their lack of (natural) intelligence and contrived beliefs and activities.



You would feel yourself akin to the Roman satirist Petronius, if you ever get the chance you might like to read (if you haven't already), his Satyricon and particularly the Dinner of Trimalchio section. Depicting social climbers (in this case a fabulously wealthy and gauche freed slave) is the name of the game here. It's a different period but the humour resonates.

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