Doctor Who - Discussion Thread III (no untagged future spoilers)
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Original post by Mafer
Just watched the episode and my impression - the Doctor has gotten to like to ride on something else into his 'battle' nowadays, hasn't he? - And is there something about Clara saying 'I guess the box really doesn't like me.'
There must be. She didn't have a key so it wouldn't have let her in anyway, but it's Moffat, so there'll be some significance...
I didn't mind the episode too much - although I did wonder why the Doctor decided to go for the moped instead of an indestructible tardis which could travel through time and space.
One thing which has bugged me is in the speech:
Who is the mad man to whom he is referring? This must be pre-Eccleston, since I don't remember any crazy godlike being manipulating the laws of physics during the modern series... unless I've missed something massive.
Could anyone answer?
One thing which has bugged me is in the speech:
I walked in universes where the laws of physics were devised by the mind of a mad man.
Who is the mad man to whom he is referring? This must be pre-Eccleston, since I don't remember any crazy godlike being manipulating the laws of physics during the modern series... unless I've missed something massive.
Could anyone answer?
Original post by Kagutsuchi
I didn't mind the episode too much - although I did wonder why the Doctor decided to go for the moped instead of an indestructible tardis which could travel through time and space.
One thing which has bugged me is in the speech:
Who is the mad man to whom he is referring? This must be pre-Eccleston, since I don't remember any crazy godlike being manipulating the laws of physics during the modern series... unless I've missed something massive.
Could anyone answer?
One thing which has bugged me is in the speech:
Who is the mad man to whom he is referring? This must be pre-Eccleston, since I don't remember any crazy godlike being manipulating the laws of physics during the modern series... unless I've missed something massive.
Could anyone answer?
Going to pay for a moped and not using the TARDIS was completely moronic especially as it has been shown that the TARDIS can just materialise around things.
I personally think that series 5 is the best so far probably because 10 really started to annoy me when he was whining about not wanting to die. Anyway, after series 5 I had high hopes for series 6 and I can honestly say that they were the worst set of Doctor Who episodes I had ever seen thus I stopped watching all together until 'The Bells of Saint John' a couple of weeks ago. The reason I've started watching again is to prepare for the 50th anniversary show which I hope will be the episode ever.
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(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by Kagutsuchi
I didn't mind the episode too much - although I did wonder why the Doctor decided to go for the moped instead of an indestructible tardis which could travel through time and space.
One thing which has bugged me is in the speech:
Who is the mad man to whom he is referring? This must be pre-Eccleston, since I don't remember any crazy godlike being manipulating the laws of physics during the modern series... unless I've missed something massive.
Could anyone answer?
One thing which has bugged me is in the speech:
Who is the mad man to whom he is referring? This must be pre-Eccleston, since I don't remember any crazy godlike being manipulating the laws of physics during the modern series... unless I've missed something massive.
Could anyone answer?
The doctors a mad man - a mad man with a box. He referred to himself as a mad man on the eleventh hour. hmm
.
Original post by brittanna
The doctors a mad man - a mad man with a box. He referred to himself as a mad man on the eleventh hour. hmm .
.I assumed it was Omega, during the time of the third Doctor.
Original post by The Batman
I personally think that series 5 is the best so far probably because 10 really started to annoy me when he was whining about not wanting to die. Anyway, after series 5 I had high hopes for series 6 and I can honestly say that they were the worst set of Doctor Who episodes I had ever seen thus I stopped watching all together until 'The Bells of Saint John' a couple of weeks ago. The reason I've started watching again is to prepare for the 50th anniversary show which I hope will be the episode ever.
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(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by Kings0
My major bugbear is the fact that the Doctor had to translate everything - what the hell happened to the TARDIS translation matrix? The one that gets inside your head the moment you step inside? And that's without even getting started that they blew up a sun; what the hell is going to happen to the people that live on those 7 planets?
Stefan Moffat wrote the Empty Child for God's sake, so he definitely CAN write... Jesus, Moffat, get it together. (I know this wasn't his, but he's head writer, it's his lookout)
I don't mind Oswin (I'm not crazy for her either), but I'd like this version of her to get killed off as well, just to spice things up. Then the Doctor can go back to having someone ordinary as his companion... It always feels better that way
Gotta love Matt Smith though
Stefan Moffat wrote the Empty Child for God's sake, so he definitely CAN write... Jesus, Moffat, get it together. (I know this wasn't his, but he's head writer, it's his lookout)
I don't mind Oswin (I'm not crazy for her either), but I'd like this version of her to get killed off as well, just to spice things up. Then the Doctor can go back to having someone ordinary as his companion... It always feels better that way
Gotta love Matt Smith though
^^ Agreed. I thought this episode started promisingly - it was nice to see an actual "space setting" for once - but didn't really go anywhere; the resolution/ big speech moment feels like it's been done way too much now. There were also too many moments which just didn't make sense - Clara inability to understand the moped renter being on o them. Oh, and did none of the spectators find it weird that the Doctor and Clara suddenly gatecrashed the ceremony?
I do like Moffat - the majority of my favouriet episodes from the RTD era having been written by him - but feel since he's taken over he's just tried to be too clever with big story arcs that just get boring after a while.
When we were first introduced to Clara in the Asylum of the Daleks I was looking forward to her being properly introduced; I was less enamoured with her Victorian counterpart but thought it would be interesting to see a companion not from the present day. The third incarnation we've seen has potential but it's not really been developed yet - at the moment, she just feels like a manifestation of the some of the previous ones.
Urgh, the last episode was awful. Writing has gone downhill since Tenant and Piper were around.
Original post by Mess.
Going to pay for a moped and not using the TARDIS was completely moronic especially as it has been shown that the TARDIS can just materialise around things.
Precisely. Not having time to reach the Tardis isn't an excuse either, seen as the Tardis could travel through time and space to catch the girl. Seems like a cop out plot short cut.
Original post by brittanna
The doctors a mad man - a mad man with a box. He referred to himself as a mad man on the eleventh hour. hmm .
.But the doctor never - to my knowledge - manipulated the laws of physics... Did he?
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by Kagutsuchi
Precisely. Not having time to reach the Tardis isn't an excuse either, seen as the Tardis could travel through time and space to catch the girl. Seems like a cop out plot short cut.
But the doctor never - to my knowledge - manipulated the laws of physics... Did he?
But the doctor never - to my knowledge - manipulated the laws of physics... Did he?
I'm sure it was said in an episode that once the Doctor has become involved in the timeline, he can't just skip into the TARDIS and go backwards/forwards in time.
Also, I remember an episode, I think for one of the early Doctors, where there was a place called Toyland which was run by the Toymaker, and he could change anything and everything in that land. He was quite a crazy son of a gun, so perhaps that's the madman mentioned.
Original post by Mess.
I thought the exact same thing with the translation. Ridiculous.
I thought that it was a bit racist that the only people who Clara understood was the species who looked a bit human-ey.
(edited 11 years ago)
Original post by rainbow drops
My problems with the Matt Smith era aren't really to do with individual episodes being bad; they're bigger issues that tend to negatively affect every single episode. The writing and characterisation are the most glaring problems.
I think the dialogue is forced and awkward (I'm talking about all the ridiculously irritating in-jokes, banter and ~super quirky witty cutesy phrases~) and that's consistent in every single episode. It's so prevalent that it damages my perceptions of the characters. I could never bring myself to care about Rory and Amy because their dialogue was so cartoonish and convoluted that it made them seem less 'real' compared to more believable companions like Rose and Martha. River is the most extreme example of this; she's like a walking, talking, cliched phrasebook. It's SO irritating to watch. I know Doctor Who is fantastical as a concept but it definitely doesn't mean that the characters' personalities have to be, and the show suffers massively as a result, in my opinion.
I also really dislike the way in which Moffat writes women, which tends to be a very common complaint that reviewers etc have about this era of the show. I was hoping he would change his predictable writing up a bit and make Clara less of a quirky, excitable, flirtsy, mysterious Doctor groupie, but she seems exactly like Amy so far in that respect, which is really disappointing. Female companions do not have to be that way. People loved Donna so much precisely because she wasn't, IMO. I know River isn't a companion, but she's written terribly, and is easily the most irritating character I've ever seen on a TV show.
So yeah, if my issues were more to do with plot, I'd probably carry on watching, because it's always been the case that some Doctor Who storylines/monsters/etc are weaker than others. I think the plots have definitely been weaker of late, but it's the general tone that's my biggest issue, and because it's so present in every single episode, I don't like the show any more. I've given it so many chances, but I simply don't like it. I feel pretty sad and frustrated about it because I used to love it, but it's obvious that Moffat won't change his direction any time soon, so never mind!
Thanks for your post you raised some interesting points.
I think the dialogue is forced and awkward (I'm talking about all the ridiculously irritating in-jokes, banter and ~super quirky witty cutesy phrases~) and that's consistent in every single episode. It's so prevalent that it damages my perceptions of the characters. I could never bring myself to care about Rory and Amy because their dialogue was so cartoonish and convoluted that it made them seem less 'real' compared to more believable companions like Rose and Martha. River is the most extreme example of this; she's like a walking, talking, cliched phrasebook. It's SO irritating to watch. I know Doctor Who is fantastical as a concept but it definitely doesn't mean that the characters' personalities have to be, and the show suffers massively as a result, in my opinion.
I also really dislike the way in which Moffat writes women, which tends to be a very common complaint that reviewers etc have about this era of the show. I was hoping he would change his predictable writing up a bit and make Clara less of a quirky, excitable, flirtsy, mysterious Doctor groupie, but she seems exactly like Amy so far in that respect, which is really disappointing. Female companions do not have to be that way. People loved Donna so much precisely because she wasn't, IMO. I know River isn't a companion, but she's written terribly, and is easily the most irritating character I've ever seen on a TV show.
So yeah, if my issues were more to do with plot, I'd probably carry on watching, because it's always been the case that some Doctor Who storylines/monsters/etc are weaker than others. I think the plots have definitely been weaker of late, but it's the general tone that's my biggest issue, and because it's so present in every single episode, I don't like the show any more. I've given it so many chances, but I simply don't like it. I feel pretty sad and frustrated about it because I used to love it, but it's obvious that Moffat won't change his direction any time soon, so never mind!
Thanks for your post
you raised some interesting points.I feel exactly the same way for everything you've written. Also, the Doctor's too childish (and child-friendly), whereas for Tennant's Doctor, him for being child-friendly was subtle and you could tell without it being shoved in your face every 3 minutes.
I'm certain the madman was Omega now- in the episode "the three doctors" all 3 of the first 3 doctors had to battle Omega, a legendary time-lord who'd got trapped in an anti-matter universe and gone mad. They had to go into that universe, which Omega (the mad man) was able to manipulate.
"Actually, I think I may have made a bit of a tactical boo boo." I've never screamed with laughter before. I just came very close.
With regards to the episode in general, I think Matt Smith really shone although the storyline was a bit nondescript. His best episode for a while in terms of acting I think (and I usually think he's pretty damned good). That scene, with the three of them, just after 'grandfather' awoke was just brilliant. Jenna was good - I'm going to like her, I think - but she needs a bit of time to settle into the role. There was something missing, although I'm not sure what.
Also, note: "my stars" appeared quite a lot. Obviously Clara is meant to have picked it up from her mother but I'm wondering whether there's any significance...
With regards to the episode in general, I think Matt Smith really shone although the storyline was a bit nondescript. His best episode for a while in terms of acting I think (and I usually think he's pretty damned good). That scene, with the three of them, just after 'grandfather' awoke was just brilliant. Jenna was good - I'm going to like her, I think - but she needs a bit of time to settle into the role. There was something missing, although I'm not sure what.
Also, note: "my stars" appeared quite a lot. Obviously Clara is meant to have picked it up from her mother but I'm wondering whether there's any significance...
(edited 11 years ago)
Really disappointed in the latest episode. The story didn't really make any sense and was poorly explained. The Doctor seems to only ever use either his sonic screwdriver, or his own importance, to solve problems nowadays. I fondly remember episodes where Ten would spend most of the time working on fixing some complicated technical machine, rather than just one burst with the sonic fixing everything. And the speech in this episode was even more overdramatic and cheesy than usual.
Oh and one more thing: the leaf in this episode was not the same leaf as was in Clara's book last week.
Basic continuity really shouldn't be a difficult thing to achieve. It seems to be yet another sign of a worsening show.
Oh and one more thing: the leaf in this episode was not the same leaf as was in Clara's book last week.
Basic continuity really shouldn't be a difficult thing to achieve. It seems to be yet another sign of a worsening show.
Original post by Watch Key Phone
Really disappointed in the latest episode. The story didn't really make any sense and was poorly explained. The Doctor seems to only ever use either his sonic screwdriver, or his own importance, to solve problems nowadays. I fondly remember episodes where Ten would spend most of the time working on fixing some complicated technical machine, rather than just one burst with the sonic fixing everything. And the speech in this episode was even more overdramatic and cheesy than usual.
Oh and one more thing: the leaf in this episode was not the same leaf as was in Clara's book last week.
Basic continuity really shouldn't be a difficult thing to achieve. It seems to be yet another sign of a worsening show.
Oh and one more thing: the leaf in this episode was not the same leaf as was in Clara's book last week.
Basic continuity really shouldn't be a difficult thing to achieve. It seems to be yet another sign of a worsening show.
Who says the two leaves were meant to be the same? I can never accuse the directors/producers/whoever of being imprecise.
Original post by Rascacielos
Who says the two leaves were meant to be the same? I can never accuse the directors/producers/whoever of being imprecise.
She took the leaf out of her book. The same book where the Doctor found the leaf in the last episode. I don't think this one is really excusable to be honest.
Saw this on twitter, sums feelings up
"Steven Moffat spent each of the two full series of Doctor Who that he’s written thus far ramping up to the finales by bashing you over the head with entirely inscrutable questions to keep you hostage and forming an almost creepy and pathological contract with the viewers that if you suffer through all the substance-free trash on the way to that episode, you’d be rewarded with an entirely satisfying answer
And you never are, both times it’s just been The Doctor solving all the problems encountered by simply resetting the universe so that none of said problems happened or ever will happen but everyone conveniently remembers the events prior to the reset anyway
Which is honestly from precisely the same camp as any awful movie you’ve seen ending with the revelation that this is all just a comatose fugue state dream
In a way it’s actually more insulting to me because it’s like Steven Moffat doesn’t expect me to have the critical thinking skills to work out that what he’s doing is not the smarter alternative to that sort of bull**** ending
I don’t know if I have the energy to hang in there until he steps down as head writer but I have to believe the show can recover and become relatively decent again after"
Source: http://liamdryden.tumblr.com/post/47379720109/confusedtree-steven-moffat-spent-each-of-the
"Steven Moffat spent each of the two full series of Doctor Who that he’s written thus far ramping up to the finales by bashing you over the head with entirely inscrutable questions to keep you hostage and forming an almost creepy and pathological contract with the viewers that if you suffer through all the substance-free trash on the way to that episode, you’d be rewarded with an entirely satisfying answer
And you never are, both times it’s just been The Doctor solving all the problems encountered by simply resetting the universe so that none of said problems happened or ever will happen but everyone conveniently remembers the events prior to the reset anyway
Which is honestly from precisely the same camp as any awful movie you’ve seen ending with the revelation that this is all just a comatose fugue state dream
In a way it’s actually more insulting to me because it’s like Steven Moffat doesn’t expect me to have the critical thinking skills to work out that what he’s doing is not the smarter alternative to that sort of bull**** ending
I don’t know if I have the energy to hang in there until he steps down as head writer but I have to believe the show can recover and become relatively decent again after"
Source: http://liamdryden.tumblr.com/post/47379720109/confusedtree-steven-moffat-spent-each-of-the
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