Who is better? Ferguson or Mourinho?
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I am bias as a United fan but SAF is in a league of his own compared to Mourinho. If we want to compare great manager with SAF then you need to be talking with the likes of Hitzfeld and Trapattoni.
I feel that Mourinho has the potential to be regarded as one of the best, just not yet. I would like to see him build a team over time. His best chance so far was Chelsea I think. It's quite scary to think how good they could have become if he had made it work with RA.
I feel that Mourinho has the potential to be regarded as one of the best, just not yet. I would like to see him build a team over time. His best chance so far was Chelsea I think. It's quite scary to think how good they could have become if he had made it work with RA.
Original post by Wilfred Little
It's clearly Ferguson.
Anybody who thinks Mourinho is better than Ferguson should be banned. Mourinho is an average manager who uses his motivational skills and great tactical knowledge to good effect and then jumps ship before he's found out and people realise he actually knows very little about football compared to the greats. None of his transfers are that great either, they're just a case of signing obvious great players who then develop at the team he's at. He doesn't know how to make a team play attractive football.
Anybody who thinks Mourinho is better than Ferguson should be banned. Mourinho is an average manager who uses his motivational skills and great tactical knowledge to good effect and then jumps ship before he's found out and people realise he actually knows very little about football compared to the greats. None of his transfers are that great either, they're just a case of signing obvious great players who then develop at the team he's at. He doesn't know how to make a team play attractive football.
He's a manager! Both of those are things that make a manager great!
What do you expect? For him to actually get out on the field and score goals?
Original post by Cable
These guys are two of the greatest of all time and have given me many fond memories. I acknowledge that there are other great managers (e.g. Del Bosque, Cappello back in the day, Paisley etc) but I'm assuming that most guys on TSR would have more knowledge on Jose and Fergie than other great managers and better knowledge at that since they would have witnessed Fergie and Jose at their best in the last one or two decades (but they wouldn't have the best and clearest knowledge on someone like Happel or Trappattoni).
I personally think Jose is a better manager/coach than Fergie. I know Fergie is greater (more trophies) but I think Jose is better.
Why? It depends on how you define what is a good manager/coach.
My criteria is this: Trophies won, man-management skills, tactical nous, ability to build great teams and ability to rebuild teams.
1) Trophies won: Fergie = Mourinho
2) Man-management skills: Mourinho > Fergie
3) Tactical nous: Mourinho > Fergie
4) Ability to build great teams: Fergie > Mourinho
5) Ability to rebuild teams. Fergie > Mourinho
So yeah, I feel Mourinho is slightly better than Fergie. But that doesn't diminish the fact that they are both exceptional managers and we have been lucky to be alive to witness both of them. Yes, they have their flaws and can be ****s sometimes (Jose particularly). But their achievements in the game deserves serious respect.
Who do you think is the better manager between Fergie and Mourinho? Vote in the poll. And what are your reasons?
I personally think Jose is a better manager/coach than Fergie. I know Fergie is greater (more trophies) but I think Jose is better.
Why? It depends on how you define what is a good manager/coach.
My criteria is this: Trophies won, man-management skills, tactical nous, ability to build great teams and ability to rebuild teams.
1) Trophies won: Fergie = Mourinho
Spoiler
2) Man-management skills: Mourinho > Fergie
Spoiler
3) Tactical nous: Mourinho > Fergie
Spoiler
4) Ability to build great teams: Fergie > Mourinho
Spoiler
5) Ability to rebuild teams. Fergie > Mourinho
Spoiler
So yeah, I feel Mourinho is slightly better than Fergie. But that doesn't diminish the fact that they are both exceptional managers and we have been lucky to be alive to witness both of them. Yes, they have their flaws and can be ****s sometimes (Jose particularly). But their achievements in the game deserves serious respect.
Who do you think is the better manager between Fergie and Mourinho? Vote in the poll. And what are your reasons?
Ferguson's man management skills are undoubtedly better than Mourinho's. Despite what the media portray him as he is close to almost all of his past players and pretty much makes Utd. The few players he's had disagreements with have all left and no player tries to challenge him. Mourinho isn't exactly popular at RM. Sergio Ramos and Casillas have both fallen out with him and with being two of the biggest players in the team that would surely have an effect on the players around them too.
Original post by jam277
Superb squad, with the likes of chelsea, barca and madrid with better squads that year. They peaked at the same time and they had the potential to win it(like arsenal did around 04-09) but they were not the strongest team. Inter's squad would not have got past the quarter finals without mourinho's guidance.
Disagree. Mourinho's tactics were obviously important but I think you're doing that team an injustice by saying they wouldn't have got past the quarter finals when you consider they had players at the top of their game (Milito, Eto'o, Sneidjer, Maicon etc). I think Barca had a better squad for sure, but the other 2 are very debatable imo.
In regards to Jose's influence on Inter, granted they had a very good squad who hit their form and peak at the right time. But it's the case with any excellent assembled squad - they still need a good manager to guide them through to trophies.
A great example is Jose's work at Chelsea. Took over Ranieri's squad, brought players in and made them back-to-back PL champions and domestic trophies but sadly failed in Europe. It's a combination of both.
Would the Inter squad with anyone but Mourinho have won the CL? Would anyone but Jose have galvanised the squad spirit and focus to guide them through a tough semi-final against Barcelona? You can imagine what was said prior to those two matches with Barcelona considering Mourinho's great link with them and how he felt he was treated etc.
As good as the Inter squad was, they couldn't have won the CL without Mourinho IMO.
A great example is Jose's work at Chelsea. Took over Ranieri's squad, brought players in and made them back-to-back PL champions and domestic trophies but sadly failed in Europe. It's a combination of both.
Would the Inter squad with anyone but Mourinho have won the CL? Would anyone but Jose have galvanised the squad spirit and focus to guide them through a tough semi-final against Barcelona? You can imagine what was said prior to those two matches with Barcelona considering Mourinho's great link with them and how he felt he was treated etc.
As good as the Inter squad was, they couldn't have won the CL without Mourinho IMO.
Original post by Jordan_1
Is everyone forgetting what Ferguson did with Aberdeen? Mourinho could never do something like that.
Oh and Ferguson's man management is far better.
Oh and Ferguson's man management is far better.
Porto
Fergies man management isn't really the best either. Beckham, van nistelrooy but I'd give him that over mourinho. Mourinho did a similar thing at porto to what fergie did at aberdeen though if not arguably better. Fergie had a fairly poor first season at aberdeen(they were second the previous season and he came 4th and trophyless) while mourinho came first in his first full season at porto, came 3rd when his team were 5th at the time of his porto appointment and has the highest ever finish to this day at União de Leiria who came 5th. If anything mourinho's achievements are better.
In fact mourinho's trophy haul and trophy rate actually beats fergie coming to think of it just that fergie has been managing for longer so obviously has more trophies.
Original post by jam277
Porto
Fergies man management isn't really the best either. Beckham, van nistelrooy but I'd give him that over mourinho. Mourinho did a similar thing at porto to what fergie did at aberdeen though if not arguably better. Fergie had a fairly poor first season at aberdeen(they were second the previous season and he came 4th and trophyless) while mourinho came first in his first full season at porto, came 3rd when his team were 5th at the time of his porto appointment and has the highest ever finish to this day at União de Leiria who came 5th. If anything mourinho's achievements are better.
In fact mourinho's trophy haul and trophy rate actually beats fergie coming to think of it just that fergie has been managing for longer so obviously has more trophies.
Fergies man management isn't really the best either. Beckham, van nistelrooy but I'd give him that over mourinho. Mourinho did a similar thing at porto to what fergie did at aberdeen though if not arguably better. Fergie had a fairly poor first season at aberdeen(they were second the previous season and he came 4th and trophyless) while mourinho came first in his first full season at porto, came 3rd when his team were 5th at the time of his porto appointment and has the highest ever finish to this day at União de Leiria who came 5th. If anything mourinho's achievements are better.
In fact mourinho's trophy haul and trophy rate actually beats fergie coming to think of it just that fergie has been managing for longer so obviously has more trophies.
I'd argue the Aberdeen was better. Ferguson managed to stop the 2 horse race and won three league championships, Drybrough Cup, Scottish Cup 4 times, the European Cup Winner's Cup, the European Super Cup and a League Cup – in 7 years.
Plus quite a few people will argue that Porto were very fortunate to win the CL...
Mourinho didn't stay there very long either, lets be honest he never does. Why is that?
Personally I think remaining at a team and making sure they continue their success is better than continually changing clubs.
Original post by Jordan_1
I'd argue the Aberdeen was better. Ferguson managed to stop the 2 horse race and won three league championships, Drybrough Cup, Scottish Cup 4 times, the European Cup Winner's Cup, the European Super Cup and a League Cup – in 7 years.
Plus quite a few people will argue that Porto were very fortunate to win the CL...
Mourinho didn't stay there very long either, lets be honest he never does. Why is that?
Personally I think remaining at a team and making sure they continue their success is better than continually changing clubs.
Plus quite a few people will argue that Porto were very fortunate to win the CL...
Mourinho didn't stay there very long either, lets be honest he never does. Why is that?
Personally I think remaining at a team and making sure they continue their success is better than continually changing clubs.
Well, porto were fortunate however he won two european trophies in two years. It's unprecedented, not even guardiola with that barca team has done that in recent times. The closest person to doing that was alex ferguson. Maybe AVB had he not been sacked but it's a great feat regardless of the luck involved, plus he beat monaco(who had good players at the time and had beaten real madrid and chelsea in the run up to the final)
Mourinho didn't stay there long because he wanted to go onto a bigger stage. Lets be honest if abramovich offered you loads of funds to build a super team you'd take it in a flash. He wanted to go on a bigger stage at porto. You don't get time at chelsea(he's our longest serving manager in the past 8 years, you don't get time at inter milan(moratti is another abramovich and mancini got sacked for winning the league there and mourinho's time in that league was up) and you don't get time at real madrid(he's another long serving manager to a team that sacked a manager for winning the champions league, sacked a manager for winning the league too defensively and sacked a manager for winning the CL because he was 'too old' the guy's now managed the greatest ever international side to 2 concecutive trophies)
Yeah mourinho needs to stay at a club. He wants to manage portugal in the future though. If he wins them a world cup/euro when he has the current trophy rate he has now then there's no argument for SAF being better but until that day comes there will be doubts.
lol at everyone who voted Mourinho in this thread.
http://www.101greatgoals.com/blog/mourinho-does-a-rafa-with-facts-on-a-crib-sheet-21-years-18-coaches-5-semis-ive-had-3-in-3-years/
Sitting in a press conference and reading out the names of 18 former Real Madrid managers is pathetic and the sort of thing Benitez would do (in fact, he did something very similar and got the piss taken out of him.)
He thinks he's being clever but all he's done is highlight the fact he's lost 5 semi finals out of 7. With the squad he has, he should have made the final once with Madrid.
He is becoming an increasingly sad bastard.
Better than Fergie
http://www.101greatgoals.com/blog/mourinho-does-a-rafa-with-facts-on-a-crib-sheet-21-years-18-coaches-5-semis-ive-had-3-in-3-years/
Sitting in a press conference and reading out the names of 18 former Real Madrid managers is pathetic and the sort of thing Benitez would do (in fact, he did something very similar and got the piss taken out of him.)
He thinks he's being clever but all he's done is highlight the fact he's lost 5 semi finals out of 7. With the squad he has, he should have made the final once with Madrid.
He is becoming an increasingly sad bastard.
Better than Fergie
Do people really believe that mourinho is a better manager than ferguson.
Granted the trophy count mourinho has is impressive and will most likely surpass feguson, the ability to sustain a club at the upper echelons of football whilst instilling your own philosophy on the club is not to be underestimated. Look at how coaches work on the continent they build a team, win trophies and leave look at Guardiola mourinho anchelotti Capello etc. they all believe ferguson is the greatest manager because they can't imagine rebuilding teams and sustaining success it's just not done. Even looking at English teams wenger has shown how hard ferguson s job has been.
I can't believe this is even in question what ferguson has done may never be repeated again in a time where football managers aren't given any time.
Granted the trophy count mourinho has is impressive and will most likely surpass feguson, the ability to sustain a club at the upper echelons of football whilst instilling your own philosophy on the club is not to be underestimated. Look at how coaches work on the continent they build a team, win trophies and leave look at Guardiola mourinho anchelotti Capello etc. they all believe ferguson is the greatest manager because they can't imagine rebuilding teams and sustaining success it's just not done. Even looking at English teams wenger has shown how hard ferguson s job has been.
I can't believe this is even in question what ferguson has done may never be repeated again in a time where football managers aren't given any time.
With regards to trophies it would be quite easy to calculate an average number of trophies per season managing, which would give a better gage. Also as OP said the scale of Mourinho winning leagues in so many different countries, coupled with having won the same number of Champions Leagues and been much more consistent in the CL for me tips it Mourinho's way.
Original post by craglyboy
Do people really believe that mourinho is a better manager than ferguson.
On here they do.
Granted the trophy count mourinho has is impressive and will most likely surpass feguson, the ability to sustain a club at the upper echelons of football whilst instilling your own philosophy on the club is not to be underestimated. Look at how coaches work on the continent they build a team, win trophies and leave look at Guardiola mourinho anchelotti Capello etc. they all believe ferguson is the greatest manager because they can't imagine rebuilding teams and sustaining success it's just not done. Even looking at English teams wenger has shown how hard ferguson s job has been.
I can't believe this is even in question what ferguson has done may never be repeated again in a time where football managers aren't given any time.
I can't believe this is even in question what ferguson has done may never be repeated again in a time where football managers aren't given any time.
This is what I'm saying. In the last 6 years, Man. United have been beaten on points ONCE in the league. That was 1 point as well, and up against the billions of Chelsea and Manchester City. The sheer consistency of Ferguson and his team is absolutely frightening.
Mourinho has zero sustainability. He's basically the Rolls Royce of impact managers.
Mourinho
Ferguson is better. He brings the young players through, holds on to the right older players to help out with coaching so he consistently puts out good teams on a very good budget. He also sells players when their ego gets too big to maintain good dressing room harmony.
Don't even support Man Utd.
Don't even support Man Utd.
Original post by jam277
Well, porto were fortunate however he won two european trophies in two years. It's unprecedented, not even guardiola with that barca team has done that in recent times. The closest person to doing that was alex ferguson. Maybe AVB had he not been sacked but it's a great feat regardless of the luck involved, plus he beat monaco(who had good players at the time and had beaten real madrid and chelsea in the run up to the final)
Mourinho didn't stay there long because he wanted to go onto a bigger stage. Lets be honest if abramovich offered you loads of funds to build a super team you'd take it in a flash. He wanted to go on a bigger stage at porto. You don't get time at chelsea(he's our longest serving manager in the past 8 years, you don't get time at inter milan(moratti is another abramovich and mancini got sacked for winning the league there and mourinho's time in that league was up) and you don't get time at real madrid(he's another long serving manager to a team that sacked a manager for winning the champions league, sacked a manager for winning the league too defensively and sacked a manager for winning the CL because he was 'too old' the guy's now managed the greatest ever international side to 2 concecutive trophies)
Yeah mourinho needs to stay at a club. He wants to manage portugal in the future though. If he wins them a world cup/euro when he has the current trophy rate he has now then there's no argument for SAF being better but until that day comes there will be doubts.
Mourinho didn't stay there long because he wanted to go onto a bigger stage. Lets be honest if abramovich offered you loads of funds to build a super team you'd take it in a flash. He wanted to go on a bigger stage at porto. You don't get time at chelsea(he's our longest serving manager in the past 8 years, you don't get time at inter milan(moratti is another abramovich and mancini got sacked for winning the league there and mourinho's time in that league was up) and you don't get time at real madrid(he's another long serving manager to a team that sacked a manager for winning the champions league, sacked a manager for winning the league too defensively and sacked a manager for winning the CL because he was 'too old' the guy's now managed the greatest ever international side to 2 concecutive trophies)
Yeah mourinho needs to stay at a club. He wants to manage portugal in the future though. If he wins them a world cup/euro when he has the current trophy rate he has now then there's no argument for SAF being better but until that day comes there will be doubts.
Mourinho left Chelsea because of the meddling from abramovich but mourinho left Porto because he knew he had achieved everything and that his team was going to get torn apart, he would have to rebuild which is what he has never EVER done. Moved to Chelsea was successful moved on when the team went past its peak again instead of rebuilding. Inter he did an incredible job achieved the treble was amazing tactical and motivational work, but again left when the team needed rebuilding. Then onto Madrid where you have to say he has been poor, with a pretty much bottomless pocket the team haven't lived up to expectation due to discontent in the ranks that he has been unable to control just look at his spats with the president Ramos and Casillas.
I think you have to have to look at the timing of each departure of mourinho and say he knows when he's got everything he can out of a particular team. Looking at Porto they have never had as good a team as the one mourinho had, Chelsea are still battling with rebuilding a squad with out the spine of mourinho side, and inter have been decimated, it will be interesting to see how Real Madrid d react to his departure this year.
Where as fergie has built and rebuilt he has made the tough decisions in getting rid of players be it right or wrong and instilled a philosophy in the club, I don't think you can say mourinho has had that impact on a club yet.
The fact that no one has done what fergie has done but there have been other managers who have been successful in multiple leagues (granted not that many)
Mourinho is best of the rest IMO but fergie is a different league, not just for trophies but for the way he has built the club and kept it successful.
Original post by sugar-n-spice
Ferguson is better. He brings the young players through, holds on to the right older players to help out with coaching so he consistently puts out good teams on a very good budget. He also sells players when their ego gets too big to maintain good dressing room harmony.
Don't even support Man Utd.
Don't even support Man Utd.
Ferguson should have listened to the toss pots in 2005 who said Giggs should retire. United would have won the league 4 times and went to the CL final three times, winning one of them, if only Ferguson had just released him.
Original post by craglyboy
Mourinho left Chelsea because of the meddling from abramovich but mourinho left Porto because he knew he had achieved everything and that his team was going to get torn apart, he would have to rebuild which is what he has never EVER done. Moved to Chelsea was successful moved on when the team went past its peak again instead of rebuilding. Inter he did an incredible job achieved the treble was amazing tactical and motivational work, but again left when the team needed rebuilding. Then onto Madrid where you have to say he has been poor, with a pretty much bottomless pocket the team haven't lived up to expectation due to discontent in the ranks that he has been unable to control just look at his spats with the president Ramos and Casillas.
I think you have to have to look at the timing of each departure of mourinho and say he knows when he's got everything he can out of a particular team. Looking at Porto they have never had as good a team as the one mourinho had, Chelsea are still battling with rebuilding a squad with out the spine of mourinho side, and inter have been decimated, it will be interesting to see how Real Madrid d react to his departure this year.
Where as fergie has built and rebuilt he has made the tough decisions in getting rid of players be it right or wrong and instilled a philosophy in the club, I don't think you can say mourinho has had that impact on a club yet.
The fact that no one has done what fergie has done but there have been other managers who have been successful in multiple leagues (granted not that many)
Mourinho is best of the rest IMO but fergie is a different league, not just for trophies but for the way he has built the club and kept it successful.
I think you have to have to look at the timing of each departure of mourinho and say he knows when he's got everything he can out of a particular team. Looking at Porto they have never had as good a team as the one mourinho had, Chelsea are still battling with rebuilding a squad with out the spine of mourinho side, and inter have been decimated, it will be interesting to see how Real Madrid d react to his departure this year.
Where as fergie has built and rebuilt he has made the tough decisions in getting rid of players be it right or wrong and instilled a philosophy in the club, I don't think you can say mourinho has had that impact on a club yet.
The fact that no one has done what fergie has done but there have been other managers who have been successful in multiple leagues (granted not that many)
Mourinho is best of the rest IMO but fergie is a different league, not just for trophies but for the way he has built the club and kept it successful.
He left because of meddling from abramovich. So why are you saying that he left because the teams time was up. It clearly wasn't up as we got to a CL final the year he left, a CL semi final the year after, won the double the year after. So it had a good 4 years he could use up.
With porto, what was the point if he was going to lose all his players? He's playing in a weak league and wanted to go to a bigger stage. I don't see what's wrong with that. He could have stayed at porto and carried on winning league titles but he was never going to win another CL maybe an EL but what's that to him. With inter that was an interesting situation. Yes I feel he saw that the team was past it's peak but tbh if madrid ask you to take the job most people would take it. He saw a big job was available and decided to take it. I think he should stay at madrid to finish business and doubters.
With madrid it's a very hard job to manage. Probably harder than the chelsea job. It's hard to keep the fans happy, play attacking football, win trophies and keep a job even if you've done all 4 of them(vincent del bosque) or 2/3 of them like capello/heynckes.
Original post by Lunch_Box
Mourinho's success is built on the ability to throw money at problems.
Funnily enough that his champions leagues have come with two teams that didn't have a lot of money at the time... But hey just spout it because a few other people have said it.
Anyway, in terms of a tactical manager mourinho is clearly the better one. In terms of the general running of a football club it has to go to ferguson. He's the best at running a football club, bringing players through etc. Bar porto I don't think mourinho has brought a single player through the youth squads of his teams, balotelli may count but mancini started bringing him through in the first place.
(edited 10 years ago)
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