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Reply 20
Original post by ilovecake123
i never said that? its not their fault (2 loving adults) that they have faulty genes and they probably do not know that they will produce disabled kids however with incest couples it is highly likely they will produce disabled children


This is the 21st century. Many people know because healthcare services is more advanced and people can see evidence from their family issues/history. They might have had 2/3 brothers or cousins or aunties that have had the hereditary issues, are we going to now say we would not allow such people procreate?

Secondly, it is not highly likely with incest couples. It is actually remote.

Only when it becomes a long term culture, i.e. repeatedly practiced by the same family over many generations, that it is highly likely. If a brother and sister procreates, the chance of them having a disabled child is very low. As their kids do the same and their grandkids do the same is when the probability is highly likely.

This is the kind of misinformation, lack of knowledge and unnecessary public alarm that made people object to homosexuality.
Reply 21
Original post by John Stuart Mill
Ok so incest is wrong, and these are the current arguments.

- Inbreeding leads to child defects etc (good argument)
- It's gross.

So can anyone provide any rational arguments against incest that are not having children other than it's gross? surely this is the same as calling homosexuals gross and therefore not acceptable?


The inbreeding argument is just a misinformed public alarm.

We can't allow homosexuality and justify discrimination against incest.
Original post by LutherVan
This is the 21st century. Many people know because healthcare services is more advanced and people can see evidence from their family issues/history. They might have had 2/3 brothers or cousins or aunties that have had the hereditary issues, are we going to now say we would not allow such people procreate?

Secondly, it is not highly likely with incest couples. It is actually remote.

Only when it becomes a long term culture, i.e. repeatedly practiced by the same family over many generations, that it is highly likely. If a brother and sister procreates, the chance of them having a disabled child is very low. As their kids do the same and their grandkids do the same is when the probability is highly likely.

This is the kind of misinformation, lack of knowledge and unnecessary public alarm that made people object to homosexuality.


ok i dont care it sounds like your an incest considering you agree with it :s-smilie: :L
Original post by ilovecake123
ok i dont care it sounds like your an incest considering you agree with it :s-smilie: :L


logical fallacy - just because someone agrees with homosexuality doesn't mean they're a homosexual does it?

the argument is severely based on bigotry, if you accept homosexuality I have no idea how one can disagree with incest when it is based on the same premise.
Original post by John Stuart Mill
logical fallacy - just because someone agrees with homosexuality doesn't mean they're a homosexual does it?

the argument is severely based on bigotry, if you accept homosexuality I have no idea how one can disagree with incest when it is based on the same premise.


i dont understand what your saying...:s-smilie:
i dont care people have their own opinions you should respect that.
being an incest is not being homosexual?
Original post by ilovecake123
i dont understand what your saying...:s-smilie:
i dont care people have their own opinions you should respect that.
being an incest is not being homosexual?


i'll try to clarify - it is logically correct to justify incest with the same argument used to justify homosexuality - that is that people should be allowed to do whatever they want providing it doesn't harm other people. You can have your own opinions; the problem is in the real world this 'politically correct' everyone is right crap doesn't work against the rigour of logic and science; think what you want but justify it if you're to do so, otherwise it's not an opinion it's just wrong.
Original post by John Stuart Mill
i'll try to clarify - it is logically correct to justify incest with the same argument used to justify homosexuality - that is that people should be allowed to do whatever they want providing it doesn't harm other people. You can have your own opinions; the problem is in the real world this 'politically correct' everyone is right crap doesn't work against the rigour of logic and science; think what you want but justify it if you're to do so, otherwise it's not an opinion it's just wrong.


you can think what you want to think regardless if you can justify it, its your own morals and beliefs. i dont care what you think im just stating my opinion.
Reply 27
Incest is best put your sisters to the test
Reply 28
I'm not sure I have an opinion but I don't agree with it. It has some not so good consequences so I think that says something...
But then to each their own.
Reply 29
Original post by John Stuart Mill
Ok so incest is wrong, and these are the current arguments.

- Inbreeding leads to child defects etc (good argument)
- It's gross.

So can anyone provide any rational arguments against incest that are not having children other than it's gross? surely this is the same as calling homosexuals gross and therefore not acceptable?


Even the defects one isn't a great arguemtn as nobody has any issue with genetically defective people having kids.

I think it's looked down apon for the same reasons as homosexuality used to be.
My problem with incest (and I do believe this is a rational objection) is that it's often not between two consenting adults. Generally, you will find one party is younger and more impressionable and sometimes misunderstand their feelings for a sibling/family member which are manifested in an incestuous way because of pressure from the older party.

Apologies, I appreciate this is fairly anecdotal but I'm a little too busy to find some concrete stats and figures, but I feel it is a logically likely situation. Certainly in cases where the people involved have known each other for years, it's extremely likely there will be an age gap, and entirely possible that the younger person has been exploited.

As a concept, I don't have a problem with heterosexual relationship provided no one is being taken advantage of, if someone is then I morally have a problem with it. The same goes with incestuous relationships and I think, almost by definition, it's a lot more likely that someone is going to have their emotions manipulated.

If that isn't the case and its an instance between 2 adults (and has always been between two adults) and both adults are clearly consensual, then I don't see why it's anyone's business.
Anyone gonna admit to having a sexy cousin?
Reply 32
Original post by StretfordEnd
My problem with incest (and I do believe this is a rational objection) is that it's often not between two consenting adults. Generally, you will find one party is younger and more impressionable and sometimes misunderstand their feelings for a sibling/family member which are manifested in an incestuous way because of pressure from the older party.

Apologies, I appreciate this is fairly anecdotal but I'm a little too busy to find some concrete stats and figures, but I feel it is a logically likely situation. Certainly in cases where the people involved have known each other for years, it's extremely likely there will be an age gap, and entirely possible that the younger person has been exploited.

As a concept, I don't have a problem with heterosexual relationship provided no one is being taken advantage of, if someone is then I morally have a problem with it. The same goes with incestuous relationships and I think, almost by definition, it's a lot more likely that someone is going to have their emotions manipulated.

If that isn't the case and its an instance between 2 adults (and has always been between two adults) and both adults are clearly consensual, then I don't see why it's anyone's business.


Your suspicion of cases not being between consenting adults is not a rational objection to justify discriminating against 2 consenting adults rights to choose who they want to be with.

That is as lame as saying because sometimes women are forced into polygamy, we should apply an overall ban on all consenting Muslims from practicing polygamy.

If you feel a wrong has been done, tackle that singular case, Not apply a blanket ban.

Child abuse is different from incest. Just as child abuse is different from homosexuality.

If they are consenting adults, in the 21st Century, you have to allow them to do what they wish as long as they are not harming anyone. That is our value system in the West. We are not Russia.
My thoughts? Eugh thats plain disgusting and i dont know why it isnt illegal anymore
Reply 34
Original post by tazzron
The defects argument for incest can't really be compared to genetically defective people having kids because the latter have no control over the potential disability of their children whereas incest couples have a choice of not being together or not having unprotected sex.


Don't genetically defective people have a choice of not having unprotected sex, too?
Hypothetical question: do you reckon those who practise incest have any sexual attraction towards each other?

Posted from TSR Mobile
Reply 36
Original post by Secretnerd123
My thoughts? Eugh thats plain disgusting and i dont know why it isnt illegal anymore


It is illegal in the UK.

Which is wrong considering homosexuality is celebrated.
Original post by sneha.vag
Hypothetical question: do you reckon those who practise incest have any sexual attraction towards each other?

Posted from TSR Mobile


Yes, especially cousins.
Reply 38
Original post by tazzron
The defects argument for incest can't really be compared to genetically defective people having kids because the latter have no control over the potential disability of their children whereas incest couples have a choice of not being together or not having unprotected sex.

But yes, the reasons are the same for disagreeing with incest as they were with homosexuality throughout history. I see nothing wrong with two consenting adults in an incestuous relationship as long as they use protection. People using the "It's disgusting therefore wrong" argument are, for want of a better word, moronic. There really is no logical argument against incest if the scenario I mentioned is applied.


Are you saying genetically defective people have no choice of having protected sex?

Why should we insist on people practicing incest refrain from procreating but then allow genetically defective people to procreate?
Reply 39
Committing Incest isn't just socially repulsive. If they have kids (God forbid!) It will create a small gene pool which may cause Genetic mutation.

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